80% of Taichi is Wrestling

**Hedgehogey** · Posted On: 10/26/2007 4:36pm

I won't comment on what taiji is or is not.

I will, however say:

1: If taichi is still producing smug, obtuse fatties like Cullion, you still have a lot of work to do

2: I find it funny how, after years and years of saying THIS IS DEFINETELY NOT FOR SPORT (V/ DANGEROUS), taiji practicioners are now attempting to get mad props by holding up a sport grappling champion as an example of good taiji

3: It took you guys 80 posts to answer a simple question about training equipment.

**Rivington** · Posted On: 10/26/2007 4:41pm

Originally Posted by AnnaTrocity

Yeh right, I've read Erle Montaguies book and I know that it's actually pressure point strikes.

And family-friendly blues rock! http://www.moontagu.org.uk/

**selfcritical** · Posted On: 10/26/2007 4:47pm

Originally Posted by Hedgehogey

I won't comment on what taiji is or is not.

I will, however say:

1: If taichi is still producing smug, obtuse fatties like Cullion, you still have a lot of work to do

2: I find it funny how, after years and years of saying THIS IS DEFINETELY NOT FOR SPORT (V/ DANGEROUS), taiji practicioners are now attempting to get mad props by holding up a sport grappling champion as an example of good taiji
s[/url] to answer a simple question about training equipment.

I'm pretty sure that praticioners of martial arts don't actually have hive-minds defined by their style. There are people from one category, and people from another, and the fact that you are just now noticing the second doesn't hard-wire hypocritical tendencies into the art.(of course, I haven't been paying a lot of discussion to Taji threads until recently, so maybe it is all the same people and i'm a moron).

**hl1978** · Posted On: 10/26/2007 5:00pm

Originally Posted by Hedgehogey

I won't comment on what taiji is or is not.

I will, however say:

1: If taichi is still producing smug, obtuse fatties like Cullion, you still have a lot of work to do

2: I find it funny how, after years and years of saying THIS IS DEFINETELY NOT FOR SPORT (V/ DANGEROUS), taiji practicioners are now attempting to get mad props by holding up a sport grappling champion as an example of good taiji

3: It took you guys 80 posts to answer a simple question about training equipment.

I don't do tai chi. :) Its not appropriate to lump me in with those guys. My only experience with tai chi was a Chen Xiaowang seminar a couple months back.

"The real tai chi" has been different from hippie tai chi all along. As I said earlier, Cartmell supposedly feels the way he does because of his CMA background. If you read up on the guy supposedly he was punking everyone else when he was a bluebelt. Not bad for a guy who started BJJ later in life.

**Cuchulain** · Posted On: 10/26/2007 5:04pm

I have said this plenty of times on the board already.

I've been told since day 1 of tai chi that it is a throwing/grappling art. This isn't a revalation, it's just informing the ignorant and correcting the bullshido teachers. Push hands is an isolation drill for wrestling so you can develop the essense of tai chi, the forms are to teach you body mechanics and give you a good base and strengthen the back and legs. The fact that you make a fist only once or twice in the 24 should be a hint. My Tai Chi instructor has great throws.

**Virus** · Posted On: 10/26/2007 5:20pm

Funny how actual wrestlers aren't flocking to taichi to improve their game. I'm sure it will start happening in the next decade, or the one after that, or after that.

**hl1978** · Posted On: 10/26/2007 5:24pm

Originally Posted by Virus

Funny how actual wrestlers aren't flocking to taichi to improve their game. I'm sure it will start happening in the next decade, or the one after that, or after that.

Is that because most people don't train it right, or there is nothing to learn from those that do?

If Cartmell is using those principles successfully I think it would be worth checking out one of his grappling seminars. There is a definate disconnect with this sorta stuff until you feel it first hand.

I came across this whole thing via http://communityjiujitsu.blogspot.com/ written by a BJJ purple belt who has being going all over the country trying out different name guys and pointing out what he picked up from each one. its a good blog.

**Cuchulain** · Posted On: 10/26/2007 5:32pm

Originally Posted by Virus

Funny how actual wrestlers aren't flocking to taichi to improve their game. I'm sure it will start happening in the next decade, or the one after that, or after that.

That's because wrestling has much better training, not because it is a better system. I have seen vids of Tai Chi being used successfully in Shuai Chuo and Chinese wrestling. I will post them in a minute. Plus learning the essense of what makes it Tai Chi wrestling and not other kinds is a slow process.

**selfcritical** · Posted On: 10/26/2007 5:38pm

Originally Posted by Virus

Funny how actual wrestlers aren't flocking to taichi to improve their game. I'm sure it will start happening in the next decade, or the one after that, or after that.

They don't flock to mongolian wrestling either, or Judo, or Sambo etc. It's because they're different ways to the same skill set, and if you've already gained proficiency with one, there's very possibly diminishing returns in reinventing the wheel.

**Cuchulain** · Posted On: 10/26/2007 5:44pm

I don't know how to embed video google. If someone tells me I will edit it.

It's a loing vid but you need only watch the first 5 mins it shows the move as it is in the forms and then used in competition, the rest is just forms.

http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?...374750317361&q

****, I can't find the Shuai Chou clip atm, i will keep looking but it may not be there anymore.

And another good vid has been taken down. I will look for some new evidence i guess for when these arguments come up.

edit;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ft_ZtX9wRdA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RXSpOf4pNy4

There are plenty more but interenet is running slow so i can't be bothered right now. Go to youtube and search for free style push hands, or tai chi wrestling or something.