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  1. mikitta is offline

    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    West Virginia
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    8

    Posted On:
    5/16/2008 11:54pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Karate

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    A question about Chi Do Kwan/Jidokwan

    (reposting this question from my introduction thread in Newbieton)


    Years ago (like in the last ice age) I studied Shotokahn in Laramie Wyo. for a few months. I wish I had had the dough to continue with the class, but I was a poor, starving college student and there was only so much starvation I was willing to endure.

    In February this year, I got back into the martial arts with my kids when we started classes in Chi Do Kwan, which is closely related to Shotokahn if my research can be trusted.

    I have a question, if anyone might know the answer to it ....

    In researching about Chi Do Kwan on the net, I came across the information about Tae Kwon Do and the various Korean Kwans that gave it birth in it's modern form. I've seen both Chi Do Kwan and Jidokwan mentioned and would like to know if these were two different schools or if Chi Do Kwan is simply a romanization of Jidokwan? I'm inclined to believe the latter, though from some of the articles, the former case is implied.

    If anyone knows which is the case, I would be interested in hearing about it.

    Thank you in advance for any info you have :)

    God Bless,
    mik
  2. retrograde is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    268

    Posted On:
    5/21/2008 10:02am


     Style: Muay Thai

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I've never seen it spelled like that, but it's entirely possible. It's also entirely possible that some one just thought that sounded like a good name for a taekwondo school/style.

    Does your club call the school or the style 'chi do kwan'? I know plenty of clubs that use the name Jidokwan in various ways, but they just teach WTF/Kukkiwon taekwondo, essentially. Some may trace their lineage back to a Jidokwan instructor, but their style is often indistinguishable from the school down the road that can trace its lineage back to the Moodukkwan or Chungdokwan.

    The Jidokwan itself hasn't really existed in any meaningful way for a long time. It split apart when the Korean Taekwondo Association was formed, with part joining them and adopting the name 'taekwondo' and the other part joining the Korean Subakdo or Tae Soo Do or some other organisation. These days, I think it's generally derivatives from the latter group who are more likely to use the name 'Jidokwan' to refer to a style, whereas those in the former group may call their school Uncle Joe's Strip Mall Jidokwan Taekwondo, but as I said, they're teaching WTF style stuff.

    As for the Shotokan thing, I only know what I've read. Sang Sup Chun, who started the Jidokwan's predecessor, the Yun Moo Kwan, studied Shotokan, I think. Yun Kwei Byung who took over after he went missing in the war and renamed the school Jidokwan studied Shito-Ryu and Shudokan. The other main instructor, Chong Woo Lee, studied Shotokan, I think.

    So, yes, it's probably fair to say it's a Shotokan derived style. Most of the kwans were. Even though Yun Kwei Byung had a different background, he was there while Sang Sup Chun was still alive, so presumably he had to conform to his style. I know next to nothing about the different styles of karate, but some Google-fu indicates that these three styles at least practise a lot of the same forms, including the heian and bassai forms, which is pretty much what a most tang soo do schools still teach, I think.

    Anyway, I can't really give you a definitive answer. Either you're studying something resembling 1950s/early 60s Jidokwan taekwondo/tang soo do, which is probably pretty similar to Shotokan and may call itself 'Jidokwan Taekwondo', 'Jidokwan Tang Soo Do' or even just 'Jidokwan'; or you're studying WTF/Kukkiwon taekwondo at a school that probably traces its lineage back to the Jidokwan or just liked the name and chose to make it part of the club name, but would just call its style 'taekwondo'; or you're studying some made up style
    and the founder/instrcutor inadvertantly picked a name that was phonetically similar - but completely unrelated - to one of the original Korean kwans.

    You could just ask your instructor.
  3. mikitta is offline

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    Feb 2008
    Location
    West Virginia
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    Posted On:
    5/21/2008 5:07pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Karate

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I talked to my instructor last evening. The guy who started our school, Clarksburg Karate Academy, is my instructor's instructor and a 6th degree BB. He studied Chi Do Kwan through a BB student of Ernest H. Leib, who started American Karate System. Chi Do Kwan isn't the same as Jidokwan - they were different schools in Korea.

    http://www.americankaratesystem.org/history.html

    That link discusses Ernest Leib's story.

    Our school is not formally associated with AKS, though that is where we can trace our roots. My instructor is a member of the AKA, though.

    God Bless,
    mik
  4. ToUnderstand is offline

    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Jacksonville,Fl
    Posts
    177

    Posted On:
    5/21/2008 5:49pm


     Style: TaeKwonDo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Korean spelling please?
    i take it is identical to Jidokwan except instead of Jee uht you replaces it with chee uht?
  5. mikitta is offline

    Join Date
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    Location
    West Virginia
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    Posted On:
    5/21/2008 7:46pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Karate

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    That I have no idea about. I'll email the AKS and get their info on that. I had emailed someone from a Jidokwan group who also said that there was Jidokwan AND Chidokwan in Korea in the '40's prior to the kwans being combined into Tae Kwon Do.

    God Bless,
    mik
  6. retrograde is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Jul 2007
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    268

    Posted On:
    5/21/2008 8:04pm


     Style: Muay Thai

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    The Jidokwan didn't start referring to itself as such until the '50s. The Jidokwan themselves say it's a misconception that it was a separate school, although that doesn't mean it's not true.

    Still, it sounds more likely that he trained at a Jidokwan branch and got confused by the Romanization. Thisis supposed to be him with his instructor, Mr Kim.
  7. mikitta is offline

    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    West Virginia
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    8

    Posted On:
    5/21/2008 8:43pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Karate

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I am sure you are right. My instructor talked about Chung,Sang Sup as the founder of the style we practice.

    We also talked about how political karate seems to get when you try to get associations started and people go splitting off in all directions after a time. Names start looking different though the style is so similar as to be essentially the same.

    After all is said and done, it really has no relevance to my wanting to study where I do. I have a great deal of respect for my instructors and I see their dedication to teaching karate to the best of their ability and with all their integrity. They do a very good job of it, in my opinion :)

    God Bless,
    mik
  8. hoodedmonk is offline
    hoodedmonk's Avatar

    Senior Member

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    Location
    Carson WA.
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    Posted On:
    10/04/2008 12:29am


     Style: Bjj

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    http://www.academyoftkd.com/
    found this school about 40 min. from my house. I'm going to go watch a class on Tuesday. The instructor's name is Victor, Does anybody have any info on him? He seemed like a pretty cool guy on the phone. He said they are not affiliated with Itf or Wtf He says he teaches Old school jidokwan Karate. He told me it strongly resembles Shotokan and they do not neglect their hands.
  9. DerAuslander is offline
    DerAuslander's Avatar

    Valiant Monk of Booze & War

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    Sep 2005
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    Baltimore, MD
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    18,451

    Posted On:
    10/05/2008 12:33pm

    supporting memberstaff
     Style: BJJ/C-JKD/KAAALIII!!!!!!!

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    It's Jidogwan, not Chi Do Kwan. Chi Do Kwan would be spelled completely different in Korean.
  10. hoodedmonk is offline
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    Senior Member

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    Posted On:
    10/05/2008 1:44pm


     Style: Bjj

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by DerAuslander108
    It's Jidogwan, not Chi Do Kwan. Chi Do Kwan would be spelled completely different in Korean.
    I cant spell in English WTF makes you thin my Korean would be any better? Now how about some info that would be useful.
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