Looking for ex Jung SuWon / Tae Yun Kim students (Part 3)

**Kathy Kim** · Posted On: 7/15/2010 4:55pm

Same thing with her picture of Barbara Bush. She had us buy seats at a couple of tables at a luncheon in SF, so that made her a VIP because she had purchased the tables. Then there was a picture taking opportunity in the back. tyk got her picture taken with Mrs Bush. If fact, so did I. So there was no honor there. Just a photo opportunity. There was no conversation, no words of wisdom, just a photo oppurtunity.

**AiTouch** · Posted On: 7/15/2010 5:47pm

The presence of a title actually means nothing. I am the greatest Grandmaster of my own style: "Pet Kat Do". I only have one student... my apprentice: Sweetums. She and I work out a few hours every day. Just like the Sith there is only one master and one apprentice. Can you dispute that I am legit?

If you read the website(which seems completely legit) it states she's a grandmaster of Tae kwon do. That's the title I was referring to, not her title as grandmaster of Ju Suwon.

**Shadow Dancer** · Posted On: 7/15/2010 6:20pm

Originally Posted by AiTouch

If you read the website(which seems completely legit) it states she's a grandmaster of Tae kwon do. That's the title I was referring to, not her title as grandmaster of Ju Suwon.

Kim cannot produce any credentials beyond having tested for 3rd Dan in Tang Soo Do. She is free to call herself a GM in any art that is original to her. Where does the TKD fit in? Her early training stories bounce between having been taught by her uncles and some traveling monk in the mountains.

She also claims to be a CEO. Actually, that is true... LWS gave her the title. But, she knows practically nothing about the technology, can't even understand a balance sheet, and takes pride in her computer illiteracy.

One needs to consider how she acquired her titles and honors in order to decide if her claims have any validity.

Feel free to buy into her BS.

**AiTouch** · Posted On: 7/15/2010 8:17pm

Originally Posted by Shadow Dancer

Kim cannot produce any credentials beyond having tested for 3rd Dan in Tang Soo Do.
Feel free to buy into her BS.

So I'm naive for buying what it says in the Tae kwon do hall of fame and other places instead of what is to me is sounding like some sort of strange conspiracy theory. I have heard her talked about by legitimate masters as a grandmaster in Tae kwon do and she is acknowledged as such by the ITF. You have not said anything so far which I have seen verified, and seem to be suggesting that the ITF gives out the title of Grandmaster solely for political purposes which sounds pretty sketchy to me. I don't think the ITF just hands out the title of Grandmaster and I don't see where you're coming from calling that BS.

Do you really think an internet forum is better suited to determine if someone is a legitimate Grnadmaster than an international martial arts federation? You need to get real and know that to an outsider like myself the ITF has way more credibility in determining. Now whether she abuses her students I'm still undecided.

**Failed Student** · Posted On: 7/15/2010 8:41pm

Originally Posted by AiTouch

So I'm naive for buying what it says in the Tae kwon do hall of fame and other places instead of what is to me is sounding like some sort of strange conspiracy theory. I have heard her talked about by legitimate masters as a grandmaster in Tae kwon do and she is acknowledged as such by the ITF. You have not said anything so far which I have seen verified, and seem to be suggesting that the ITF gives out the title of Grandmaster solely for political purposes which sounds pretty sketchy to me. I don't think the ITF just hands out the title of Grandmaster and I don't see where you're coming from calling that BS.

Do you really think an internet forum is better suited to determine if someone is a legitimate Grnadmaster than an international martial arts federation? You need to get real and know that to an outsider like myself the ITF has way more credibility in determining. Now whether she abuses her students I'm still undecided.

Having trained with Tae Yun Kim when she was known as Kyong Ae Fontaine in Vermont way back in the eighties, I can only direct you to my many posts if you have doubts as to her abuse of students. As I stated in one of my first posts, everything I write here I will attest to under oath in a court of law, should that be necessary.

In the three years I trained with her, she went from her stated fifth dan to grandmaster status without testing, and that occurred about the time she broke from her brother and started her own school - ATC. I never saw any certificates showing any rank.

TYK told me that "if the Creater made her a man, she would rule the world". I leave it to you to be the judge of such a comment.

AiTouch, until you experience for yourself what many others have endured at the hands of TYK, you cannot blatantly dismiss these posts as fabrications. Then again, I wouldn't suggest that.

