This does not necessarily validate Ryabko's bio on the US site. Two main reasons that I can point to directly.
Originally Posted by EricH
One in '88 Retuinskih was in full charge of training KGB personel, at least on his side of things. He has a history of putting younger teachers out there. Ryabko joined in '83 by '88 he has had five years of training in Spirdinov and Retuinskih-Kadoch. Sonnon(as much as I hate the man) started training with Retuinskih in '94, in '96 he had the distinction of being the first non-Russian to lead a training cycle of the MVD. Yup Retuinskih gave him the creds and let him do it.
Secondly the KGB really didn't care if you were a world judo champion(Putin for instance) it wanted you trained in their MAs and systems, so that when the **** hit the fan everyone reacted the same way and knew what everyone else was doing.
As far as starting service early I would say that he repudiated that on his own website. He actually started service late according to his bio.
As I said the national representitive here in Israel for Ryabko, as in a Russian who served with him, trained with him for years, and continues to do so, Sergey Fedosov as well as a guy he had down from Russia Sergey Borshchev both say that the US bio is not accurate.
Isn't there rather bad blood between Viktor Sirotin and Ryabko?
Last edited by melk; 12/26/2007 2:14pm at .
Originally Posted by melk
As far as I know there isn't "bad blood" but I don't think that they were ever particularly close. I know that they do still communicate if only infrequently. Viktor has never voiced anything but respect for Ryabko's experience and abilities to us but still he keeps his distance.
My point regarding Ryabko's early start in service is that according to Viktor he was already "legendary" by 1988, at which time he was only 27.
Last edited by EricH; 12/26/2007 4:13pm at .
The quote I pasted is from Vladimir's website, but it's from the forum. It was something said at a Mikail Ryabko seminar, and the person who is relating it speaks Russian.
Meik, I'm not positive if your saying the first art learned by Ryabko is Asian, possibly kung fu?
Although I don't doubt that he was exposed to Asian styles, there is a lot of difference from Systema and Kung fu on a foundational level. One of the biggest differences seems to be the lack of rooting and pretty much every kung fu style emphasis' this aspect. The next would be power generation. Systema strikes look most like Xing Yi, but the strikes come from a completly diffirent place and, again, there is no need to be rooted to strike.
What I'm trying get at is I believe these stories are true of Ryabko being trained as a boy in "Systema". I think if we were to look at the "Sytema" of his teacher it would bare little resemblence to his own.
Mikail and Vlad in many ways move diffirent from each other, but are the doing the same art. The art they teach and perform is a principle based one.
I feel that Mikail took this art and either added the breathing techniques of the Russian Orthodox church, or they were already present.
After learning the art, it would stand to reason that he went out and practiced other things. He intergrated those pieces that fit conceptually with "Systema" . As yet, I see no reason to doubt that as a boy he studied a Russian art that became the foundation his style.
Last edited by Tacitus; 12/26/2007 4:06pm at .
Reason: For clarity
The current breathing techniques, from what I can tell are new. They weren't there in any of the semmis I went to when I first gave it a look back in '96.
Originally Posted by Tacitus
I have no doubt that he was probably trained in an art when he was a child. The same is true of Kadochnikov.
Even if an Asian art was his introduction to MA, it is definitely not what he based his system in.
Understand we are really getting into the conjecture at this point when we talk of things that we do not have solid evidence for.
From all of my study, his art is clearly based in Spirdinov. He has the softness and many of the same goofy looking drills(I don't say that with disrespect but seriously look at the drills they do look funny especially to an outsider). Is it possible that he trained in this when he was younger? Sure it is possible. That may have given him an edge in other arts, but until we can find some actual proof, like a name or something like that, we simply cannot be sure.
Eric as far as him being "legendary" while still young that is not so hard to believe and could be attributed to natural talent. For instance Alexy Kistin was actually called amongst the GRU "The Legend" from the time he graduated GRU training at like 23 or 24. The reason being, his overwhelming success in the final test of the GRU. It has tamed down some now, but during the 80's and early 90's(both Time and the Economist did articles on this), training was finished by a ruck run to a fight test. The fight test consisted of a ten minute fight within a designated circle and one candidate fighting against 5-10 Spets, if he knocked one out or in some other way incappacitated him a fresh opponent would be added until the conclusion of time. Typically all come out bloody, and some get a trip to the hospital with their maroon beret. Kistin was the only person in history to be the last man standing at the time mark. He KO'd everyone they sent in against him. For whatever reason when Retuinskih left Kadohcnikov Kistin went with him. At Retuinskih's own camps he would admit that Kistin(joined GRU in 86-out in 94) was better than him(Retuinskih was a 20+ year student of Kadochnikov and also very much on another level).
All of that to state that it could just as easily be Ryabko's natural abilities that made people call him legendary. Like calling Karelin an "Experiment". Russia seems to breed a fare number of extra-ordinary athletes, and I would not doubt that Mikhail is one of them.