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  1. StormChild is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/12/2007 1:10pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: BJJ, SCA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    The problem is he has a lot of bullshidoka buddies that will confirm his "qualifications" just look at all the people on the "World Sokeship Council Seishinryuku Kai"... You'll note that our beloved Radford Davies is on there;

    BOARD MEMBER TEROU ( ASHIDA KIM) KIMITAKE
    KU 9 DAN MUGEI-MUMEI NO JITSU
    FLORINDA / USA

    Along with;

    AFRICA DIRECTOR PROFESSOR STOFFEL VAN VUUREN PHD,D.SC
    10 TH DAN NINJITSU
    SOUTH AFRICA

    reference: http://www.ioskdka.com/WSCSK.html
  2. ninjoo is offline

    Registered Member

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    Posted On:
    11/12/2007 1:32pm


     Style: Bujinkan

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Samuel Browning
    There is no such thing as Koga Ryu authenticity :)
    Whadda ya mean no such thing? Take a look at THIS thread;

    http://shinobimagazine.proboards66.c...ead=1183554016
  3. Dsimon3387 is offline

    Senior Member

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    Posted On:
    11/12/2007 8:25pm

    Join us... or die
     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by ninjoo
    Whadda ya mean no such thing? Take a look at THIS thread;

    http://shinobimagazine.proboards66.c...ead=1183554016

    and on the viscous wheel of Samsara goes, causing suffering in the ruts it leaves in the mud of our fecal grey matter, and on it goes... I am now to fall on my sword.
  4. Truth Hurts is offline

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    Nov 2007
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    Posted On:
    11/18/2007 6:57am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: None

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Exposing Stoffel Van Vuuren in pursuit of the truth

    Presented here is a small part of what I personally uncovered in my pursuit of the truth. The exposure will allow the martial arts community worldwide to hear another version, as apposed to the one sided story everyone keeps hearing. This will allow everyone the opportunity to decide for themselves, who Stoffel Van Vuuren really is.

    Floyd Webb recently received an ‘Honorary Member’ certificate from the Black Dragon Fighting Society, http://bp3.blogger.com/_PXP-b-2WdfA/Rx1Jw-nJVlI/AAAAAAAABIw/fOz-KjWD1U8/s1600-h/fw_bdfs.jpg.



    This certificate serves as the official grading certificate used by Stoffel Van Vuuren for any rank qualification within the BDFS. This certificate is a representation of the Dojo, its martial arts society and its represented masters.

    What then if their certificates turned out to be counterfeited, a fraudulent document sourced from various websites and poorly put together to create this illusion?

    Stoffel Van Vuuren has failed in every attempt in creating a certificate that would appear genuine. Lets start taking a closer look at Stoffels certificate.

    Topic Point I begin at the top, it reads “College of Martial Arts” and next to it on the top right hand corner is a crest. My first impression was that the crest represented and accredits the BDFSs College of martial arts authenticity. I know for a fact that this college doesn’t exist.
    Proof The paragraph above the South African and American flag, second line reads “and have applied for the registration of the college accreditation”, an application does not mean that you have an official College of martial arts, it does not even guarantee the approval of such a College. Where could one apply for such a course, where are their premises in order to attend a lecture, how many teaches are there per student, how many faculty and staff does the college have, what is the website address?
    I suppose Stoffel could then apply for his Grandmaster ranking and take the title before it was earned?
    The next question here would be, “application with who?”, “SASSETA”. Would the application not have to go through the Department of Education and Sports, http://www.education.gov.za/or http://www.srsa.gov.za/, and not SASSETA. I will touch back on this point latter once again.
    Proof The crest does not belong to any college, it actually is the South African Government Coat of Arms, http://www.gov.za/. They have absolutely nothing to do with the BDFS, Stoffels supposed College of Martial Arts” or martial arts itself. How closely is he involved with the South African Government that permits him using their logo?
    I doubt they knew about this, now they do and can share their thoughts.

