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  1. variance is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/07/2007 3:37am


     Style: EF UM A

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Texas Top Team Martial Arts Academy

    Ok. This investigation is being jacked from TXMMA here.

    cuz no one has followed up on it there.
    We are better at that sort of thing than they are. I hope this'll get PanAM and some other TXMMAers to participate.

    It's kind of old but interesting.


    Here's the gist:

    Guy has registered the name Texas Top Team Martial Arts Academy
    was whining and indignant about taking **** from the MMA scene about it
    after posting on TXMMA with a initial post consisting of

    "Many people have been asking when we will be adding a grappling class, we are now in the final stages of doing so, by the end of September we will have a regualar grappling class, with a great instructor teaching it who has competed and fought before if you are intrested or would like more information send us an email or feel free to give us a call and do not forget to check out our myspace page, thanks and remember Keep fighting the Good Fight..."
    Funny because I don't remember seeing a million posts asking about that elite Texas Top Team Martial Arts school thats whooping everyone in the local fight nights.

    His spurious claims about his instructors which are the purpose of this thread to investigate:

    What is everyone's deal besides Pan Am Silver(thanks Man) everyone is throwing up negetive remarks towards us. I never labeled my school a MMA fight but as it says in the title Texas Top Team MARTIAL ARTS Academy. We offer a varierty of programs and are now adding a grappling/submission program. We just opened up and are trying to build up our school.

    * Our boxing instructor has real ring experience with a 4 and 1 Pro-Boxing record and a 20 and 7 Amatuer record, which is more than I can say for others.

    * Our submission Instructor has competed in various tournaments including the world games and has a MMA record of 3wins 1 loss and a grappling record of 45 wins and 5 losses.

    * Our Karate/Kickboxing Instructor has competed in many tournaments including Submission Wrestling and Karate tournaments.


    I am not bragging saying we are better than anyone, we are just trying to come up and do what we love, I am not here critizing anyone I respect all and expect the same. As for the ring we do not have one yet we are looking for one at the moment, but that does not mean we can not teach boxing. As for charging others for the use of a name I had to pay for it to get it registered and why would I sell my name and school anyway, do any of yaw on here run your own school? Anyhow if you want more information let me know. And yes we do have heavy bags, jump ropes, thai pads, focus mitts and several other equipment any thing else?
    While he's not being a complete asshole. the rest of the thread is him trying not to mention the names of the instructors and refusing to answer the rest of the questions on the thread. When comparisons to Tiger Klay and Layn Von Erich are brought up.

    He indignantly replies:

    No he did not lie about how he did he is straight and upfront about his record he has been traing for years under many greats including Guy Mezger any more questions
    also his words on the thread don't lie in with the ones on his myspace page for his school. (His myspace is: http://myspace.com/texastopteam)

    He claims not to be teaching MMA but to be teaching TMA.
    HOWEVER,
    It clearly says MMA in the upperleft.

    The instructors he lists as teaching on his school


    -Chris Ramirez (no record found FC Fighter)
    -Ray Wright (no record found FC Fighter)
    -Elias Lopez (1 win, 2 losses, FC Fighter)
    -Luis Marquez. (no record found, FC Fighter)


    Source: His myspace page for his school.

    I see no evidence for the claims he gives for his instructors.
    and I believe he's being dishonest about the way he's promoting his school.
    His pictures on his page look like all kiddy krotty. (Karate Sucks month material I suppose)

    Anywayyy since he was dishonest about his schools representation on txmma I figured it wouldn't hurt to open a investigation thread here.

    I can't validate his records. Wondering if our boys who did the awesome background checks on Layn Von Erich, Sex Offender, Martial Arts Teacher, Massage Therapist, who made six figures, etc etc.

    can find anything similarly interesting about these guys

    My google-fu hasn't revealed too much. as of yet. I'll update if i can find anything interesting. Should I message him to come on here and defend/validate these claims as well?
    Last edited by variance; 11/07/2007 3:48am at .
  2. variance is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/07/2007 4:58am


     Style: EF UM A

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Apparently he posted more info on a different thread in TXMMA:

    It's odd because the more recent thread had people asking who his instructors were when in this older thread he indicates who they are. (edit: they were asking for his grappling instructor which is still unknown. My bad)

    Still can't find many MMA credentials on them.

    From a Olderthread:

    Chris Ramirez- Karate-Kickboxing-Self Defense/ He has trained under various instructors including- Guy Mezger, Fransisco Sanchez, Alex Andrade, Freddie Poole just to name a few and use to teach over at Freddie's school as well.

    Elias Lopez-Boxing, is a professional boxer who currently fights out of Dallas,TX under GTO boxing gym.

    Other Instructrs in Karate are Luis Marquez, Jose Cruz and Mike Cardoza.
    Still not sure who their "well qualified" grappling instructor is.

    Their instructor record check so far:

    Chris Ramirez (No record on FCFighter/Sherdog) - Qualifications unknown except for name dropping of who he's trained with. No specifications on what style of karate or length of training.

