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  1. Gustard is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/24/2007 6:18am


     Style: Judo, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Why dont you get Karate in the UFC, Pride etc

    Why dont you get Karate in the UFC, Pride etc at all ..... ? you even get some weirdo kung fu stuff like Umeki . I mean for years everyone saw Karate as the ultimate striking art in the west - these guys break bricks with their hands etc etc so what is it about Karate that makes it so inneffective in the MMA ring ? There are even forms of Karate that allow full contact blows to the head such as this :

    http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=56825

    I dont understand its almost complete absence from mma .
  2. Craigypooh is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/24/2007 6:35am


     Style: TSD

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Georges St. Pierre lists karate in his fighting style:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georges_St._Pierre

    But he obviously trains other martial arts too, that's what makes it mma!
  3. Kokujin is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/24/2007 6:41am


     Style: BJJ(blue)

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Well, with all respect for karate practicioners around the world WHO could kick my ass... unless they change their practice methods and training regime and most of all, their mentality I don't see that happening any time soon! Their striking (kicking and punching) might be ok to survive an encounter in the ring, but their grappling work is pretty much non existent...and that will get them owned in mma!

    And since a lot of karate schools, not all of course, just LOVE KATA and arent much into hard sparring (and I don't mean point sparring or tip tap kicking), it's gonna be hard to compare it with other striking arts like Muay Thai, where you start striking things from day one, boxing, where you start striking things from day one and even bjj/judo/sambo, where you grapple from day one of course...

    So...karate might be a good idea, but not how it's practiced today...it's easier to skip it for muay thai or boxing and develop cardio, conditioning, hard sparring and ring confidence from day one...instead of chambering punches and kicks, doing kata and silly point sparring with no decent grappling
  4. Gustard is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/24/2007 6:54am


     Style: Judo, BJJ

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Yup ok that just about answers the question. But did you check those Chaos Madmax Karate guys out on the link I provided above ? The images dont show always heres some more :

    http://www.karate.gr.jp/news/images/karate_chaos.jpg

    http://www.gbring.com/sokuho/result/...1_chaos_06.jpg


    These guys do full contact alive sparring and they dont even wear gloves ! I would have thought it would have an MMA application even if they cross trained with BJJ or something.
  5. CNagy is offline
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    Posted On:
    11/24/2007 7:13am


     Style: Hiatus for Gen. Fitness

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Well, with all respect for (BJJ) practicioners around the world WHO could (submit) my ass... unless they change their practice methods and training regime and most of all, their mentality I don't see that happening any time soon! Their (grappling) [(positioning and submissions)] might be ok to survive an encounter in the ring, but their (striking) work is pretty much non existent...and that will get them owned in mma!
    I kinda had to do that, to illustrate a point. Karate is a martial art, not a gym. If one were to add grappling to karate, it would not be karate. It would probably be karate crappling. When the sport is Mixed Martial Arts, I am constantly amazed that people will bring up the idea of rounding out a martial art by adding something to the art (in this case, grappling to karate) instead of rounding out a person's game by adding additional arts--thus making the person in question something of a mixed martial artist.

    Let me clarify: I'm all for karate schools that also have grappling instructors, but the notion of someone teaching karate grappling is retarded.

    Anyway, to the OP: the reason that you do not see Karate in UFC is because the modern, professional mixed martial artist is a pretty homogenous group. Everyone needs to be able to fight in every range, and there are mixed martial arts gyms that teach MMA as a style, while having instructors for BJJ, MT, Boxing, etc. Or, it is the opposite and a BJJ school has MMA, whatever. That is, as far as I've seen, the most common gym setup. A karate school is not as likely to have a (good) MMA program, or a (good) submission arts program. Given the quality of most karate schools, such programs would most likely be bandwagoning for the purposes of attracting more students, and I would also bet that the instructors would be less-than-qualified. A mixed martial artist who does use a less common art either likely grew up practicing it or comes from a family that practices it.

    The reason that you do not see Karate in Pride is because Pride doesn't exist anymore.
  6. hpr is offline
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    Posted On:
    11/24/2007 7:23am


     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Lyoto Machida is a Shotokan Karate representative with 11-0 record so far. Wins over Rich Franklin and BJ Penn. And, according to Joe Rogan, a really, really cerebral unorthodox fighter.

    PS. Cerebral
    PPS. Unorthodox
    PPPS. I'm pretty sure Rogan said 'dynamic' too.

    (I fucking hate Rogan's constant repitition of same adjectives)
    Curiosity killed the cat. But damn it had a blast.
  7. CNagy is offline
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    Posted On:
    11/24/2007 7:28am


     Style: Hiatus for Gen. Fitness

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    And isn't his father some sort of high ranked Shotokan Black Belt?
  8. Gustard is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/24/2007 7:51am


     Style: Judo, BJJ

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by CNagy
    I kinda had to do that, to illustrate a point. Karate is a martial art, not a gym. If one were to add grappling to karate, it would not be karate. It would probably be karate crappling. When the sport is Mixed Martial Arts, I am constantly amazed that people will bring up the idea of rounding out a martial art by adding something to the art (in this case, grappling to karate) instead of rounding out a person's game by adding additional arts--thus making the person in question something of a mixed martial artist.

    Let me clarify: I'm all for karate schools that also have grappling instructors, but the notion of someone teaching karate grappling is retarded.

    Anyway, to the OP: the reason that you do not see Karate in UFC is because the modern, professional mixed martial artist is a pretty homogenous group. Everyone needs to be able to fight in every range, and there are mixed martial arts gyms that teach MMA as a style, while having instructors for BJJ, MT, Boxing, etc. Or, it is the opposite and a BJJ school has MMA, whatever. That is, as far as I've seen, the most common gym setup. A karate school is not as likely to have a (good) MMA program, or a (good) submission arts program. Given the quality of most karate schools, such programs would most likely be bandwagoning for the purposes of attracting more students, and I would also bet that the instructors would be less-than-qualified. A mixed martial artist who does use a less common art either likely grew up practicing it or comes from a family that practices it.

    The reason that you do not see Karate in Pride is because Pride doesn't exist anymore.
    If I was to take up mma - and I may do - I would rather train Judo at a Judo club, BJJ at a BJJ club and Muay Thai at a Muay Thai club etc etc and then frequent an mma club to practise the combinations. I agree that introducing grappling to Karate would be daft becaus eif you get these "jack of all trade " clubs they are never going to be really really good at any one art but average at all. For instance in Judo some clubs go into techniques in great depth whilst others dont, if Judo was trained as part of an mma curriculem a lot of the art would be lost and thus the effectiveness of the technique. However it doesnt explain why mor epeople dont crosstrain in alive forms of Karate. Still interesting to note there are some Karateka in mma and I thats news to me about Pride ! UFC bought them out huh , hope it doesnt turn into another UFC - I like dthe Japanese element.
  9. hpr is offline
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    Posted On:
    11/24/2007 8:00am


     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I don't think Pride is going to turn into anything. They were killed off.
    Curiosity killed the cat. But damn it had a blast.
  10. Gustard is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/24/2007 8:02am


     Style: Judo, BJJ

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by hpr
    I don't think Pride is going to turn into anything. They were killed off.

    Oh. Gutted :cry:
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