onto a good thing

**russ_tkd_mt** · Posted On: 12/10/2007 9:50am

im just reading up in this forum about the ATA, im currently at an ITA school, Ho-Am, after 3 years of muay thai in a different country.
ATA and the ITA seem pretty close knit in their approach to tkd, im reading about McDojo's, Camo belts and some other scary stuff. These terms are all new to me.

Ive been at my school for 6 months now, they have a testing system once every 3 months, but you aren't forced to test, my instructor encourages it and works with me when i need help. My instructors teach tough drills from a fighting position, hands up always

There is no Camo belt, there are no BB's in 2 years. They dont have contracts. There are no Junior instructors, so the impression i have upto now is that the intructors care about the school and the students and the technique they teach.

However now im very wary, reading the criticism in this forum im thinking that maybe i made the wrong choice in school or even in discipline.

Is there anything else i need to look at in the school to see if im wasting my time ?

russ

**cyril** · Posted On: 12/10/2007 10:00am

Originally Posted by russ_tkd_mt

im just reading up in this forum about the ATA, im currently at an ITA school, Ho-Am, after 3 years of muay thai in a different country.
ATA and the ITA seem pretty close knit in their approach to tkd, im reading about McDojo's, Camo belts and some other scary stuff. These terms are all new to me.

Ive been at my school for 6 months now, they have a testing system once every 3 months, but you aren't forced to test, my instructor encourages it and works with me when i need help. My instructors teach tough drills from a fighting position, hands up always

There is no Camo belt, there are no BB's in 2 years. They dont have contracts. There are no Junior instructors, so the impression i have upto now is that the intructors care about the school and the students and the technique they teach.

However now im very wary, reading the criticism in this forum im thinking that maybe i made the wrong choice in school or even in discipline.

Is there anything else i need to look at in the school to see if im wasting my time ?

russ

Even if the school is good, the association still isn't. I understand that maybe you did find a diamond in the rough, but I suggest you steer clear anyway. Even if you got SUPERIOR TKD TRAINING in your school. There's always a good chance that things will turn into a moneyfarm or your decent instructor will move on, or your school will get really lax in their requirements. These things will happen, not because it's all downhill from here, but because there is no reason not to have these things happen.

As is the case for ITA TKD, they compete within a circle jerk of tournaments which keeps them centric to their association. There's no reason to go further because they've got nothing more of a goal than superiority in their circle. The next goal from there is money.

Without a proper goal that keeps the training high, it will fall. Maybe not now, but after a while. A well intentioned instructor doesn't always stay that way.

Where are you? Which school. Mine's Ho-Am as well.

Edit: I removed my school teacher's name because of some ninjer trickery. Just Tallahassee, will do.

**russ_tkd_mt** · Posted On: 12/10/2007 10:26am

Its in Lafayette Louisiana, Gary Soileau, Blake Soileau, Mike Guidry and Ali Rabatsky are the instructors there. The trouble is in Lafayette that there isnt much option in arts to train in. We have no Muay Thai, there are 2 or 3 karate schools with TV commercials so thats a no straigh away. This is one of the only grass roots kind of school i came across,

russ

**cyril** · Posted On: 12/10/2007 10:37am

Originally Posted by russ_tkd_mt

Its in Lafayette Louisiana, Gary Soileau, Blake Soileau, Mike Guidry and Ali Rabatsky are the instructors there. The trouble is in Lafayette that there isnt much option in arts to train in. We have no Muay Thai, there are 2 or 3 karate schools with TV commercials so thats a no straigh away. This is one of the only grass roots kind of school i came across,

russ

Sometimes, I've heard it said, it's better to not train at all than to train badly. I'm not saying that such is in your case. Maybe you are getting good training, but don't be fooled by one good school. If it isn't making money, they'll sell you out in a hot minute.

Our school just got a TV commercial, and it makes me die a little more inside.

Boxing is pretty prevalent everywhere, try some of that.

***JohnnyCache*** · Posted On: 12/10/2007 10:41am

I think if you have three years in muay thai you're probably able to tell if the sparring is quality and if you're learning anything.

**russ_tkd_mt** · Posted On: 12/10/2007 11:57am

Well i havent been able to spar fully yet as i started out at white belt and the students arent able to spar until their green belt. Ive sparred light contact with one of the instructors a couple of times, from what ive seen the sparring is pretty much improv and not the 'you hit me - i hit you - rinse and repeat' type that ive heard about from some of the mcdojos.

I have noticed that boxing is nowhere near as prevelant in TKD, which i miss, its either because its more a distance/kicking game or because the students arent taught how to box or a mixture of both. When i do spar some more im hoping i can use it to my advantage when in close enough and burst the distance bubble.. the boxing technique should be usefull with an opponent who just isnt used to it, i know it doesnt score points but it wont lose any points either.

russ

**cyril** · Posted On: 12/10/2007 6:34pm

Originally Posted by russ_tkd_mt

Well i havent been able to spar fully yet as i started out at white belt and the students arent able to spar until their green belt. Ive sparred light contact with one of the instructors a couple of times, from what ive seen the sparring is pretty much improv and not the 'you hit me - i hit you - rinse and repeat' type that ive heard about from some of the mcdojos.

