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  1. DerAuslander is offline
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    Valiant Monk of Booze & War

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    Posted On:
    4/11/2008 10:47am

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     Style: BJJ/C-JKD/KAAALIII!!!!!!!

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Keeping your hands up would do next to nothing against that kick.
  2. Beezer is offline
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    Posted On:
    4/11/2008 11:01am


     Style: judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Errant108
    Keeping your hands up would do next to nothing against that kick.
    I don't know about that, if his hands were up, it might have lessen the blow. Errant108, you do know a great deal about this subject, but, to me, keeping your hands down is never a good thing. Still a great kick.
  3. DerAuslander is offline
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    Posted On:
    4/11/2008 11:31am

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     Style: BJJ/C-JKD/KAAALIII!!!!!!!

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Lessened the blow?

    To a degree, yes.

    However, keep in mind that this kick was timed and used against an opponent who was rushing forward, not against a covering defender.
    Given the angle of the kick, it is likely it would have gone right between the kid's arms, and impacted with the same force.

    Had the kid seen the kick coming (which he obviously didn't), he could have covered, which probably would have prevented the whip lash, but it probably would have still ktfod him, as that direct shot would have just knocked through the guard.
  4. BFGalbraith is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/11/2008 2:58pm


     Style: Tai Chi,BJJ,knife-dueling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    More to TKD than point fighting?

    Quote Originally Posted by It is Fake
    Post more than one "hard to find video" that proves your point.

    That is why I posted half your quote. You are saying OMG look what Bill Wallace did to TKD. Then you search and find ONE video that proves your point.


    You have yet to prove this is from his system. One website and one "hard to find" video do not prove your point.
    Sorry fail.
    On your second point, when I say "Bill Wallace" I don't mean him as the individual traveling back in time, traveling to Korea, and become the secret grand master of TKD. What I mean is the whole movement of point-sparring mediocrity in martial arts that was going on in the 70's which seems to have impacted TKD, and for which Bill Wallace and Joe Lewis were the main "champions" of at least in USA culture. By mediocrity, I mean that TKD video I keep referencing.

    To your first point: I said "harder to find than I thought" meaning I thought 100% of all TKD was like this. When ever I run into TKD competition in person I see these TKD guys shadow boxing by standing on one leg kicking with the other for a while, then switching legs and doing the same thing on the other side. Then they spar like that in competition.

    So here's more examples that were relatively easy to find:

    http://ca.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AN9VKwTR0fU

    http://ca.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZDC6w4nSyaM

    http://ca.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=39lYAFAAGTU

    http://ca.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eicelLO2cuw

    I didn't say "and that's all there is to TKD, there are no other TKD strategies," I said "the main place to go to learn Wallace's technique full contact is TKD," and that "TKD rulesets generally encourage this kind of behavior by not allowing a very important subset of kicking: leg kicks."
  5. Kintanon is offline
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    Yes, I am smarter than you are.

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    Posted On:
    4/11/2008 3:12pm

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     Style: TKD, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I think the only TKD sparring ruleset that encourages that is ATA style sparring. In the ITF you can face punch, and it's continuous, so you can bull rush through the leg and deliver many many face punches. The WTF is also continues and requires that the kick have some force behind it, so again you smash the **** out of flamingo fighters.
    Stop-Point sparring is where being a Flamingo fighter can win you some ****. One tappy-tap to the head and your opponent has to go back and start over. GOAL!
  6. Shu2jack is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/15/2008 9:43am


     Style: AMAI TKD

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I am an ATA student of 15 years. While it is used from time to time, it is a stupid thing to do....even in ATA sparring and it is easy to get around. Heck, even "bull-rushing" works if you time it right. Draw a kick, move in when they go back to the rechamber, and start hitting them in the chest/arms with forward momentum until you score a pointn or knock them on their ass.

    If nothing else, move to the other side of the ring and wait. They can hop around all day after you as you move around the ring. Eventually they get tired and you nail them because the "flamingo" is all they have generally.

    [Editj]

    Back on topic, besides sounding old & bitter, some of Wallace's comments made him sound to be a bit sexist. One of his points against MMA is that he doesn't want to see our women getting "uglied" up. Seems women still need men around to protect them from their decisions.
    Last edited by Shu2jack; 4/15/2008 9:47am at .
  7. DerAuslander is offline
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    Posted On:
    4/15/2008 9:48am

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     Style: BJJ/C-JKD/KAAALIII!!!!!!!

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    BF, your argument has changed at least 3 times now.

    What exactly is your point?
  8. Vieux Normand is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/15/2008 3:02pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: 血鷲

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Errant108
    Lessened the blow?

    To a degree, yes.

    However, keep in mind that this kick was timed and used against an opponent who was rushing forward, not against a covering defender.
    Given the angle of the kick, it is likely it would have gone right between the kid's arms, and impacted with the same force.

    Had the kid seen the kick coming (which he obviously didn't), he could have covered, which probably would have prevented the whip lash, but it probably would have still ktfod him, as that direct shot would have just knocked through the guard.
    Rushing forward?

    All I saw, just before the spin-kick KO, was the target skip-sliding in leg-first, with the head up back and the hands so low they were almost off-camera--all of it in slow-motion...and that was BEFORE they showed the slo-mo replay. A full-speed rush does not resemble that in the least and, had one been applied, it would have resulted in the spin-kicker getting face-planted into the floor with the rusher on top, not far from rear-mounting position if the latter so chose.
  9. DerAuslander is offline
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    Posted On:
    4/15/2008 3:09pm

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     Style: BJJ/C-JKD/KAAALIII!!!!!!!

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    um. No.

    A full speed rush against a timed back kick gets you KTFOed. Time & again. That video is one of about 20 of that same kid doing it to countless opponents, timed perfectly to their incoming motion. I used that tactic all the time in Olympic-style. & was still able to pull it off when I switched to Gyeoktugi & Jun Fan Kickboxing. If that doesn't work for you, how about GSP pulling it off perfectly against a rushing opponent & droppping him?

    That's what that kick is used for.
  10. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    4/15/2008 3:14pm

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     Style: xingyi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Errant108
    BF, your argument has changed at least 3 times now.

    What exactly is your point?
    Actually four times. There is a thread in KMA forums that is as a direct offshoot to this one.
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