    It is my opinion that Stoffel Van Vuuren is trying to meet the high standards set by his most recent induction of David Halivia and this Dojo in Israel, http://www.dark.co.il/ and http://www.bdfs.co.il/ , into the BDFS-I.
    From what I have seen and have researched, it actually is Stoffel who needs to be inducted into “The Way Of The Nine Cutting Hands”. David Halivia, his knowledge, his Dojo and students are far more superior than Stoffel Van Vuuren is. So much so that he is desperately copying them in everyway possible. Israel has an impressive Zinman College of Physical Education and Sport Science, now Stoffel must create an impression that he has one too that belongs to him, the BDFS-I, http://www.blackdragon.co.za/content/159/52/wingate_institute_and_the_college_of_physical_educ ation_and_sport_sciences/.
    Stoffel even copied Israels website layout, his could not match their standards and dedication.
    I am also convinced that Stoffel is trying to secure their syllabus on DVD in order to strengthen his supposed Koga Ryu Ninjitsu syllabus. Stoffel did exactly that, when he acquired Ryu Toushis syllabus, http://www.ryutoushifightingarts.com/. I have copies of Stoffels Ninjitsu training DVDs and the BDFS-I entire syllabus on file, before Ryu Toushi and “The Way Of the Nine Cutting Hands” joined. It was very weak considering he is an authentic 10 Dan Grandmaster in Koga Ryu Ninjitsu for the BDFS-I. I also got hold of Ryu Toushis syllabus and then a copy of Stoffels amended BDFS-I syllabus soon after. In comparison, Stoffels syllabus was so much more inferior and could not hold any measure to Ryu Toushi. So he copied and pasted majority of their syllabus to create his newest version for 2007.

    Topic Point Moving onto the next logo, found on the right of the two red official stamps. The image contains an oriental dragon holding a typical yin & yang image with the Chinese Elemental Kanji surrounding it. The circular logo fades from a light orange to a dark orange.
    Proof This logo belongs to Budoschule Ronin, http://www.budoschule-ronin.de/, which has no affiliation to the BDFS, there are no links on either websites in association, nor are they listed under the BDFS affiliated page, http://www.blackdragon.co.za/content/136/40/affiliation_to_the_bdfs/.
    Yet Stoffel Van Vuuren, the BDFS may simply use their logo when required.
    I doubt Budoschule Ronin knew about this, now they do and can share their thoughts.

    Topic Point The last logo found on the bottom right hand corner belongs to Kyusho International.
    Proof The BDFS may have a link from their website to Kyusho International. Although it is not a direct link to Kyusho International themselves, http://www.blackdragon.co.za/content/130/31/related_links_to_sites/, it is through a Kyusho Space Martial Arts Networking Community, http://kyushospace.com/links.aspx.
    What a complicated way to have a direct link to Kyusho International. Stoffel Van Vuuren is not a certified Kyusho International instructor, nor does he have a strong affiliation to them. As far as I am aware, he merely registered as a student and has not attended any seminars, training session nor graded any kyu level.
    There are also no links to BDFS from both the Kyusho International, http://www.kyusho.com/, and South African websites, http://www.kyusho.co.za/.
    There even is no link from the Kyusho Space Martial Arts Network Community, http://www.kyushospace.com/links.aspx, back to Stoffel at the BDFS.
    I suppose having a student affiliation and having an indirect website link to Kyusho International gives Stoffel permission to use their logo on this certificates.
    I doubt Kyusho International knew about this, now they do and can share their thoughts.

    Do you not get the impression that Stoffel Van Vuuren is simply adding website links to reputable masters and Dojos, in the attempt to strengthen the appearance of his society?
    I will cover those trends in detail in the near future.

    Topic Point Dr. Lawrence Days official red stamp is found above the Shao-lin Temple stamp, situated slightly under the South African Government logo. I believe this to be the only authentic image on the entire certificate. Dr. Lawrence Day is one of the original BDFS students of Count Dante.
    Dr. Lawrence Day will not use Stoffel Van Vuurens BDFS logo on his website, http://www.ryutoushifightingarts.com/BDFSI.html, now why is that?

