Posted On:3/02/2008 9:30pm
NP. I found out that he took ATA and my wife believes that he did also. I will see what I can come up with on that one. I also heard the story of him and his self promotion. My friend here also believes that he did his fake fundraiser in the early to mid 90's but couldn't remember the specific year since it was so long ago. I also have my contact looking in to his comercial and I will see what comes up. The bottom line is he is full of crap and a fake. I wonder how many sources we need to prove so on this forum.
Last edited by Bulldog TKD; 3/02/2008 10:14pm at .
Posted On:3/03/2008 2:28am
Originally Posted by gitartek
I'm close enough to him where it wouldn't be that big a deal for him to drive a few hours and pay me a visit.
That sucks. You live in AZ?
Posted On:3/16/2008 7:19am
Style: Jiu Jitsu / BJJ
So... any news on this ?
Posted On:3/16/2008 8:04am
You'll have to wait until GJ post but, I sent two emails and never received a reply.
Posted On:3/16/2008 11:32pm
Style: Muay Thai
I live a few blocks from ASU, I'll try to set up some time when I can roll by and watch one of his classes after work and ask about his record - I'll let you guys know what I see.
Posted On:3/17/2008 12:39am
Style: BJJ newbie
Has anyone even attempted sources other than the internet? A few primary sources? surely the team that he represents HAS to give some sort of statement to his dubiously sounding record and accomplishments
Posted On:3/17/2008 9:39am
****, ****, ****, ****........sorry guys. I got wrapped up in prepping for NAGA and completely forgot that I sent an email to Charlie Ward.
I just checked my Google account a found that he sent a lengthy reply to me. I have not read through the whole thing yet but he did ask that his reply be posted here in its entirety. He is monitoring this thread. Here is his reply to me. The reply is dated March 2, 2008, again sorry for the delay. To both the guys here and Mr. Ward.
Originally Posted by Charlie Ward
Sorry it took me so long to reply to your email. After reading the forum you mentioned in your email, I wondered if I should even reply. I have no way of knowing if you really are a moderator and writer for the website, or if you're just another one of the people taking shots at me. Against the advice of some of my colleagues, whom I consulted about this, I have decided I would respond. This may get turned around, twisted, and used against me, but I thought I would at least represent myself by answering your question. If you are indeed an honorable person, then I hope my response gets posted in the form that I submitted it - and that the matter will end there. If not, well it's not a perfect world is it? My response is as follows:
I am continually disappointed and appalled at the level of unprofessionalism and disrespect that seems to be on the rise in the MMA industry today. It seems that forums of this nature exist for the people who are either very new to the sport, or who are simply fans of the sport – meaning that they have not trained or fought themselves. Why these people have the notion that they are somehow any kind of authority on MMA is beyond my imagination. Anyone can sit behind a computer terminal somewhere, in complete anonymity, and try to talk tough, throw out insults, or take shots at someone’s name and reputation – seemingly without consequence. Anyone with a shred of honor would not behave this way, which tells me quite a bit about their character – and if they are martial artists (which is very doubtful), they do their instructors and art forms a disservice beyond description by engaging in this type of reprehensible behavior! Behavior of this sort is usually indicative of disgruntled individuals, who lack the courage and dignity to handle themselves in any sort of respectful manner. Maybe fighters who have been cut from a team, disqualified from competition and let go by management, or students who have been expelled for disciplinary action, and so on would be good examples.
In regards to the questions about my competitive background, I offer the following explanation of MMA and NHB, which I hope helps to educate those who were unaware of any differences. I would also add that I will not lower myself to engage in a forum discussion of this nature. My competitive background, record, and training pedigree are documented, established, and known to the people and organizations that matter. That is enough for me. The only reason it is ever brought up, is so the students and fighters that I work with and train realize and appreciate that I teach and coach from actual experience. That experience is very valuable to me as an instructor, and it is apparent to anyone who has ever trained with me. To that end, I welcome anyone to come and join one of our training sessions and to decide for themselves whether I teach from experience or theory. (And anybody who is remotely proficient themselves will immediately know the difference). My superiors, officials of professional organizations which I am a part of, other professional affiliates, and my peers and colleagues all know my background, experience, and education. Those are the people who matter to me, and beyond that I don’t need to prove anything to anyone.
Now, a brief word on MMA and NHB: Before MMA was even a recognized term, let alone the name given to the current combat sport, there were more extreme fighting competitions called Bare-Knuckle Freestyle, or Freestyle Full-Contact NHB (No Holds Barred). These competitions were taking place at various locations throughout the world – and they continue to do so today. Competitions and organizations of this nature are largely conducted underground (not in the public eye). While there are definite similarities between Ultimate Fighting MMA and Freestyle NHB, one major difference sets them apart – Freestlye NHB truly has no rules, whatsoever. Techniques that are considered illegal in modern MMA competition, like eye-gouging, biting, elbow and knee strikes to a downed opponent, or to the spine, and so forth - are all legal (and expected) in fights of this nature. Organizations (and their members) that participate in this type of NHB competition primarily consist of highly trained martial artists and fighters, who usually also possess military training experience – like elite forces personnel, mercenaries, and other similarly trained individuals. Quite often there are no weight classes, or timed rounds – although there are cases where those practices are put into effect.