**Shadow Dancer** · Posted On: 7/15/2010 8:50pm

Originally Posted by AiTouch

So I'm naive for buying what it says in the Tae kwon do hall of fame and other places instead of what is to me is sounding like some sort of strange conspiracy theory. I have heard her talked about by legitimate masters as a grandmaster in Tae kwon do and she is acknowledged as such by the ITF. You have not said anything so far which I have seen verified, and seem to be suggesting that the ITF gives out the title of Grandmaster solely for political purposes which sounds pretty sketchy to me. I don't think the ITF just hands out the title of Grandmaster and I don't see where you're coming from calling that BS.

Do you really think an internet forum is better suited to determine if someone is a legitimate Grnadmaster than an international martial arts federation? You need to get real and know that to an outsider like myself the ITF has way more credibility in determining. Now whether she abuses her students I'm still undecided.

If you don't understand the concepts of money and purchasing titles, then yes... you are naive. I was there, I was one of those who helped her purchase her honors and political influence. So... if you are dazzled by a title... then good for you. You are exactly the person she is looking for. You haven't been able to explain how she got where she is. She is only 'officially' credentialed up to 3rd dan in Tang Soo Do. How that gets her to grandmaster in Tae Kwon Do has never been explained other than cronyism and political favors. Why don't you back up your awe of her position with actual verifiable credentials instead of a bestowed title. She has enough of those and very few legitimate ones. I was there. Where were you?

**Kathy Kim** · Posted On: 7/15/2010 11:44pm

Most of us on here know each other. We were all part of her cult at one time. Some of us at the same time, some at different periods. If this sounds like some place you would like to train, then by all means go. Some people have to experience it themselves. We experienced it, and we know the truth. I wish you well on your journey. Hold on to what you believe in.

**Failed Student** · Posted On: 7/16/2010 8:57am

Originally Posted by Kathy Kim

Most of us on here know each other. We were all part of her cult at one time. Some of us at the same time, some at different periods. If this sounds like some place you would like to train, then by all means go. Some people have to experience it themselves. We experienced it, and we know the truth. I wish you well on your journey. Hold on to what you believe in.

And hold on to your checkbook too AiTouch, because TYK is all about money. Her choice of victim either has money or the ability to make money, and is gullible enough to believe the bs she spouts. So it's up to you if you want to take a chance with your future.
Good luck!

**AiTouch** · Posted On: 7/16/2010 3:27pm

Just to back track I said

Now whether she abuses her students I'm still undecided.

and you responded

you cannot blatantly dismiss these posts as fabrications.

I was listening to your posts leaning on the side of believing they were legitimate but I'm clearly not now. I'll admit you had me going with

I was looking up churches and one that I found was instructing it's members to always allow visitors to express doubts, concerns and have questions regarding faith and religion. When I came here and expressed doubts as to her credentials being nonexistant based on what I had seen I was immediately labeled a naive idiot who buys into everything TYK says and is in total awe of her accomplishments(lol). I took your claims legitimately when I found you on a google search and decided to post, but it's obvious by your response you just want to group bash her and not have a discussion of her which would include things like doubts or looking into credentials.

I'll agree that she seems very cult like, but you're not at all better, only people that believe the same things about TYK are accepted by you and those who have doubts are outcasted are naive and illogical and stupid. Do you really think people are going to take your claims seriously when all you seem to care about is trashing her?(made despicable by the fact that you are pretending to be healing and warning others when this is just a calculated strike against her character). I'm sorry that I wasted my time here on what are clearly unverifiable(and honestly, clearly exaggerated) claims by an angry group reduced to speaking on an internet forum(acting all afraid to speak out which is pathetic). She may very well abuse her students, but it's impossible to tell by the crap you try peddling here.
I won't waste my time reading your responses about how only people that see the light and open their eyes and accept the truth the TYK is this evil person can truly join in your group and have the privilege of acceptance on this forum, and how I'm just blown away by the title of grandmaster(I'v trained under three founders) and can't see the truth of her past her shining accomplishments and unbelievable charisma. What a joke you people are.

**carson** · Posted On: 7/16/2010 4:10pm

AiTouch - please don't judge all of us on this forum based on one or two people's comments, which may have been written out of anger or frustration at the time. There are 20+ of us who have been posting here.
Most of us have no desire to convert anyone to our beliefs. We only want to warn and be a resource for those who are in TYKs circle, if they start to wonder or doubt. If this forum had been around while I was inside, I would have gotten out much sooner. Instead, since we are all told not to speak with each other, and through the system of journaling directly to TYK, anyone who mentions any doubt is immediately reported and publicly humiliated and punished, I had no source of information other than TYK.
I'm sorry that you feel you were put upon in any way in this forum.