    It is my opinion that Stoffel Van Vuuren sought to join forces with Dr. Lawrence Day and with Master Michael Felkoff, so that he could strengthen his fraudulent ties to the real BDFS and its members. Stoffel is desperately trying to include himself somehow in the upcoming changes to ensure his place within the newest BDFS. This link gives you some idea to what is going to happen, http://www.blackdragon.co.za/content/162/57/ashida_kim_and_the_bdfs_i/.
    I am sure that Stoffel made use of the fact that Dr. Lawrence Day could not verify anything seeing that he is overseas, taking advantage of being in a different country with only his voice to consider and trust.

    Topic Point The Shao-lin Temple stamp found underneath Dr. Lawrence Days stamp. There is another smaller stamp on the bottom left corner of the certificate. Why have the same stamp twice?
    Proof I could not find this logo or any reference to grandmaster Young Di of the Shaolin Temple on the internet. Do you have any information to share?

    Topic Point This is a trivial point, I know, I will mention it anyway for you to enjoy.
    The South African flag is facing the wrong way.

    Topic Point The paragraph above the flags reads, “The College prescribed to all the requirements set by the South African Government SASSETA Standards and have applied for the registration of the college accreditation” is false.
    Proof SASSETA, http://www.sasseta.org.za, is not the South African Government, it may be regulated by the government, so too are many other organisations.
    A SASSETA manager confirmed that they do not and will not authorise any such college application. SASSETA is only involved with the basic security personal and firearm accreditations. They do not regulate the self defence and martial arts sectors.

    Topic Point The Japanese Kanji, found under the rank in the middle of the certificate.
    I understand the English translation to be ShinobiYa. Again, yet another logo has been taken and copied from another unsuspecting website.
    Proof The link listed here will prove itself, http://shinobiya.bravehost.com/ShinobiYa.html.
    I doubt they knew about this, now they do and can share their thoughts.

    Topic Point The BDFS logo found in the middle left of the certificate has also been copied from another website and martial arts federation.
    Proof Visit Count Dantes website, http://www.countdante.com/, you will see Count Dante sitting with the BDFS badge on his shirt and the copyrighted logo is displayed soon after. This was established many years before Stoffel Van Vuuren was illegally involved in the BDFS-I.

    Topic Point The last logo found on the top left hand corner of the certificate. It is the log above the original BDFS logo. At present I have no idea where this logo came from. I hear that it was the first logo used by Count Dante before changing it to the current version. I can not confirm this, although, I saw this badge on this page, http://bp3.blogger.com/_PXP-b-2WdfA/Rx1MY-nJVmI/AAAAAAAABI4/r2S1V6gF3gU/s1600-h/bdfs_badge.jpg, http://johnkeehan.blogspot.com/,
    Could you shed some light on this?

    It seems Stoffel Van Vuuren has a tendency to copy everything he chooses from any website, uses it and claims it to be his.

    Here is another incredibly interesting read, http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=59843&page=102, it is a copy of Stoffels email that he sent to the original BDFS asking them if he could affiliate himself. Now why would he need to affiliate to them if he is the official Grandmaster of BDFS–I and is charged with the responsibility as president of BDFS–I, http://www.blackdragon.co.za/content/162/57/ashida_kim_and_the_bdfs_i/, I know, this has just opened another huge issue and a number of questions, which will be address in the near future.
    Stoffels email to BDFS, you realise that Stoffel quickly registered the BDFS name and logo in South Africa before his BDFS affiliation was approved. He took advantage of the international copyrighting loopholes in South Africa. Stoffel Van Vuuren explained a very different version of events, described in his email to the original BDFS, to everyone in South Africa. Most of his comments in that email are false and deliberate lies. I am busy compiling the evidence and testimonials to prove Stoffel otherwise.

    Stoffel Van Vuuren insist that the BDFS and BDFS–I are not the one and same. If that were true, why is he using the BDFS logo and linking himself to members of the original BDFS. Who really charged him with the responsibilities as President of the BDFS-I. I have in my possession an official signed letter from Ashida Kim, appointing Stoffel Van Vuuren as the official representative of the BDFS in Africa and as Grandmaster of region 9, only a 5 Dan Black Belt in Koga Ryu Ninjitsu at that time, dated and signed on the 11 November 1998. The BDFS did not even belong to Ashida Kim to have assigned it over to Stoffel.

