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  1. khf is offline

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    Jan 2007
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    36

    Posted On:
    11/13/2008 11:51pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Taekwondo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    They try to teach the kids to do some chores at home, study in school and listen to their parents. It reinforces what parents teach. I don't see the problem with that. Most karate schools teach that, not just McDojos. You agree? You own a school. Do you teach those lessions
  2. Omega Supreme is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/13/2008 11:52pm

    staff
     Style: Chinese Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Absolutely. Now, look at what you just said versus what you said before and see if you can discern the difference.
  3. khf is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/14/2008 12:00am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Taekwondo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I am glad you teach those lessions to your students. I would be interested to know what type of Karate you teach and how it differs from my system.
  4. KiwiPhil889 is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/14/2008 12:06am


     Style: Kickboxin & Shootfightin

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Thanks for the FAQ sheet.At times a brutally honest one,re: "glorified tag". No glossing. Honest about its uses,(any exercise and activity with others away from a tv is good ),and what can be expected (as a rough guideline) from attending.
  5. atafamily is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/27/2008 3:47am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: taekwondo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    new to MA

    Hi I found this thread interesting. We have recently enrolled my 6 year old son at an ata school. He was shy would not talk to anyone to now 6 months later showing signs of confidence.

    One thing I have noticed since siging him up I found out to really learn full forms, spar and learns more weapons we had to get him into the leadership program where now it seems like they are teaching him the whole gammit.

    I am 43 ex body builder and have been thinking about taking classes with my son. I am quite novice but from what I have seen at several tournaments you get out of the ATA exactly what you put into it. I know some think point sparring is weak, however it is the way that the ata has chosen to teach. Can I learn how to defend my self with ATA, I believe yes i can, will it be to the caliber of a MMA, not so much. but to a person that has no training to come at us on the street I feel the speed and training one puts into their art will help them.

    I started doing research once i started hearing the term mcdojo. The ata school where we go has a great instructor, his instructor is 6 Dan and I have seen him workout too.

    Now for me I think the ATA will serve its purpose and my son has a great intro to martial arts. If he choses to take it further and learn other styles as he get older then we support him.

    One thing I must add is that in the world of MA resoect is important and people slamming the ata I think is rude.
  6. Omega Supreme is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/27/2008 4:03am

    staff
     Style: Chinese Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by atafamily
    Hi I found this thread interesting. We have recently enrolled my 6 year old son at an ata school. He was shy would not talk to anyone to now 6 months later showing signs of confidence.

    One thing I have noticed since siging him up I found out to really learn full forms, spar and learns more weapons we had to get him into the leadership program where now it seems like they are teaching him the whole gammit.

    I am 43 ex body builder and have been thinking about taking classes with my son. I am quite novice but from what I have seen at several tournaments you get out of the ATA exactly what you put into it. I know some think point sparring is weak, however it is the way that the ata has chosen to teach. Can I learn how to defend my self with ATA, I believe yes i can, will it be to the caliber of a MMA, not so much. but to a person that has no training to come at us on the street I feel the speed and training one puts into their art will help them.

    I started doing research once i started hearing the term mcdojo. The ata school where we go has a great instructor, his instructor is 6 Dan and I have seen him workout too.

    Now for me I think the ATA will serve its purpose and my son has a great intro to martial arts. If he choses to take it further and learn other styles as he get older then we support him.

    One thing I must add is that in the world of MA resoect is important and people slamming the ata I think is rude.
    You know you were making some good points until that last post. ATA dug their own hole years ago. They're about 1 level above the worst Mcdojo out their. Ironically one spawned the other.

    We speak frank here. It has nothing to do with rudeness. This thread was started by a ATA instructor. If you can't handle that then maybe you need to sit down and do some self-contemplation. ATA might've given your son the opportunity to gain a level of confidence lots of things will do that. I'm sincerely happy for you and him. If ATA schools look at this site and go out to improve themselves to go beyond this image they've portrayed then we've done our job.

    Are we equating 6th dan with great instructors? What have you actually compared that to? I'm a 6th degree does that make me great?

    I will slam the ATA because of what I've experienced and in the end that's all we can do. If you are happy where you are and you're getting out of it what you believe you need to that's fine. Just don't be naive about it.
  7. Teh El Macho is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/27/2008 9:22am

    supporting member
     Style: creonte on hiatus

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    ^^ Good post.

