How do I tell a good kickboxing gym from a bad one? - Also Billy Manne

**electron jockey** · Posted On: 1/18/2008 5:24am

Okay, so I'm looking to make the leap from traditional martial arts into something a bit more modern. I'm also looking never to practice another retarded jointlock progression ever, ever again. And I recently found a kickboxing gym within a reasonable sort of distance to me. Run by one "Billy Manne". I came in and had a look this week and it looks like good bunch of guys and girls my age. I can take a few classes on a pay-as-you go basis, so I'll do that starting tomorrow and decide if I like it.

Good things that I've seen so far:

Looks like a hell of a workout. No standing around.
Contracts are not required immediately, and are month-by month at reasonable rates.
The gym seems pretty well equipped. (And is an actual gym with weight machines, etc. Discount gym membership. Bonus.)
They have a boxing ring and do apparently use it.
There are supposedly successful competitive kickboxers in the class.

Bad things I've seen so far:
Billy Manne refers to himself repeatedly as "Kiyoshi Billy Manne Sensei" online and in his own flyers. (wtf?)
Billy Manne is connected with and/or endorses several other martial arts including and Aikido school and seems to also own/operate a Karate dojo in the same building.
Details on the competitive kickboxers and the competitions they are in seems spotty.
Kickboxers are graded at an additional cost and recieve coloured shirts. (Is that normal? I've really had enough of coloured belts.)
A friend who works security knew of Billy Manne's kickboxing class by name without me mentioning it, but only well enough to say it was completely filled with assholes and I should never go there.

So help me out here. Assuming I make it through a class without having a heart attack and decide to give it a proper look, what do I look for? What questions should I ask? How do I tell a good kickboxer or a good kickboxing instructor from an angry retard on HGH?

**Odacon** · Posted On: 1/18/2008 6:20am

Their competitive record is the best indicator.

**MrJ** · Posted On: 1/18/2008 6:49am

Why does your friend say it is "full of assholes" and you shouldn't go?

**Askari** · Posted On: 1/18/2008 6:56am

Originally Posted by electron jockey

Kickboxers are graded at an additional cost and recieve coloured shirts. (Is that normal? I've really had enough of coloured belts.)

Not really normal, but not a deal killer.

Kickboxing is one MA you definitely ask for records. A buddy of mine is 5-2, not a lot of fights, but is a great instructor. I know a few others with only a few amateur fights that are good instructors. So make sure they have had at least a few fights, ask if it was amateur or pro.

If they try to give you the run around, walk away.

**electron jockey** · Posted On: 1/18/2008 7:41pm

My buddy in security claims he once saw a guy kicked out of a pub and restrained be a bouncer to wait for the police. All the while the guy was shouting "That wasn't a real fight!" and challenged the bouncers to come to that particular kickboxing gym. I can't verify the story, but it's pretty wierd that he knew it by name.

Anyway, I'm leaving now to take a class and I'll see how I go. And check some fight records.

**electron jockey** · Posted On: 1/18/2008 10:15pm

Okay, after taking a class I sort of feel like an asshole for retelling my friends bouncer story on the internet. All the guys I met there are really friendly. I spoke to Billy, who is in his 50s and no longer competes but seems like a good coach. He asked if I did TKD or karate from the way I was kicking to start off with. Nobody really takes the coloured shirts seriously, there is no uniform.

Being a Saturday, it was a small class. Noone I spoke to at length had an amateur record, but I didn't really run around interrogating everyone. That might have come across as a little fruity.

Way more footwork and way more sparring than any of the TMA I've ever been involved with, although I suppose that isn't a surprise to anyone here. Also the stretching excercises seem to be a lot more like actual excercises as opposed to something some guy in a striped belt made up on the spot.

I think I'm going to stick with this kickboxing thing and keep an eye out for fight records. I did get invited to spectate the next time there's a fight on, which sounds pretty cool.

So how the hell do I put on boxing handwraps, anyway?

**DAYoung** · Posted On: 1/18/2008 11:04pm

G'day Electron Jockey.

As far as I can tell, Billy Manne is a very tough customer. I don't know what he's like as a teacher, but he has a very good reputation as a fighter.

From memory, Manne was one of Bob Jones' mates, and is associated with Zen Do Kai. And like many ZDK fighters, he branched out into 'kickboxing' (which began as essentially full-contact Karate).

I can't vouch for the specifics, but I'm sure you'll get a solid grounding in fighting there, if nothing else. The aikido stuff is a recent broadening of interests (middle age, perhaps) - there was an article on this in Blitz magazine, the Australian publication.

**retrograde** · Posted On: 1/19/2008 6:47am

Actually, the coloured singlets grading systems are pretty common in Melbourne. I know more gyms that use it than don't. That said, as you mentioned, from what I've heard, most places are pretty relaxed about it and it's fairly optional.

This is a good list of Muay Thai gyms in Victoria, although none appear to be very close to you (presuming you're around the Frankston area). The only other gym I know of close to the area is Big Bens, which is in Carrum, but I don't know much about them.