    Stoffel may have a copyright on the BDFS logo and name you see on his website, in South Africa, I have not seen proof of this to this day.
    If you wish to challenge Stoffel Van Vuurens copyrights legally in South Africa, I suggest you get your legal team to contact CIPRO, www.cipro.co.za, and challenge this issue. I know that if Mr. Aguiar can prove that the BDFS logo was used well before Stoffel acquired it, Stoffel would be in some serious legal trouble, it should be easy enough to prove. Stoffel took advantage of the lack in the authenticating process of South African copyrighted logos that are compared international.

    I will not tolerate Stoffels attempt to take something that is not his. If you have not realised by now that Stoffel is joining forces with reputable martial artists, he is frantically networking himself within the martial arts community, acquiring honorary rank certificates (claiming they are actual grading certificates, having the full experience and knowledge for each, having physically earned them) and affiliations in the attempt to strengthen his credibility. Stoffel might think that by surrounding himself with true masters, no one would think to question his authenticity. Stoffel may be a mixed martial artist, but, he is no a master of one.
    Stoffel may fool a few people now, but the truth always finds its way.

    Stoffel Van Vuurens character and integrity is in question so soon, by just questioning one certificate, we get an incredibly strong impression of who Stoffel really is.

    Stoffel Van Vuuren has no regard to any copyright laws, he is permanently copying every logo he can, selling copies of martial art training DVDs, selling copies of books for profit. Including a photocopied version of Count Dantes book he acquired from Ashida Kim. He must be stopped.

    I will address everything else I found about Stoffel Van Vuuren in the near future.
    That is all for now.
  5. Truth Hurts is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/18/2007 10:22am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: None

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by trollgoth
    What is the current situation with Stoffel van Vuuren in South Africa? He claims to be a GRAND MASTER in Ninjitsu? How can this be? He wears badges bought from Ashida Kim's website. He is currently claiming to be many things on his new website: http://www.blackdragon.co.za/homepage/126/home/ . Who graded him to this rank? Further more he recently graded a student who was doing ninjitsu and had a 4th kyu to 1st kyu in seven days, and gave this student a 1st Dan in "POISON HAND" which apparently only has 77 moves... WTF? Is there anyone who is legitamate in this style?

    If anyone has dug up anything or been doing any invetigations into this let us know.

    Anyone got any comments on the Cape Ninjitsu Federation: http://www.cnfsa.com/ who now seem to be called
    "HAKKO KAI NINJUTSU" ...?
    I never new there were tigers in Japan?

    All we want to do is practice ninjitsu under legitemate and qualified instructors! ARE THERE ANY OUT THERE???

    :bs:
    Stoffel van Vuuren is a fraud in every sense, read my post http://www.bullshido.net/forums/show...34#post1631434. This is only a small part of what I have to share with everyone.

    Here is a little more.

    Stoffels real name is Stoffel Jansen van Vuuren, AKA “Stoffel van Vuuren”, AKA “Jacob Jansen van Vuuren”.

    All of a sudden, Stoffel van Vuuren is a 5th dan in ‘Poison Hand’. Not long ago, roughly 4 months ago, he did not have any dan level in ‘Poison Hand’. Today, he is a 5th dan, just remarkable.
    I can also tell you why Poison Hand only has 77 moves to 1st dan. That is exactly how many moves Stoffel Van Vuuren created so far.

    I personally spoke with this student and confirmed that Stoffel did grade him from 4th kyu to 1st kyu ninjitsu that week. He stayed with Stoffel for a week only. And without any knowledge in “Poison Hand”, Stoffel graded him to 1st dan within that same week.

    This is another unacceptable trend I discovered a while ago.
    Stoffel van Vuuren ‘super-accelerates’ his students development, rushing them through their kyu levels.

    There are two trains of thought around this ‘super-accelerated’ grading.

