2/12/2008 10:24pm, #111
Going off what Wolf was asking, has anyone ever been rejected and told "sorry, you're not good enough after three days to teach the basics of MMA. We can't certify you."?
2/12/2008 10:34pm, #112
This seems extremely distasteful and greedy to me...but it's sort of Robin Hoodish, IMO.
2/12/2008 10:37pm, #113
Okay, this is my useful, non drama whore contribution this thread: A list of Level 1 ATT certified academies, direct from ATT's own website.
Zandri's Martial Arts
Michael Brooks 203.775.7150
317 Federal Road Unit D3 Brookfield CT. 06804
ATA Black Belt Academy
Kathy Lee 501.821.8838
5501 JFK Little Rock, AR. 72116
Pak's Martial Arts Academy
Stephanie Davis 386.336.3437
4801 St. Johns Ave. Palatka, FL. 32117
Dynamic Duo Martial Arts & Fitness
Araje L'Bert 732.220.0777
84 Veronica Ave. Somerset, NJ. 08873
Jason Flame's Tang Soo Do University
Jason Flame 805-530-0000
5285 Kazuko Ct. A Moorpark, CA. 93021
Tang So Doo University
1494-A2 Madera Road
Simi Valley, Ca. 93065
Robby Beard 901.373.7338
2819 Bartlett Blvd. Bartlett, TN. 38134
Atomic Black Belt Academy
Master Mark Junday Tel#: 024 76684476
280 Foleshill Road Coventry, England, UK
Lenderman's Academy of Martial Arts
Cliff Lederman 253.531.1963
12702 Pacific Ave. S Tacoma, WA 98444
2/12/2008 11:02pm, #114Originally Posted by Wolf
Off the top of my head, I remember it was one instructor for 4 to 6 people. This is going back a bit, so I can't really be sure 100%. I think that's a great ratio, as our BJJ class is 1 per 10-15+. Our MMA, is 1 per 10, Muay Thai 1 per 20+.Originally Posted by Sifu Rudy Abel
2/13/2008 12:21am, #115
- Join Date
- Mar 2007
The spread eagle one makes a point
Originally Posted by Vince Tortelli
2/13/2008 12:42am, #116
- Join Date
- Jul 2006
There is no defense to this. Businessmen do it in businesses large and small. I think we can all agree that McDojoism has a distinct shadyness attached to it, and that if someone does it they attach it to themselves. All we have to recognise are the two faces of ATT. It doesn't matter who teaches a 3 day seminar or how intensive it is. Some people put in years of intensive work. 3 days is still 3 days and the amount of material covered, furthermore the retention of it is limited. This is blatant McDojoism, ATT itself still has a good curriculum and gym, end of story.
2/13/2008 1:43am, #117Originally Posted by Rooster
It doesn't matter who teaches a 3 day seminar or how intensive it is.
Some people put in years of intensive work.
3 days is still 3 days and the amount of material covered,
furthermore the retention of it is limited. This is blatant McDojoism, ATT itself still has a good curriculum and gym, end of story.
McDojo is a pejorative term used by some Western martial artists to describe a martial arts school where image or profit is of a higher importance than technical standards.
An individual that runs a McDojo will often have inflated or self-awarded black belt rankings or will belong to a certifying organization that cannot be traced to a known legitimate school or organization of recognized good standing. Frequently these people will be much younger than other instructors that hold similar or higher rank, and will hold rankings in a large variety of styles or arts.
It is common for such fraudulent instructors to "cross-certify" each other. Additionally, they will frequently take titles that imply very high levels of skill and several decades of experience, such as Shihan, Kyoshi, Renshi soke or grandmaster, without having been granted them by any accrediting body. Some even create their own "school" and declare themselves grandmaster of it.
Another frequent tactic is to claim to have been trained in some non-specific place by an unknown "master". Any claims of having journeyed to Asia to train with secretive monks/ninjas/fighting masters are highly questionable and can be generally assumed to be false, particularly if they claim to have learned secret arts that are superior to all other forms. Some instructors will also advertise claims that they are former members of the special forces (e.g. United States Navy SEALs), these claims are also suspect and organisations of ex-service personnel can often refute fraudulent ones.
Until this is proven, guess what you are wrong. You fail.Originally Posted by Sifu Rudy Abel
2/13/2008 3:27am, #118Originally Posted by kismasher
Originally Posted by Pandinha
Part of the curriculum is striking. TMA instructors should already know how to do this. So thats a gimme.
Of course, that goes back to all the crap TMAs get here on Bullshido. You know...chambered punches, dead training......so do they really know how to strike? (sarcasm)
It (this program) will spread MMA to the masses who dont want to be cage fighters, but do like the all around training you can get.
Yet you must agree that once I train for 3 days why the extra $350 a month? Am I getting $350 worth of videos?
Why not just buy the MMA vids that are already sold by Bas Rutten and make that my program? (for around $300 total)
Would I be condemend for doing that? Do I have to give ATT my cash just to say ,"yeah we teach MMA". Its the same thing.
I already know the basics, so all I need is a professional doing something on a video that I can watch for the rest.
Whats the difference?
How is going to a 3 day seminar then getting the rest from videos "better than just saying I do"?
Originally Posted by Pandinha
Then there is the counter to your argument that they can learn the basics in three days. Yes, they can learn the basics, but who teaches the more advanced stuff in the curriculum like...
Class 1 goes through an introduction to Basic stances, f ootwork, strikes, jabs, clinches, takedowns, and groundwork
Class 2 focuses on Pummeling integrated with what was learned in Class 1
Class 3 focuses on Kicking integrated with prior class lessons
Class 4 focuses on Takedown Techniques integrated with prior class lessons
Class 5 focuses on Blocking integrated with prior class lessons
Class 6 focuses on Setting up Takedowns integrated with prior class lessons
Class 7 focuses on Deflecting integrated with prior class lessons
Class 8 focuses on Advanced Kicks integrated with prior class lessons
There will be a total of 24 classes- but the remaining classes are still in final stages of editing/authoring- Great outlines dont exist just yet.
How are the BJJ guys feeling about this? No one is teaching them groundwork in three days, much less by DVD right?
Lets put this in context. Do you think that one can learn enough TKD to reach BB in 3 years? Most people here (MMA and BJJ people) dont. Yet I contend that the core of TKD can be taught and sufficiently learned in 3 years.
So if this (the new MMA cert program from ATT) is the new standard by which we set learning, no one ever needs to say "LOL you have a BB in TKD" on this site again.
However, this goes deeper than that doesnt it? For all the TKD/Karate/Aikido sucks months we've had, dont you think that maybe some people are rightfully LOLing at this?
I will call Mr. Beard today and see when I can come up and watch the curriculum being taught, or at least get some sense of what the curriculum is.
Anthony...you sound kind of defensive about this. The way you are feeling now is how many of us TMA'ers feel when people describe their arts as "belt factories".
Many schools have multiple belts for money purposes, and use them as motivational tools.
On the surface this seems no different.
Last edited by HonkyTonkMan; 2/13/2008 7:29am at .
2/13/2008 3:37am, #119Originally Posted by Pandinha
Lets get this clear though....
No one here should be questioning the programs instructors qualifications. They are impeccable.
Yet there is HUGE difference between two years of BJJ and 3 days of a seminar.
2/13/2008 3:55am, #120
Wondering how many of these 72 hours (3 days) were mat time.Things about Jits: How do Armbar 2.0