    I'd like to add the following regarding the ATA. I have two nephews, both with various degrees of autism and ADD and communication problems. All specialists were agreeing that they were bright but had problems externalizing, communicating their thoughts and on focusing.

    My sisters enrolled them on the ATA, and alas, compared them to how they were a year, two years ago, and it's like night and day. They talk without any problems now. Not only that, they are outgoing, physically active and becoming more and more agile. People who meet them now would not believe they were diagnosed with ADD or autism two years ago. So I'm grateful for that.

    However, there are things that I just cannot stomach. Every freaking month or so is a new belt, some new belt of a new color, with a grading fee and stuff. Of course, if all the 5-6 year olders are having the new belt, you have to fork the $$$ for your kid to have it as well. They are too emotionally fragile to let them stand up like a sore thumb.

    And then the equipment, first the foam helmet, then the cup, then the shin pads... for 5-6 year old kids who barely spar... all amounting for over $500, and the costs pile up and pile up and pile up.

    A lot of people enroll their kids because they have some sort of attention deficit disorder. That I've observed. And so far it works. But then there is this side that is just ugly, making expense after expense, capitalizing on the fact that parents must for the $$$ because they need their kids to be there.

    Plus last time I checked the school, they were teaching... uhm.. grappling. I saw kids being put into positions for drilling armlocks. Some of them spatic 8-10 year old kids. Some kid's elbow is going to get sore one of these days.

    To atafamily:

    There is good and there is bad with ATA. One just have to be pragmatic and use what's best from it while criticizing what's bad. You can't turn a blind eye on **** that's not right simply because it's providing a good service to someone's kids (even if they are our own).

    If you think it's rude to call things for what it is, I question your ability to be objective and fair. One cannot constantly shove questionable **** under the rug in the name of politeness or not being rude if you pretend to be a fair person. It is that type of questioning (when done fairly and objectively mind you) that leads people to improve on the things being questioned.
    Last edited by Teh El Macho; 12/27/2008 9:25am at .
    Read this for flexibility and injury prevention, this, this and this for supplementation, this on grip conditioning, and this on staph. New: On strenght standards, relationships and structural balance. Shoulder problems? Read this.

    My crapuous vlog and my blog of training, stuff and crap. NEW: Me, Mrs. Macho and our newborn baby.

    New To Weight Training? Get the StrongLifts 5x5 program and Rippetoe's "Starting Strength, 2nd Ed". Wanna build muscle/gain weight? Check this article. My review on Tactical Nutrition here.

    t-nation - Dissecting the deadlift. Anatomy and Muscle Balancing Videos.

    The street argument is retarded. BJJ is so much overkill for the street that its ridiculous. Unless you're the idiot that picks a fight with the high school wrestling team, barring knife or gun play, the opponent shouldn't make it past double leg + ground and pound - Osiris
  8. atafamily is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/27/2008 10:41am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: taekwondo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by O-Mega Tree O-Mega Tree
    You know you were making some good points until that last post. ATA dug their own hole years ago. They're about 1 level above the worst Mcdojo out their. Ironically one spawned the other.

    We speak frank here. It has nothing to do with rudeness. This thread was started by a ATA instructor. If you can't handle that then maybe you need to sit down and do some self-contemplation. ATA might've given your son the opportunity to gain a level of confidence lots of things will do that. I'm sincerely happy for you and him. If ATA schools look at this site and go out to improve themselves to go beyond this image they've portrayed then we've done our job.

    Are we equating 6th dan with great instructors? What have you actually compared that to? I'm a 6th degree does that make me great?

    I will slam the ATA because of what I've experienced and in the end that's all we can do. If you are happy where you are and you're getting out of it what you believe you need to that's fine. Just don't be naive about it.
    Thank you for your reply, it was late at night when I was writing that so rude may have been a bit harsh. I appreciate your feedback and the original post was well written. All I was saying is IMO I think the ATA has its niche, not everyone wants to get in the octagon. Are there better styles and more effective MA styles.. absolutley. Its obvious which styles have been proven effective in MMA.

    Regarding the ATA instructor thats a 6 Dan I did a lot of research on schools and instructors and this gentleman is highly respected by many aorund here.