    The first being; that he is desperately trying to establish many more dojos in South Africa, and trying to increase his student count in doing so. In attempts to satisfy his international reputation as Grandmaster of BDFS/BDFS-I, having his Headquarters in Centurion, Pretoria, South Africa
    Now why would he need to do this you ask? For being the head Grandmaster of BDFS, having the BDFS Headquarters in South Africa (not in Japan?!?), you would expect that he would have many Dojos, senseis and students in the country where he is based? Well, he does not. He only has a few affiliated students, a very few senseis and micro dojos (under 5 students).
    Stoffel is training students from his garage, his personal dojo in centurion, HQ. That can not hold more than 5 students.
    His Kempton Park dojo has three students.
    His Middleburg/Queenstown/Karoo dojo has a few more.
    The Black Dragons, in East London dojo, is a little bigger, but are more involved in cage fighting and not in koga ninjitsu and are run by someone completely different with little or no influence from Stoffel. They are simply affiliated by name and not by style.
    From what I heard, the majority of his sensies have disaffiliated from him. In time, all will see the truth. That is why he has so few dan levelled students in South Africa.
    Internationally, he has many, simply because they have affiliated to him, have not trained under him and have real actual masters who got them to that level.
    I read that Stoffel claimed to have 1200 students in South Africa in March 2004. It was mentioned in his email addressed to Master Aguair, http://www.bullshido.net/forums/show...59843&page=102. I will tackle this letter in the near future and expose the deliberate misguided events within that letter.
    I can assure you he did not have that many students affiliated in South Africa, maybe combined internationally through other masters who have a larger student count than his.
    It would be a lot, if Stoffel has 50 students affiliated in South Africa, that we can physically speak to confirm their affiliation, not a list of names from disaffiliated students or from a database of names.
    If he still claims he had or has so many students in South Africa, then where have all of them gone? Here is another clear indication as to his credibility, which many come to realise through their training with him.
    I also heard that the Johannesburg dojo and Cape Town dojo recently all disaffiliated along with every student of theirs. Is this not a clear indication of his fraudulency? I think so!
    I believe those were the only two strong dojos in South Africa with the highest student counts.

    The second being; the other reason for Stoffels ‘super-accelerated’ grading is for the financial gain in doing so. For one instance, he charges you your dan level grading by R1000.00. Example: you are grading 5th dan, you will pay R5000.00 for that grading. Not to mention the private hourly training fees he charges per day to get you there.
    He also charges annual affiliation fees of R240.00 per student to be affiliated to him that he pockets over and above all those costs. Only the South African students pay affiliation fees to belong to BDFS, not the rest of the world. Nice, thats very nice of him to do.
    Stoffel also sells copies of training dvds in other styles and photocopies of books, pressurising and expecting his students to buy them from him.

    I know that every higher dan level certificate Stoffel van Vuuren possesses are all ‘honoury’ certificates. He physically has not trained in front of or with any of those master, he has not completed any physical grading in front of those masters, nor does he have the entire knowledge in syllabus or style as a student would have who studied with that master.
    He maybe has a copy of their training dvd or a copy of their syllabus, that is it.
    I bring you back to his email to the only original BDFS, http://www.bullshido.net/forums/show...59843&page=102, in his email to Master Aguiar, he said “You will issue me with new BDFS certificates from your side acknowledge my rank at present only and not grading as such”
    Creature of habit I see, another trend exposes itself.
    Stoffel can not prove any of his rankings; no one can actually confirm his grading with any master.
    Another classical example is taken from his website, http://www.blackdragon.co.za/content...1/sifu_chi_yu/. I copied the page in case he takes it off.

    Sifu Chi Yu
    36th Generation Fighting Shoalin Monk

    Only a few men can claim they have studied and stayed at the Temple and is actually Accredited by the Temple Master and appionted as the Representative for
    Northern Shoalin in South Africa.

    It is under his Guidance that I have been appionted as the President for the Nothern
    Shoalin Federation in South Africa.

    I will soon have his whole life history to be read by all.

    Look out for the changes.

    Stoffel misrepresents events very well, by implying he is more than he is. He is claiming he studied and stayed at the Temple and is accredited my the temple master. He may have visited the temple, studied with the master, but only for a few days, that does not mean he is a 8th dan Shaolin Master. It takes a life time to achieve that ranking, in which life did he do this? Does he even move like a Shaolin Master, not from what I have seen in his training dvds.

