Posted On:12/13/2003 5:18pm
-"found in the angry freighted geeks that fill up most martial arts schools."
Regarding this statement, I would like to think that MOST instructors attempt to either change or weed these attributes out of their students. Where I come from I just don't see angry, frightened martial artists going around, they are NEARLY all very well tempered, mannered and humble. But, I'm afraid that one bad apple can spoil the perceptions of the whole, which I may have done in my recent posts in this thread. I apologize if I came across as arrogant and I thank you for your views.
Points well taken.
No apology necessary. I don't think there are a lot of problem martial artists out there, just pointing out how to an outsider the behavior of both bodybuilders and martial artists can seem inexplicable. What's important is how they conduct themselves and that their behavior not negatively impact those around them.
Posted On:12/13/2003 5:43pm
Being a personal trainer at a gym I can tell you form first hand observations that the steroid users do have a probem with aggression. I've seen first hand how any little thing can set them off. Look if you really want to use roids then its your choice. Yes, they will make you look big, but you really won't be any stronger. Just take a look around at any steroid users, and watch the weight that they are actually lifting. I think you'll be surprised at how your lifting just as much or even more weight then them. As far as health risks go, just take a look at all the pro wrestlers that have died in their 40's and 50's.
"You can't out run death forever, but you can make the bastard work for it"
Posted On:12/13/2003 5:44pm
Originally posted by Edge
The extremely violent behavior may be useful during competition
If you check the steroid forums specific to MMA athletes who juice one off the more interesting things is the pre-competition use of drugs like cheque drops etc. which have no use BUT aggression. The line between using steroids for a physical edge and a mental edge is interesting (even though it is cheating either way). When I did BJJ I had a great deal of trouble remembering all the moves we were taught so dabbled with nootropics (with mixed results).
I think it is important for the natural athlete to know what they are up against. Remember in the early days of the UFC it was very common for Brazilian athletes to be on Anavar (which is very easy to come by in Brazil) but since in gives only pure (and considerable) strength with little or no bulk they were spared a lot of the criticism their American "juicer" counterparts got.
The use of steroids outside of bodybuilding competition is tricky. I do not compete and would not be ethically comfortable competing against athletes I knew to be natural. The problem is that it is very very hard to test for steroids and the same sort of personalities that are driven to train the hardest and do anything to win are willing to do...well anything to win. With many there is no "off" switch, you can't really tell them "anything but that".
A juiced competitor has a huge number of advantages over his natural counterpart. He can train more hours a day, he recovers from even severe tendon and legitimate injuries in a fraction the time, in MMA the higher your strength to weight ratio the more techniques are open to you (although if you lose flexablity some are then closed). If you are taking the pure strength drugs the advantage is very significant. It is very hard to tell a talented athlete "no you can't juice" when you cannot guarantee him that a less talented athlete will not be able to make it by screening and compete against him juiced. I honestly think most athletes do not use steroids to get an edge over their opponent- they use it to KEEP their edge. They assume the other guy is- so they have to. Oddly enough from most I speak to they rarely consider that the other is not and they will have an edge, the feeling is often that they have to just to even the playing field. In a twisted way they feel they are doing it to keep things "fair". It's a horrible situation to have young athletes doing this to their bodies because they feel they "have to" but in the absence of reliable testing technology there are no easy answers.
Teens have no business taking steroids and if you go on any of the steroid forums they simply will not give any information to posters under 19. I know it sounds odd but if you'd like to give it a try I can give you some board addresses- say you are 17 and want to try steroids and they will not help you. Unfortunately just because older more mature bodybuilders know this it does not keep teenagers from getting access to them. They tend to only have access to a very limited number of drugs so often are unable to control side effects or retain the gains when they go off- so they stay on. This can lead to premature closing of the bone plates and stunted growth among other things. Just a very, very bad idea.
Posted On:12/13/2003 5:49pm
Originally posted by Edge
Also, have you seen this thread?:
It seems you would have some good advice on this subject.
The advice in that thread is dead on. For MA sheer pounds are not very useful but if it's important the 20 rep squat program is the classic for putting on a little overall meat.
Posted On:12/13/2003 5:58pm
Originally posted by MuayThaiBri67
Being a personal trainer at a gym I can tell you form first hand observations that the steroid users do have a probem with aggression.
I might say the same thing about Thai boxers. They see a big guy with a wrestling background and they all want to fight for some reason. I've also noticed them yelling and hitting each other a lot. Yup, my "first hand" observation is that Muay Thai causes problems with agression:-)
My point being is that it is really very subjective. You can lift weights in prison but it's hard to get juice, most of us are not inclined to get in fights. Guys try to start a fight with me I back down and buy them a drink. Got to say if I was a bad ass with the shin kicks I might be inclined to show off a bit though. Must be hard to resist?
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