The Official KMA Forum ATA Megathread

**the legslinger** · Posted On: 8/20/2006 1:23pm

wow, i don't have any experience with the ATA but they sound like ****! good job breaking free from an organization that has helped sink the reputation of MA in general.

**Ronin.74** · Posted On: 8/20/2006 1:24pm

Originally Posted by JohnnyCache

Just out of curiosity, can someone from the Bullshido Law Squad tell us if it is really possible to copyright a series of movements?

After which, could someone from the Bullshido Law Squad tell us if we can form our own Bullshido Police Force to deal with organizations like the ATA?

**Crowe** · Posted On: 8/20/2006 1:25pm

Thank you Ronin. If I came out of the experience having learned what I now know, I don't feel that any of that time was wasted. Plus I do respect what I'VE done with my rank, but not what it's coming to mean today. I do need to get into training. I have a partner back in Atlanta who trained in Choy Lay Fut kung fu in Cuba for 10 years, is certified level one Krav Maga instructor, and is currently training in Muay Thai. He was an employee with me at an ATA and we have "conspired" to open a school for the past few years. This is still my dream but requires that I find new inspiration some place, so I'll be sure to keep looking.

Trubble - It's interesting, there was talk of instituting a Kukkiwon equivalence course and offering Olympic training for those interested, but I'm not sure what happened to that. There was an Olympic coach who was invited as a special guest instructor at my certification camp in 1998 (the last of its kind). He and the Masters ran through the halls of our bunks at 3:00 in the morning for a midnight workout that lasted an hour and a half. Sigh -- those days are over.

**Ronin.74** · Posted On: 8/20/2006 1:31pm

To be on the safe side I would avoid Krav Maga as well. I don't have any experience with it personally, but it doesn't get a lot of respect around here for the same reasons that the ATA doesn't. I am sure someone else could tell you more.

**Crowe** · Posted On: 8/20/2006 1:33pm

Originally Posted by Canuckyokushin

To clarify a few things.
-The Master of your school had a quota of belt passages to make at the end of each month.Is that right?

-This woman was encouraged to continue until she got her blackbelt because your master had to make his quota?

-Did no lower ranks go up to her and suggest to her to leave if she didn't like to exercise?

I think his motivation was more the fact that she was part of a large family that was enrolled in an "advanced" program, and was playing politics. The "quota" didn't drive him with this one because he had already "no-changed" (failed) her the past 4 times she tried. The ATA states that this calls for a demotion back to red belt, but that never happens.

The quota of promotions is a requirement to advance to the higher dans, yes you're right. 100/mo for 5th degree, 250/mo for 6th degree, 500/mo for Mastership. The instructor is expected to maintain those numbers in order to keep the "yoke" (extra stripe) added to his collar. These requirements are strictly enforced for 5th degrees, but fairly loose for the higher levels.

It's interesting. A way around this is the fact that if you work full-time or operate a school FOR an instructor who meets these requirements, then you qualify for these promotions as well. This is how high ranking Masters are able to "acquire" other surrounding schools, because other instructors need to be able to meet the requirements for promotion.

**Crowe** · Posted On: 8/20/2006 1:37pm

I agree about the Krav Maga. The person I speak of attained his instructorship THROUGH the ATA, with which Krav Maga partners. Level one classes seem to be mostly aerobic, trying to train you to employ your natural reactions rather than any specific technique. I have seen a lot of knee injuries in that class thanks to untrained kickers and pad-holders. Other than that, a lot of bob and weaving under ropes and following along to Bas Rutten boxing tapes.

**Trubble** · Posted On: 8/20/2006 1:38pm

these are valuable insights that you are providing us about the ATA. thank you for that. as far as the olympic coach coming in to train those wishing to qualify for the games is interesting... doesn't ATA mainly focus on point sparring? we have a lot of implants at our dojang from ATA who during sparring don't really match up to the calibur of those who were brought up WTF... in other words, a swift roundhouse to the the trunk usually ends the match within three seconds in.

and why an "equivlience" course? shouldn't it be taught from the get go? ATA, songahm taekwondo, is a joke to me. looking at all these sites from various schools and seeing a shitload of pretween 2nd and 3rd dans makes me sick. is there any emphasis on practicality? (taekwondo, as a whole, offers little street practicality if any, however, i do believe in harnessing the power of the kicks)

**Crowe** · Posted On: 8/20/2006 1:38pm

As for the copyrighting, that's exactly what they did. They received a patent for their series of movements for their organization only. One time I had the forms and one-steps printed up on a website (as a teaching aid). I was called by a Master at ATA Headquarters and asked to take my site down as it was a copyright violation.

**Crowe** · Posted On: 8/20/2006 1:40pm

Originally Posted by Trubble

these are valuable insights that you are providing us about the ATA. thank you for that. as far as the olympic coach coming in to train those wishing to qualify for the games is interesting... doesn't ATA mainly focus on point sparring? we have a lot of implants at our dojang from ATA who during sparring don't really match up to the calibur of those who were brought up WTF... in other words, a swift roundhouse to the the trunk usually ends the match within three seconds in.

Yes, ATA point sparring does not prepare you for impact at all. Teen to 20-something black belt sparring in the ATA still impresses me. If you have the natural talent or dedication, you can make anything out of what you're given. But you're right, for the most part, ATA black belts don't know how to handle full-contact.

**prob** · Posted On: 8/20/2006 1:43pm

The Block system you mentioned sounds like a system I know as Rotating curricullum.
Ive found its a good system for organising classes but its pretty impractical for a Traditional Ladder type system that most Traditional Martial Arts use.
You realy have to create a new curricullum to run it.