    Stoffel has been given countless opportunities to prove us all wrong, present copies of his certificates, masters contact details and so on.
    He never will, because he is a fraud.

    Can anyone give me any information on Stoffel van Vuuren, his grading/ranking information, anything? I have a lot already and would like some more. I will keep the source confidential if you so choose. Who knows, maybe I will have to retract some of my words in finding new evidence, I doubt it but will let you all know if I have to.

    Stoffel got his 5th dan black belt from Ashida Kim, and we all know that Ashida Kim sells black belts. Ashida Kim appointed Stoffel van Vuuren 5th dan, Grandmaster of region 9, Africa Continent (also mentioned in his email to Master Aguiar), and has been using this Grandmaster title ever since then, November 1998. Can a 5th dan be a Grandmaster?

    That is the last, highest and only dan level grading I could find to date.
  6. Shadow4Ever is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/03/2007 2:14am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Ninjitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    THE TRUTH

    Your article is very vague, I am interested in doing Ninjitsu in South Africa and come across this article.
    With so few Ninjitsu schools available in South Africa it is difficult to believe these accusations.
    I have red thoroughly through this article and found it lacking in concrete evidence.
    There is a lot of speculation and opinion directly from the poster.
    The people or associations you have named do not seem to have an opinion because they do not confirm your suspicions.
    None of these people or associations has posted any replies or confirmations.
    Please post some concrete evidence for this a serious matter and I would like to know the truth.
  7. StormChild is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/03/2007 5:51pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: BJJ, SCA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadow4Ever
    Your article is very vague, I am interested in doing Ninjitsu in South Africa and come across this article.
    With so few Ninjitsu schools available in South Africa it is difficult to believe these accusations.
    I have red thoroughly through this article and found it lacking in concrete evidence.
    There is a lot of speculation and opinion directly from the poster.
    The people or associations you have named do not seem to have an opinion because they do not confirm your suspicions.
    None of these people or associations has posted any replies or confirmations.
    Please post some concrete evidence for this a serious matter and I would like to know the truth.
    About Ninjitsu there is no concrete evidence that anyone in south africa is doing a authentic ninjitsu art form. On the BDFS article there is more than enough concrete evidence that Mr. Stoffel van Vuuren is using the BDFS logo and name illegally, you are welcome to contact Mr. Aguiar who is the owner of the BDFS to find details on that. The Koga Ryu schools recently after learning of the scam disaffiliated with Stoffel and the "South African BDFS"

    Below is my personal opinions of the art;

    If you want to learn ninjitsu there is nothing stopping you, I have done it for 3 years and there is a lot you can learn. You have to ask yourself what you want to achieve by doing ninjitsu;

    1. Learn assassination techniques - erm... they don't teach that
    2. Learn to break into heavily guarded places and not alert the sentries - won't learn that either
    3. Learn to use astral spies and kuji kirri to annihilate your enemies - buy ashida kim books
    4. Want to look cool in your tabi and mask - check eBay
    5. Want to call yourself a ninja - you can do that anyway... the only real ones lived in feudal japan
    6. Learn to defend yourself - You can learn that to an extent

    The "koga ryu" ninjitsu that we learn in south africa is a amalgamation of various arts, and a lot of it works. There is elements of aikido, jiu jitsu, karate and even kung fu in what you will learn. The grappling can be effective and the knife and gun techniques can help you if you train a lot... provided it doesn't get you killed.

    On the negative side you will not spar, thus you will be at a total disadvantage in a real fight, if you don't have any full contact martial arts experience you will not be able to rely on your training. Also as I might have previously mentioned a lot of techniques rely on lunge punches.... which doesn't happen in real life (well not often anyway) hence those techniques are useless.
  8. dutch is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/31/2007 12:42pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Ninjitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Well, well..... I personally trained under Stoffel van Vuuren, and to get back to one of the earlier replies regarding Ninjitsu authenticity here in South Africa......

