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  1. hl1978 is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/09/2007 12:28pm


     Style: Aunkai

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Is heavy bagwork a waste of time compared to...

    Is hitting a heavy bag a waste of time compared to hitting a real person with an airshield? Lately I have begun to think so more and more.

    Heavybag work seems fine to me if you want cardio or don't have a training partner around to hold a shield, but I don't get the same feedback hitting a heavy bag as I do when I hit a person, or a person with the airshield. The impact on a heavybag doesn't feel anything like a person. With a person it is much easier to tell (aside from the fact that they can speak) if you are merely hitting the surface, or infact you are transferring more weight into them.
  2. Omega Supreme is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/09/2007 12:31pm

    staff
     Style: Chinese Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Discuss this here. IMO apples and oraganges kid they both do different things and I hate airshields anyway.
  3. cuatro76 is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/09/2007 12:33pm


     Style: Judo, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Train both. Heavy bag for cardio and conditioning and a person holding an air shield when you're getting ready for a tournament. Or invest in a belly/chest shield, some thigh padding and some target mits and turn your training partner into a moving heavy bag. Are you getting ready for a competition?
  4. hl1978 is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/09/2007 12:34pm


     Style: Aunkai

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by cuatro76
    Train both. Heavy bag for cardio and conditioning and a person holding an air shield when you're getting ready for a tournament. Or invest in a belly/chest shield, some thigh padding and some target mits and turn your training partner into a moving heavy bag. Are you getting ready for a competition?
    Yep, Im doing a local sabaki challenge in January, assuming they ever put up the forms/medical waiver etc.
  5. cuatro76 is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/09/2007 1:16pm


     Style: Judo, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Do you practice Enshin Ryu?
  6. hl1978 is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/09/2007 1:23pm


     Style: Aunkai

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by cuatro76
    Do you practice Enshin Ryu?
    nope, Isshinryu, however the sabaki challenge is open to all styles, or at least the one in the DC area is. I watched it in the past, wanted to compete last year, but they didnt put the info up until a week or two before the tournament.
  7. cuatro76 is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/09/2007 1:26pm


     Style: Judo, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Good luck. Get some video if this happens and post it.
  8. Ming Loyalist is offline
    Ming Loyalist's Avatar

    solves problems with violence

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    Posted On:
    11/09/2007 1:33pm

    supporting member
     Style: Judo, Hung Family Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Omega the Merciless
    Discuss this here. IMO apples and oraganges kid they both do different things and I hate airshields anyway.
    as usual i agree with omega. heavy bags allow you to hit with full power, and to hit with that level of power over a whole round, which is very useful for conditioning.

    focus mitts and air kicking shields are not designed for that, their use trains a different set of skills, including footwork, and targeting, as well as adjusting to the movements of your opponent. (the only type of kicking shield that can be used to take full power kicks is a pair of thai pads in my experience, but they still aren't the same as a heavy bag.
    "Face punches are an essential character building part of a martial art. You don't truly love your children unless you allow them to get punched in the face." - chi-conspiricy
    "When I was a little boy, I had a sailor suit, but it didn't mean I was in the Navy." - Mtripp on the subject of a 5 year old karate black belt
    "Without actual qualifications to be a Zen teacher, your instructor is just another roundeye raping Asian culture for a buck." - Errant108
    "Seriously, who gives a **** what you or Errant think? You're Asian males, everyone just ignores you, unless you're in a krotty movie." - new2bjj
  9. JohnnyCache is offline
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    All Out of Bubblegum

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    Posted On:
    11/09/2007 6:37pm

    supporting memberforum leader
     Style: MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    The thing you're training on a heavy bag is your "shock absorbers" - on a heavy bag you can really dig in deep, over and over, and get used to how it feels. You can kick a person with a kicking shield pretty hard, but it's hard to work punches as hard on a shield or mit as you can on a bag.
    There's no choice but to confront you, to engage you, to erase you. I've gone to great lengths to expand my threshold of pain. I will use my mistakes against you. There's no other choice.
  10. bobyclumsyninja is offline
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    :)

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    Posted On:
    11/10/2007 12:43pm

    supporting member
     Style: Ex-Tiger KF, ex-SanDa

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    The bag will also take anything you can give it....raw output on a heavy bag is a great thing for stamina. If you can murderize the bag for 3 or 4 rounds, it won't need a break, and so you can push to, and past your own limit...not the lowest common denominator of you and your partner.

    I've had trouble in the past, laying into people with pads in fast hard combos, because my broken rhythm doesn't match up well with how they move, and brace. Also, trying to hit the pad really hard, while sort of monitoring so as not to knock the partner out on accident, is different from wailing away on a bag, without concern for the safety of another person, where the only object is to put the hurt, or closely simulate the putting of said hurt.

    Pretty much everyone here, who knows their ****, will advise you to do all of it.
    Bag/pad/person etc. What you do in what proportion would ideally be driven by your shortcomings and areas for improvement, just shift the ratio around a bit.
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