Stand and Deliver, Bitch
Posted On:11/16/2003 11:43pm
Style: Whatever Works
johnny..your profile says you didsome training in goju ryu. Tell me..what was yor experience with that?
~Whatever Happens, Happens.~
~From this moment on, I shall be known as "He Who Smokes Bitches"~
Posted On:11/16/2003 11:55pm
Originally posted by HAPKO3
On one hand, the "discussion" started out with TigerFly clearly in the wrong - afterall, she did call Mr. Thornton an idiot and a fraud without any sort of provocation on his part. And she did backpeddle out of some of her claims when he came on the board to defend himself.
First things First :
When he DID come to Defend himself , he wasnt a Saint , not that he had any Reason to be , TF went at himm pretty Hard . I just dont like the Idea (not That I remember YOU saying this Hapko3 - it just gets Thrown about a lot) That the guy was all Angelic . He had an Insult or two in HIS Pocket as well .
Now for the Meat :
When someone puts themselves in the "Public Eye" they put themselves open for Pseudo-Personal Criticism based upon their Professional/Public Behaviour . There are PLENTY of people out there calling Pauley Shore an Idiot , right along with Jim Varney (Of the "Earnest" Movies fame) Closer to Home , there are PLENTY of ppl calling a certain MMA Pro an Idiot for DBZX Fireball Antics after winning Matches . Does it mean that they guy cant Fight ? No Does it mean hes an Idiot ? Ill let you be the Judge .
Basically , She felt that his ad campaign showed him to be an Idiot . Is she Wrong ? If she IS I have yet heard no argument about it at all . The PRESUMPTION seems to be that JUST because he can (Perhaps) FIGHT that anything that he says/does oitherwise cant make him an Idiot , or allow her to think of him as one . That somehow his Qualifications as a Martial Artist put him above Reproach as a Person , or in any other Respect . Someone having a Respectable Resume as a Martial Artist does NOT mean that they are Respectable in all ways , and saying that is NOT any more "Wrong" than all the Dozens of times that someone has called Steven Segal (or whomewver) an Idiot on this Site .
Posted On:11/17/2003 12:00am
Style: Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu
I loved Okinawan Goju. My instructor - in fact all the instructors - was a good fighter. We worked together as bouncers, so the classes were all structured around fighting (I never trained with any other Goju schools so I'm not sure if this assocation was different from others). I ended up leaving after I saw Shootfighting and BJJ, but still remain friends with the Goju people - who also were quite taken with Shootifighting and BJJ. In fact, my Goju instructor ended up getting his blue belt in BJJ years later.
Okinawan Goju-Ryu is the single best traditional martial art I've ever seen, and I'd recommend it to anyone interested in learning self-defence.
Such as thou art, sometime was I.
Posted On:11/17/2003 12:07am
Style: Brazilian Jiujitsu
How the hell do you prove someone is or is not an idiot based on an ad campaign? I guess if it didn't attract students that would go some distance towards proving that. I think that not trying to fight anyone over being called an idiot would demonstrate non-idiotness.
Normally, I'd say I was grappling, but I was taking down and mounting people, and JFS has kindly informed us that takedowns and being mounted are neither grappling nor anti grappling, so I'm not sure what the **** I was doing. Maybe schroedinger's sparring, where it's neither grappling nor anti-grappling until somoene observes it and collapses the waveform, and then I RNC a cat to death.----fatherdog
Posted On:11/17/2003 12:08am
yeah...My girlfriend a goju sytlist and after going at it with her for 45 min (and we go hard, no tip tap) I was very impressed. She's mixed in boxing, capoira and either JJJ or bjj for groundwork so she well rounded. I've been jkd since early teens but always wanted that one base art that I can feel good about. While I like groundwork, I'm still a primary striker (60-40) and the way she goes on about it, I'm deeply considering checking it out.
With its emaphis on hard soft, I should be able to fit it in nicely with my fighting. So you think it would be a good art to train in?
Posted On:11/17/2003 12:09am
Djimbe, the problem is, she has no basis to call him an idiot or a fraud. She'd watched one short video and came on to this forum and bagged the guy for no reason. Matt makes no outrageous claims, so why the personal attacks?
Then she bags his seminar, calls it boring, calls him a bad teacher. Sure, it may be her opinion, but I'll trust other people's opinions who I know who think that Matt teaches a great seminar.
TigerFly has no credibility, and Matt Thornton has plenty. The only person who looks bad out of all this is her.
By the way, I've never spoken to Matt Thornton, but have had a friend attend his seminars and have read his posts - so I'm in no way associated with him.
Posted On:11/17/2003 12:12am
It depends on what you want out of it. As a fighting art, i.e. you want to fight in the ring - then it's got limitations. However as a martial art and a self-defence system it's great and I couldn't recommend it highly enough.
Posted On:11/17/2003 12:13am
Then its too bad that his Immediate Response was to go to that Threatening Place with the whole "You Wouldnt Say That To My Face" crap .
Posted On:11/17/2003 12:19am
Style: 10th Planet JJ
Djimbe : As I said in my post, his behaviour, as described by the two of you, is in fact reproachable. He can have as many blackbelts in all sorts of different styles, and it would not make any difference whatsoever. However, this behaviour is also understandable. I can be a pretty abrasive person, especially when someone calls me an idiot behind my back. I may very well regret being an asshole later, but had I read that king of a post about my person, I could have gotten angry. Chances are, I would laugh about it, but it could go either way depending on my mood.
Furthermore, it is obvious that, regardless of whether or not he's an asshole, Mr. Thronton is neither an idiot nor a fraud. I firmly believe that the personal attack that started this ordeal was entierly unjustified. Period. Therefore, I can understand his anger.
I am not making excuses for a man that I have never met. I am merely trying to place myself in his shoes. There is not good reason to call Mr Thronton and idiot, or even moreso a fraud, which is a very loaded term. TigerFly was wrong.
Once again, I would like to hear the other side of the story before I draw any conclusions.
On a somewhat related note, how was your expereince training with a BJJ Brown belt? I am particularly interested in the Quin Na applications you've mentioned in another therad.
You say what about my rice?
Posted On:11/17/2003 12:21am
not too worrying about the ring..thai training, boxing and grappling I know have done me just fine in competion. self defense and inner growth is something I pursue. that what I need. Self defence and personal growth growth first, sport second.
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