    But first.... let's start in Japan, It was devided up into two provinces "IGA & KOGA" two rivalry clans, both despised each other, for what purpose I don't know. What happened to the "Respect all types of Martial Arts Forms"???? But now, to get back to Soke Van Vuuren....

    I started my training with him in the late 1980's, i won't disclose any other information that "you" might interpret the wrong way. I also hold the rank of Sensei. I have been in the Martial Arts circles now for more than 19 Years, and to answer "Stromchild" yes I do teach that what you seek, not all, and not just to anyone, and I teach in private. Now many have questions regarding the authenticity of Soke Stoffels Rank etc.... I am not affiliated to Him, I am affiliated to the BDFS Internationally, and amongst others.

    Just to give "you" an insiders perspective to your "Allegations" I was 1st Dan and He was 2nd Dan. Before anyone can give hard evidence to this, I still have a photo of myself and Soke van Vuuren while training were He was still a "sempai". So yes I do possess allot of information, but then again who doesn't...... The fact of the matter remains that "you" should get in touch with Soke van Vuuren, and politelly ask for such information. Then if "you" can prove without any doubt that He is a fraud, then I will willingly post more on Him in the future.

    Regarding Cipro, were all businesses have to Register. PSIRA & SASSETA - Security Regulatory Authorities here in South Africa. Well my point is that the Security bodies only are there for the Regulatory purposes and not for the Martial Arts.

    Well that will be all for now.
    Regards
    Dutch - Proudly Koga Hai Lung Ryu
  9. ninjoo is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/31/2007 1:36pm


     Style: Bujinkan

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by dutch
    Well, well..... I personally trained under Stoffel van Vuuren, and to get back to one of the earlier replies regarding Ninjitsu authenticity here in South Africa......

    But first.... let's start in Japan, It was devided up into two provinces "IGA & KOGA" two rivalry clans, both despised each other, for what purpose I don't know. What happened to the "Respect all types of Martial Arts Forms"???? But now, to get back to Soke Van Vuuren....

    I started my training with him in the late 1980's, i won't disclose any other information that "you" might interpret the wrong way. I also hold the rank of Sensei. I have been in the Martial Arts circles now for more than 19 Years, and to answer "Stromchild" yes I do teach that what you seek, not all, and not just to anyone, and I teach in private. Now many have questions regarding the authenticity of Soke Stoffels Rank etc.... I am not affiliated to Him, I am affiliated to the BDFS Internationally, and amongst others.

    Just to give "you" an insiders perspective to your "Allegations" I was 1st Dan and He was 2nd Dan. Before anyone can give hard evidence to this, I still have a photo of myself and Soke van Vuuren while training were He was still a "sempai". So yes I do possess allot of information, but then again who doesn't...... The fact of the matter remains that "you" should get in touch with Soke van Vuuren, and politelly ask for such information. Then if "you" can prove without any doubt that He is a fraud, then I will willingly post more on Him in the future.

    Regarding Cipro, were all businesses have to Register. PSIRA & SASSETA - Security Regulatory Authorities here in South Africa. Well my point is that the Security bodies only are there for the Regulatory purposes and not for the Martial Arts.

    Well that will be all for now.
    Regards
    Dutch - Proudly Koga Hai Lung Ryu
    Dutch,

    Thank you for taking the time to clarify Ninjutsu in South Africa. Also, thank you for that indepth look into the history of Ninjutsu, it was very detailed.

    So you hold the rank of "sensei"? That is a very high rank indeed. Obviously your kung fu is very strong.

    Have you ever trained with Grandmaster Ashida Kim?
  10. dutch is offline

    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    7

    Posted On:
    1/01/2008 11:17am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Ninjitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Ninjoo,

    To your remark regarding Ninjitsu "History" the history is available worldwide via the internet.... I don't waste too much time to explain things regarding history, although sometimes history gets contradicted through "us". LOL

    To your question regarding training with Master Kim, No, I did not have the honour to train with or under him, nor under Christopher Hunter, I trained under various Teachers.....

    I have studied a bit of Wing Tsun Keun but it was only for a short time.

    Regards
    Dutch
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