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  1. #21
    theotherserge's Avatar
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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    oh yes, color tv is part of the reason for red or blue kurtkas (SAMBO jacket)

    I both understand and am very confused by the revisionism/rehab of ma history in Russia.

    (btw, it wasn't the USSR in '94-but that's a persnickety detail :))

  2. #22

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Looks like almost every middle school fight by untrained kids that I have ever seen.

  3. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by theotherserge
    I both understand and am very confused by the revisionism/rehab of ma history in Russia.
    I think it makes sense given the "Bring back the greateness of mother Russia" movement that was going on at the time.

    Quote Originally Posted by theotherserge
    (btw, it wasn't the USSR in '94-but that's a persnickety detail :))
    Exactly! By 1994 they had access to western technology.

  4. #24
    theotherserge's Avatar
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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    probably we'll next see some recovered footage of Cossacks on horseback LOL

    The fights are unimpressive brawls, the theory behind whip-strikes makes perfect sense and I've worked on that material with my Sambo teacher and with systemaistsisis guys. However, a loose whipstrike to the top of someones skull is a good way to break your hand.

    I know of EricH and I'm not a systema troll at all, but I'm not clear on why he posted this crap-fest thinking it would help make a case for continuity and effectiveness in Systema.

    ??!?!?..etc

  5. #25
    DdlR's Avatar
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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by MaverickZ
    I think it makes sense given the "Bring back the greateness of mother Russia" movement that was going on at the time.
    Agreed. There seems to have been a major trend towards romanticizing pre-Communist Russian culture (religion, arts, etc.) after the fall of the USSR. It makes sense that this sentiment would have eventually extended into martial arts as well; it's just unfortunate that this basically involved inventing history, which makes the real history much harder to figure out.

    FWIW many references I can find to "storm fighting" online (in English and by automatic translation) seem to link it to the Russian white power movement.

  6. #26
    theotherserge's Avatar
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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    ^yeah, sort of like how some Kajukenbo dudes are outright Aryan Brotherhood wackjobs...

  7. #27
    SFGOON's Avatar
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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by theotherserge
    I know of EricH and I'm not a systema troll at all, but I'm not clear on why he posted this crap-fest thinking it would help make a case for continuity and effectiveness in Systema.
    Eric's one of my teachers. What he's trying to draw your attention to is that they're moving without a lot of tension. This isn't an endorsement of that fighting methodogy, just a Russian cultural tidbit.

    Aside from the relaxed movement, this video is almost, but not quite, entirely unlike systema.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cullion
    You sound like a foaming-at-the-mouth-loon out of Dr. Strangelove.
    Sometimes, we put Ricin in the Cocaine. :ninja7:

  8. #28
    theotherserge's Avatar
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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    that makes much more sense.

  9. #29

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    yep - thanks for clarifying SF

    The lack of tension and the lack of chambering punches is seen in systema and other examples of RMA that I have seen. In fact, right or wrong, I think of this as typical of native russian striking styles. My only point was that here appears to be a link between systema and native styles. I am not making any argument for effectiveness, just highlighting a possible connection.

    That said, I also happen to think that there is some pretty good **** on that vid. One of my RMA teachers, and older russian who also happened to be an accomplished boxer, exhibited/taught this type of movement and I am quite familiar with its effects. He can make it work.

    The quality of the guys in this vid varies greatly but some of them are damn good.
    On these good guys you can see how the relaxation of the shoulder girdle, torso, and pelvis lead to very nice integration of the legs and very smooth/efficient speed and power. On others you see just windmilling and brawling...


    keep in mind that this is competition vid so some of the action is likely driven by rules.
    Last edited by EricH; 6/04/2008 8:51pm at .

  10. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by theotherserge
    probably we'll next see some recovered footage of Cossacks on horseback LOL
    for cossacks on horseback see the Discovery channel's episode on russian martial arts....

    no really.

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