Fights of this nature have a tendency to end very quickly and often times quite violently. Fighters that train and compete for this type of encounter don’t go in looking for a tap-out submission, or to go the distance, etc. Fighters of this nature look to end the fight as fast as possible, inflicting maximum damage in minimum time. Quite often fighters in these contests will fight multiple times in the course of a night. Dragging a fight out takes a toll, both physically and mentally, on the competitors – so if you know you have to fight a few times that night, finishing the fights fast is the thing to do!
Now, in most countries, fights of this nature are illegal – which is why these kinds of circuits are termed “underground”. You can’t very well advertise and shoot video of an illegal competition. However, there are some cities in Thailand – like Motoban, Ubon, Chaing Mai, and Ratchathani – where freestyle events of this nature not only occur, but are sanctioned by local military groups, or other organizations. Other cities, in various countries throughout Southeast Asia, like Laos, Okinawa, and Miyanmar (Burma) host freestyle contests of this nature as well.
Now, the fact that the people attacking my credentials don’t know where to look, or who to talk to, to find that information, tells me everything I ever need to know about them – and it speaks volumes about just how far out of their league they really are! I’m also surprised, and amused, at some of the outright fabrications and guesswork on their part in regards to pieces of my past – of which they know absolutely nothing! Guessing, jumping to conclusions, and just flat-out making stuff up, is not the content that intelligent discussions and conversations are made of. Bottom line, if you don’t know what you’re talking about – really, then just keep quiet. As the saying goes, “It’s better to close your mouth and be thought a fool, than to open your mouth and erase all doubt.” If you doubt my ability, and the validity of my experience, then join us for some training and actually experience it before you go running your mouth about it. If you feel like you have to challenge me to satisfy or prove something to yourself, then by all means – introduce yourself, state your intentions, sign the waiver, and step on the mat.
I’d like to add one final word. I see that a couple of you may have been former students of mine, and have tried to defend me in this forum. Thanks for your loyalty and support, but you can see that it only adds fuel to the fire. The type of people trying to attack me here will simply take anything you say out of context and twist it to say anything they want. Whether they do this because they think it’s clever, or because they’re trying to egg you on, is immaterial. These people are cowards, who are so full of insecurities and self-hatred, that they are pathetic. They are beneath you, and don’t merit a response of any kind. If you are former students of mine, then you know the truth, you know what I’m about, and you know I wouldn’t want you wasting your time and energy stressing about nonsense like this, or the kind of people-of-low-character exhibiting themselves in this forum. I have made many enemies, and have upset a lot of people, over the years due to my teaching and training methodology. At times I’ve had to expel some students as a disciplinary measure, or I’ve had to cut fighters from teams due to bad behavior (a breach of their code of conduct), or for failing to maintain performance and/or fitness standards, etc. Other times people have decided they don’t like me because I don’t favor one style over another, and I’ve never shied away from critically analyzing any style to pick apart its strengths and weaknesses – which is something I think every good fighter and coach should do, but it really upsets some people. Sometimes the truth hurts. In any case, most likely my devoted group of haters fall into one of these categories – and they’re trying to hurt me, or upset me, by writing disparaging remarks, trying to attack my credibility, and other similar tactics. I trust that most people can see through this kind of childish drivel. If you can’t, then like I stated earlier – you can always come and see me personally about it. As for me, I will not waste any more of my time with it, nor will I dignify any of it by engaging in some ridiculous online argument with faceless attackers. On average, I teach and train 60 hours a week, and continue to develop a program that is helping to validate and legitimize combat sports and martial arts studies in a whole new way. Now, there are those people who try to tear anybody down who does something new, and positive, in any trade or occupation. Maybe some of my devoted haters fall into that category too, hard to say. I will continue doing what I do, and it should be obvious to even the casual observer, that my qualifications and experience are very real when you consider the type of organizations I work for, and represent.
Now, I have answered your questions,explained myself, and find no need to proceed with any online arguments, attacks, and hate mail. I will not engage in any discussions of this nature again. This is it - it ends here. I've been gracious enough to write this response, which I hope gets treated properly - although I fear it will just get ripped into pieces and used against me, rather than for me.
That is all.
Charles Ward, CMIT
USMTA Arizona State Director
Chief Master Instructor Trainer/Head Coach
Ward's Living Weapon Fight Science
Sun Devil Combat Sports Program
Team Apocolypse MMA Training
7411 E. Utah Ave.
PAC Bldg. 105
Mesa, AZ 85212
Posted On:3/18/2008 3:24pm
Thanks for posting the reply. I was wondering where everybody went all the sudden...
Old School DM
Posted On:3/19/2008 7:57pm
Style: Nothing current
So basically his 150 pro fight record is documented, established, and well known, but only to secret people who are with secret fighting societies in far off lands. I wonder if he was at the Kumite with Dux...
Jesus loves you. I think you're an asshole.
Posted On:3/19/2008 8:46pm
Style: Kyokushin Karate / BJJ
Well I think the only fair thing to do would be for some people to go check this guys training out, give a first hand account of what its like and if this man can indeed live up to his claims.
I honestly didn't see a lot wrong with that reply, and although we can scoff and say "he and Frank Dux must be training partners" fact is we'd only be speculating that, and that's not uncovering a Bullshido artist is about, it's about PROVING that they are.
Has anyone gone to check this place out?
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