I have noticed that boxing is nowhere near as prevelant in TKD, which i miss, its either because its more a distance/kicking game or because the students arent taught how to box or a mixture of both. When i do spar some more im hoping i can use it to my advantage when in close enough and burst the distance bubble.. the boxing technique should be usefull with an opponent who just isnt used to it, i know it doesnt score points but it wont lose any points either.

russ

Firstly, in the tournaments, it's stop and go point sparring with no head punches.

This gives them a reason to play the keep away game. You'll be surprised at how little strength some of your opponents put into their techniques.

Secondly, the students don't know about close range, and are of the school of thought that promotes keeping distance to set up powerful (lawl) kicks. If you get in close, you'll find some of them are scared shitless and like to run away. Most of the contact is "left up to the partners", which means low, in most cases.

Lastly, you CAN train your ass off there, but don't expect any real good technique to come from it.

**slayer506** · Posted On: 12/10/2007 7:04pm

If you want to know if its a good school look at the black belts. If the adults are all fat and there are a bunch of fetuses running around with black belts run as fast as you can. Also look at the degree of your instructor and how much he interacts with the class. if he is the type that just sits around and looks important you know the school is bad. Also pay attention to how long the school has been going and how many black belts it has. Do the students leave as soon as they reach first dan? If they do then its a bad sign.

**russ_tkd_mt** · Posted On: 12/11/2007 9:28am

Thanks for all your replies.

There are the core students, the ones you get at any school, there are 2 black belts training to become instructors themselves. The only foetus' are the ones in the childrens class, they have a belt system that is different to the adults system, but i dont know how the child/adult crossover works.

The instructors are very proactive and take part in the sessions with the students always. Everything seemed fine until last nights class. It was a small class, there were 8 students, 1 instructor and 1 bb studying to be an instructor that was helping out somewhat.

I was partnered off with a bb student for the drills, and thats when it started to go downhill, throughout the drills this guys technique was abysmal, im talking white/yellow abysmal, he was never in guard because his hands were 'wobbling' around by his waist.. his kicks had the power of a wet sponge and the height of a midget, one technique was never the same twice.. something else wobbled, something else look unco-ordinated, his stances were not stances of any art.. it wasnt a pretty sight. I didnt want to say anything because (and im still not sure) there may be something wrong with him in terms of an old back injury ? he may have learning difficulties ? im not sure at all

When it came to sparring, his stance was improved, his guard was improved though still not adequate.. still no power.. and had it been heavy contact instead of light theres no doubt in my mind that i would have whooped him, not just me, a number of students i have developed with at my level of tkd wouldve whooped him too.

Im sure he is an anomally, the other bb's in the school are genuine bb's from what i gather, is there a reason why someone of his calibre and poor technique would be allowed to progress to a bb without his obvious issues bieng addresed ? Maybe he does have learning difficulties that arent apparent in regular conversation, or an inury/disability...

Now this forum has me worried that im wasting my time.. Darn you Bullshido for spreading the truth and showing the light.. Darn you !

**cyril** · Posted On: 12/11/2007 9:43am

Originally Posted by russ_tkd_mt

Thanks for all your replies.

There are the core students, the ones you get at any school, there are 2 black belts training to become instructors themselves. The only foetus' are the ones in the childrens class, they have a belt system that is different to the adults system, but i dont know how the child/adult crossover works.

The instructors are very proactive and take part in the sessions with the students always. Everything seemed fine until last nights class. It was a small class, there were 8 students, 1 instructor and 1 bb studying to be an instructor that was helping out somewhat.

I was partnered off with a bb student for the drills, and thats when it started to go downhill, throughout the drills this guys technique was abysmal, im talking white/yellow abysmal, he was never in guard because his hands were 'wobbling' around by his waist.. his kicks had the power of a wet sponge and the height of a midget, one technique was never the same twice.. something else wobbled, something else look unco-ordinated, his stances were not stances of any art.. it wasnt a pretty sight. I didnt want to say anything because (and im still not sure) there may be something wrong with him in terms of an old back injury ? he may have learning difficulties ? im not sure at all

When it came to sparring, his stance was improved, his guard was improved though still not adequate.. still no power.. and had it been heavy contact instead of light theres no doubt in my mind that i would have whooped him, not just me, a number of students i have developed with at my level of tkd wouldve whooped him too.

Im sure he is an anomally, the other bb's in the school are genuine bb's from what i gather, is there a reason why someone of his calibre and poor technique would be allowed to progress to a bb without his obvious issues bieng addresed ? Maybe he does have learning difficulties that arent apparent in regular conversation, or an inury/disability...

Now this forum has me worried that im wasting my time.. Darn you Bullshido for spreading the truth and showing the light.. Darn you !

I'm sorry to say this, but none of those are excuses. Not everyone should be able to be a blackbelt. Not everyone will progress. This is the fundamental problem with ATA/ITA. Once you let things start to slide, it's all downhill. Now other students will see that he passed, and wonder why they need to work hard, when the level of acceptance is so low.