    Elias Lopez is ( 4-1 on boxrec.com, 1-2 on FC Fighter), - Legit. Attempting to confirm the 20 - 7 amateur record as well.

    Luis Marquez ( No record on FCFighter/Sherdog)

    Jose Cruz (There is 1 match for a individual with a record of 1 - 0 on FCFighter)

    Mike Cardoza (No Record FCFighter/Sherdog)

    in summary they have a number of karate instructors, 1 legit boxing instructor
    and a questionable grappling instructor as Im not aware any of the instructors ive listed are the grappling instructor.

    He seems well intentioned but his actions and demeanor in the forums indicate somewhat different. As well as the name and marketing of his school.

    a TMA school masquerading as a MMA-esque school.
    In all fairness, he may be very well trying to start up a legit school but is simply going about it in a disingenous way.
  3. variance is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/07/2007 5:35am


     Style: EF UM A

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Found some videos of what I think are Texas Top Team's Grappling Instructions.
    Him teaching kids takedowns.

    I am not fit/qualified to criticize them on a objective/technical level as I admittedly lack comprehensive ground experience.

    So take from it what you will. My OPINION is that they start too low for the takedown (assuming you start from a striking position)
    i don't know if thats how takedowns are normally trained at most schools.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSjxr2CCTpY
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dROEHwvjUhg
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RWObOFhwUmA

    it looks like its mainly a MMA/TMA school for young people/kids.
    the video account may belong to the mystery grappling/wrestling instructor.

    If anything they are certainly enthusiastic about taking over the martial arts world. Enthusiasm is always good.

    Looks like its not shaping up to be as interesting as the Layn Von Erich investigation
    Last edited by variance; 11/07/2007 5:40am at .
  4. soundless is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/07/2007 6:32pm


     Style: Sambo, MT, BJJ, CH

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    those are interesting videos. It could be that those kids and what i assume are teens, are new to double leg takedowns. Fairly sloppy but hey they don't look like they're too serious about it either. I will say we have 8 year olds who do it better.
  5. Lu Tze is offline

    BJJ might make you a better ground fighter, but Judo will make you a better dancer.

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    Posted On:
    11/07/2007 6:48pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    What's the big problem with the vids? The guy in the background with no shirt can do it right, so he's obviously teaching someone correctly. They're kids, and probably beginners to boot, you don't rate an instructor on the beginners in his class.
  6. variance is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/07/2007 7:27pm


     Style: EF UM A

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Lu Tze
    What's the big problem with the vids? The guy in the background with no shirt can do it right, so he's obviously teaching someone correctly. They're kids, and probably beginners to boot, you don't rate an instructor on the beginners in his class.
    While you may have a small point.

    I made the initial investigation post a few hours before I found the videos.
    From the threads involving the school's owner. You have to admit, It sounds fishy.

    also,
    Consequently the way he kept dodging mentioning specifics about the teacher who taught grappling. and just because you can teach a double leg takedown doesnt mean you're qualified to teach groundwork.

    or if i need to spell everything out literally.

    Reaons it seemed/still seems worthy of a investigation.

    #1. He's a TMA school who went onto a MMA board to spam/advertise and used a name for his school that was already being actively used by another competing team in the area.

    #2. When called out on the above. He cries foul saying he never said he was a MMA school. (Despite his myspace having MMA in nice big letters) and proceeds to give bullshido-worthy unspecific accolades to his grappling instructor.

    #3. It doesn't matter that some other well established fighters are currently using "Texas Top Team" because they didnt have it registered legally. It's his. Nyah, Nyah, Nyah. too bad for them. Which while true legally, is a poor attitude towards others.
    Especially fighters who are already established when you are still trying to get off the ground.

    #4. His words are meant to portray him as levelheaded and sincere and above criticism because he is a "TMA who's seen the light". his actions on the other hand depict something somewhat different. (Actions being the above.)

    Basically I thought I smelled some major BS like I did with the Layn Von Erich thing.
    Last edited by variance; 11/07/2007 7:31pm at .
  7. PanAmSilver is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/09/2007 6:55pm

    supporting member
     Style: BJJ,Boxing,Wrestling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    *Pan Am Silver takes the baton*

    They are a TMA jumping on the MMA bandwagon.
  8. variance is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/10/2007 9:15pm


     Style: EF UM A

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by PanAmSilver
    *Pan Am Silver takes the baton*

    They are a TMA jumping on the MMA bandwagon.
    Damn. I was hoping there'd be something awesome like one of them is a transvestite or a child molestor or their real name is Tiger Klay.

    Texas, Capital of Bull$hido in the USA.
  9. Don Gwinn is offline
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    BJJ wins again!

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    Posted On:
    11/10/2007 10:13pm

    supporting member
     Style: Guns

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I'm not sure what he has to gain. I would think that few people would be attracted by the "Top Team" name, and most of those who were would walk in with some idea of what MMA should look like.
    At first glance, it looks like he may have undercut himself over the long term to get a short-term gain that's probably not going to materialize. But what do I know?
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