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  1. AAAhmed46 is offline

    Senior Member

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    Posted On:
    2/03/2008 10:53pm


     Style: karate,MMA(between gyms)

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Question to silat guys(motivated by human weapon and Fight quest)

    In edmonton we have really only one Silat school.

    But it mixes FMA with Indonesian martial arts.

    Infact, when searching Silat, most schools seem to merge the systems.

    Even Silat mubai(which i think was renamed) mixes FMA with it.


    So silat by it self, is it just like FMA?

    Or is it what was on fight quest and human weapon?

    Ive seen weapons that look like they were made just for Silat, rattan wooden sticks that are slightly curved.

    But could that simply be the Kalification of Silat?




    Anyway, i know nothing, so educate me.

    Is my guess wrong?
  2. Epa is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/04/2008 1:52pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: FMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I haven't seen the human weapon or fight quest silat episodes so I'm not exactly sure what you saw. I have trained in several FMA systems and a couple of silat systems and from my experience they are different, but sometimes have areas that overlap well. If the schools around you are teaching a blend of silat and FMA, then they may be influenced by Dan Inosanto because he really likes blending the two and his students are taught the two as components of his overall blend. Some Pekiti Tirsia groups also mix in Silat. I know the group in Indy likes to mix the two. So the mixing is probably more of a modern thing.

    Silat is a pretty broad term and encompasses a lot of styles, some of which look completely different. For instance, the Harimau style from Sumatra is known for low postures and takedowns from a lying position and is what a lot of people associate with Silat. On the other hand, you have styles of Cimande/Tjmande which look kind of like karate to me since they stand upright and use a lot of smashing blocks. So whatever they showed you was probably an example of someone's silat, whether it was good or not is another question.

    Guro Dan has mentioned that Silat is related to other southeast asian styles like Bersilat (from Malaysia) and some southern Filipino styles. The southern Filipinos are, I believe, culturally closer to the Malaysians and Indonesians than Northern and Central Filipinos and their martial arts tend to be similar. So depending on the region that an FMA comes from it might be more closely related to Silat. However, most of the FMA systems in the United States are from the central or northern regions of the Philippines and have fewer similarities to silat.

    As far as the curved stick goes, I think that comes from the DeThoures (sp?) style of Serak. I saw Victor DeThoures write about it in a magazine. I've never seen an FMA style use the curved stick so I think that's more of a silat thing. Silat emphasizes some of the most unique weapons I've ever seen like the kerambit and sarong, which are not common in many other styles.
  3. jeff5 is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/05/2008 10:44am


     Style: KunTao & Kettlebells

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by AAAhmed46
    So silat by it self, is it just like FMA?
    It really isn't, although its hard to make a generalization as, like the previous poster said, there are hunderds of different styles of Silat. There definitely are some synergies between FMA and Silat, which is why you'll see people blend them together.

    Lots of folks have been influenced by Guru Dan, and he blends them quite effectively. He did this, I believe, because there are some very similar techinques between Filipino empty hand systems, especially in the southern Phillipines, and Silat.

    Guru Dan also blends in the Panatukan, dirty boxing, with Silat positioning and take downs in order to make it more alive, then just the static "you lunge punch, I do techinque on you" kind of thing.

    I find the weapons practice in the Silat that I study to be much more direct than the Filipino stuff. FMA seems to have more flow drills and back and forth, where as Silat has one, maybe two hits, then you enter, take down, kill, and are done.

    This goes the same for the empty hand as well. Where as panantukan or filipino empty hands may do one to three limb destructions, and then enter in on the opponent to take him down, the Silat I study has maybe a one count (usually to the head or body, not the limb, although we do limb destructions) then bam your in.

    That's not to say there isn't value in flow drills, because I think that there is, but I find the Silat weapons and empty hand techniques to be much more direct. Again, what I've seen, which is admittedly not very much.
  4. variance is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/05/2008 1:17pm


     Style: EF UM A

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by jeff5
    It really isn't, although its hard to make a generalization as, like the previous poster said, there are hunderds of different styles of Silat. There definitely are some synergies between FMA and Silat, which is why you'll see people blend them together.

    Lots of folks have been influenced by Guru Dan, and he blends them quite effectively. He did this, I believe, because there are some very similar techinques between Filipino empty hand systems, especially in the southern Phillipines, and Silat.

    Guru Dan also blends in the Panatukan, dirty boxing, with Silat positioning and take downs in order to make it more alive, then just the static "you lunge punch, I do techinque on you" kind of thing.