    In my post at some point my son may decide to take his training further, this will be up to him. As for me and my wife the ATA, for now is adequate. Like I said I think this particular ATA school is a good one, some of the ones I read about I agree its very much a scam. I also feel that this school is giving us basic skills to feel confident in the event of anything happening on the street. Will we be prepared for everything? probably not but against the average person that has had no training at all we should be able to at least hold our own.

    I respect all forms of MA and the men and women that have the discpline to persue all that is right.

    Are there bad ATA schools? no doubt, are there good schools and instructors, sure.

    My reason for researching the ATA is we have committed time and money to learn this style. As a novice and not wanting to get taken advantage of I turned to the internet to research the organization. One thing I do agree strongly with is how the ATA can give 7 year olds Black Belts? I think one has to be physically able to effectively perform the moves against an adult and actually have it work.

    For now we will continue in our ATA school and as our skill level increases we will add another style to enhance what we have learned.

    Thank you for all the input I really appreciate it.

    With respect and regards -
  9. Omega Supreme is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/27/2008 3:55pm

    staff
     Style: Chinese Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by atafamily
    Thank you for your reply, it was late at night when I was writing that so rude may have been a bit harsh. I appreciate your feedback and the original post was well written. All I was saying is IMO I think the ATA has its niche, not everyone wants to get in the octagon. Are there better styles and more effective MA styles.. absolutley. Its obvious which styles have been proven effective in MMA.

    Regarding the ATA instructor thats a 6 Dan I did a lot of research on schools and instructors and this gentleman is highly respected by many aorund here.

    In my post at some point my son may decide to take his training further, this will be up to him. As for me and my wife the ATA, for now is adequate. Like I said I think this particular ATA school is a good one, some of the ones I read about I agree its very much a scam. I also feel that this school is giving us basic skills to feel confident in the event of anything happening on the street. Will we be prepared for everything? probably not but against the average person that has had no training at all we should be able to at least hold our own.

    I respect all forms of MA and the men and women that have the discpline to persue all that is right.

    Are there bad ATA schools? no doubt, are there good schools and instructors, sure.

    My reason for researching the ATA is we have committed time and money to learn this style. As a novice and not wanting to get taken advantage of I turned to the internet to research the organization. One thing I do agree strongly with is how the ATA can give 7 year olds Black Belts? I think one has to be physically able to effectively perform the moves against an adult and actually have it work.

    For now we will continue in our ATA school and as our skill level increases we will add another style to enhance what we have learned.

    Thank you for all the input I really appreciate it.

    With respect and regards -
    And this is all we can ask. Keep a realistic view on it. I didn't think you were unreasonable in your statement, if I did you would've known. Sincerely take care my friend and be proud of your son (I know that goes without saying).
  10. Shu2jack is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/30/2008 7:12am


     Style: AMAI TKD

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh El Macho
    However, there are things that I just cannot stomach. Every freaking month or so is a new belt, some new belt of a new color, with a grading fee and stuff. Of course, if all the 5-6 year olders are having the new belt, you have to fork the $$$ for your kid to have it as well. They are too emotionally fragile to let them stand up like a sore thumb.
    IMO, that is probably the biggest thing killing the ATA right now.

    The ATA wants their instructors parroting things like "be a black belt leader", or "great black belt kick", or some other "black belt" thing. Basically, the goal of the students becomes "earn a black belt" - which is a goal that is independent of what a student's initial goal for signing up may be. You do not need a black belt to lose weight, gain confidence, etc. So if you are not testing and promoting, you are not reaching your goal of being a black belt. Never mind if you have lost 10 pounds of belly fat.

    The ATA is trying to improve the quality of its students. I think the last national testing had a fail rate of over 50%. But I bet 99% of all ATA schools have a pass rate of at least 95%. It is not translating over to the majority of the student base. It is hard to break the cycle. Students are used - sometimes expect - to test every 8 weeks. Testing fees encourage school owners to test students. Instructors are making students' set the goal of a black belt, so students usually want to test as often as possible. It is just not a great system for quality control.

    But because it is the holiday season, and I am trying to be more positive, I will say that the ATA is coming out of it's shell and trying to expand it's curriculum. They are going to have a regular "Black belt only" tournament from which to try out new divisions before sending them to the general student population. Things like weapons sparring, continous sparring, punches to the head (down the road), etc. It will be interesting to see where the organization is headed.


    But, I will not be there. I left the ATA quite a few months back. Some of my family is still in the ATA, but I decided to move on.
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