    I find the weapons practice in the Silat that I study to be much more direct than the Filipino stuff. FMA seems to have more flow drills and back and forth, where as Silat has one, maybe two hits, then you enter, take down, kill, and are done.

    This goes the same for the empty hand as well. Where as panantukan or filipino empty hands may do one to three limb destructions, and then enter in on the opponent to take him down, the Silat I study has maybe a one count (usually to the head or body, not the limb, although we do limb destructions) then bam your in.

    That's not to say there isn't value in flow drills, because I think that there is, but I find the Silat weapons and empty hand techniques to be much more direct. Again, what I've seen, which is admittedly not very much.
    Limed for a reason.

    FMA's have the same kind of "direct/entry drills" you are referring to
    however both "direct/entry drills" and "flow drills" pale in comparison to using them in regular sparring.
  5. AAAhmed46 is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/07/2008 7:12pm


     Style: karate,MMA(between gyms)

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    For those who have not watched fight quest or Human weapon:

    Basically, the Human weapon had Malay silat which was all pre-arranged.

    The Fight quest has Silat that was basically watered down karate with vests and no head kicks where they break away each time and do a little dance.


    Reason i posted this was because i heard so many different discriptions of silat.
    Last edited by AAAhmed46; 2/07/2008 7:24pm at .
  6. Milquetoast is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/07/2008 10:51pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Xingyi, Silat

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Think of silat like kung fu, the term itself just tells you what part of the world the art comes from. Really no guarantees. I've seen both episodes, and HW was IMO a terrible, terrible display. When a system brags about incorporating Wing Chun????? At least FQ had some fighting. Neither one really displayed a lot of what I was taught, but that's the primary problem with the term silat. And, again like kung fu, I've heard a lot of the old timers complain that the government is pushing a certain kind of silat. Oh, in the unsubstantiated rumors division, the woman who was teaching in fight quest apparently inherited the system when her father died unexpectedly, and is not in charge based on any kind of skill or study of the art. I'm sure someone here is now offended. I may rest.
    After writing too much, the basic idea is take a few classes, see if you like it. Like almost any school, it's worth checking out, and you should also post an honest review, after reading the criteria. Silat's approach to knifework is by far the best and most realistic I've seen so far, although I'm sure someone will post two white guys in fez's fighting with expensive training blades like it's west side story just to prove me wrong.
  7. jeff5 is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/08/2008 5:29pm


     Style: KunTao & Kettlebells

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Milquetoast
    Oh, in the unsubstantiated rumors division, the woman who was teaching in fight quest apparently inherited the system when her father died unexpectedly, and is not in charge based on any kind of skill or study of the art.
    The lady was Rita Suwanda. The system is Mande Muda, and it was founded by her father Uyuh Suwanda. It was formerly headed by her brother Pendekar Herman Suwanda, but he tragically died in a car crash in 2000. She took over the system from him. I believe there was some controversy when she took over, as some felt her brother Bambang was better suited and his approach to Silat was more like Pak Hermans, and also didn't like the way she ran things. Bambang kind of went his own way and has his own system just called Sundanese silat now.
  8. Jim_Jude is offline
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    Posted On:
    2/16/2008 3:21am

    Join us... or die
     Style: StrikeyGrappling & WW2-fu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by AAAhmed46
    In edmonton we have really only one Silat school.

    But it mixes FMA with Indonesian martial arts.

    Infact, when searching Silat, most schools seem to merge the systems.

    Even Silat mubai(which i think was renamed) mixes FMA with it.


    So silat by it self, is it just like FMA?

    Or is it what was on fight quest and human weapon?
    There are so many different styles of Silat, just as there are Kung Fu or Karate. There are Filipino styles of Silat, Malay, Indo, Sumatran, Balinese... the list goes on. Some people blend FMA's and Silat because they have an immense knowledge of both, & some are full of it, like Joseph Simonet. When it comes to Silat, you REALLY have to shop carefully, since there are so few quality Silat folks in the US & little to no quality control.

    Good Luck.
    "Judo is a study of techniques with which you may kill if you wish to kill, injure if you wish to injure, subdue if you wish to subdue, and, when attacked, defend yourself" - Jigoro Kano (1889)
    ***Was this quote "taken out of context"?***

    "The judoist has no time to allow himself a margin for error, especially in a situation upon which his or another person's very life depends...."
    ~ The Secret of Judo (Jiichi Watanabe & Lindy Avakian), p.19

    "Hope is not a method... nor is enthusiasm."
    ~ Brigadier General Gordon Toney

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