Stoffel van Vuuren & Barry Pictor, Ninjitsu Bullshidoka in South Africa?

**ninjoo** · Posted On: 1/05/2008 9:29pm

Originally Posted by derrickv

Lineage is useless anyways. Some person could've learned both iga and koga styles, took the best from both styles and call his art 'Johhny's Karate'

Actually "lineage" has tremendous market value.

**derrickv** · Posted On: 1/05/2008 10:19pm

Exactly. That's the only thing it's good for. A person could be a shidoshi or sensei or sifu or guro or whatnot and study an art for whatever how many years and get totally dominated by a naturally gifted person who's been studying whatever art for less than a year.

Originally Posted by ninjoo

Actually "lineage" has tremendous market value.

**Tsuato** · Posted On: 1/07/2008 9:41am

I'm going to take a Quote from Dr Masaaki Hatsumi.

"The taijutsu that I teach is founded in freedom, and the feeling that we are looking for arises out of freedom-of movement. This freedom is so important. A person who does not appreciate how precious freedom is cannot understand my taijutsu. Each person must take individual responsibility for his actions and behaviour, so that these spring from a feeling of freedom and are free. Those who do not have a correct appreciation of freedom are going to create trouble for those around them. To a person who cannot grasp the true idea of freedom, freedom looks like selfishness. But what is to be valued is the type of individualism that is born from and lives in freedom."

taken from Pages 9 & 10 Paperback 'The Grandmasters Book of Ninja Training'

Is it not true the Bujinkan is a way of life? Living the budo is that not a way of life? Is Ninjutsu not a way of life?

I have have adopted Ninjutsu as a way of life I have learnt from my instructors my own sensei who have integrity honour and pride in the knowledge they impart on there students. It's an honour to train with these types of people.

If it where not for certain factors I would most certainly continue my training in Japan. But I am lucky enough to have Sensei here who have shown me a path. They may not have been trained in the Bujinkan ryu. There is always dispute over linage however the knowledge I have gained from learning this and adopting it as a way of life this can never be taken away from me. I can understand what Grandmaster Hatsumi meant by freedom.

Once I obtain my Black belt i will study Bujinkan whether I start at 9th Kyu or not is inconsequential, what is important is that I am continually learning and growing as an individual.

Isn't that the essence of a marital art? Know I doubt very much I could learn this from some one with out conviction or knowledge, integrity or honour?

We learn to further ourselves I know what I know and I am at peace with that. There seems to be a lot of unrest as to authenticity. Continue the discussion perhaps some information will be brought to light.

**Tsuato** · Posted On: 1/07/2008 9:52am

double post - I couldn't find the delete button in this forum. Which I admit is to my detriment.

**Trollzfeckaff** · Posted On: 1/07/2008 2:23pm

What was the point of that off-topic self-fellating double post anyway?

Learn to lurk more Tsuato.

On topic... real ninja's in SA. Blerrie hel... julle is darem moerse cool hoor! Stoffel is such a cool name for a deadly ninja master.

**Tsuato** · Posted On: 1/07/2008 3:36pm

My original post was just implying that yes there are implied discrepancies in the view of lineage and certain instructors.

But if one learns a certain way or sense of self isn't that important?

As the website said they here to dispel the bullshido! I cannot comment on what Stoffel claims.

As I have limited knowledge in Dojo Politics, I have no wish to become involved in mud slinging should no solid evidence be presented. I am not defending any school or any art I am defending a way of living that I have been taught and it pleases me this is all that I am saying.

I will further myself by changing arts and learning new styles and I will take what is best suited to me and retain that. Because to me that the arts stand for continual growth.

I sometimes see these sort of discussions turn into a who said what and this dishevelled posts cluttering the general discussion. And I admit I am doing this now, it seems the very mention of ninjutsu cast's a "dark shadow" on the poster... in question... excuse the attempt at humour.

But all martial arts teach a certain mind set do they not? This is all I am saying once one obtains the mind set its turns to a question of where can I obtain more knowledge?

Regardless of who my Sensei, Sensei, Sensei, Sensei was I've learnt a valuable lesson and its something I'll keep forever as one grows.

(before more comments and quotes arise --- IMPO (In MY PERSONAL Opinion)

**black cat** · Posted On: 4/26/2011 3:48pm

I'm curious as to the outcome of all these allegations?

**PDA** · Posted On: 5/01/2011 4:06pm

A picture can speak 1000 words

**vaquero de las nalgas** · Posted On: 5/04/2011 2:24pm

Originally Posted by shmuel

and ALL the stuff on that page has been stolen from the Bujinkan.

The five elements stuff was taken from Stephen Hayes' books.

All the kamae (ichimonji no kamae, doko no kamae, bobi no kamae etc.) are straight out of the Bujinkan.

Weird. It might be plausible if there were similar names for stances, etc. This, however, has been lifted directly from the Booj.

Saito Fujita discussed other things besides combat techniques as "ninjutsu", mostly having to do with self preservation and reading signs in nature, etc. Throwing a black gi on and lifting techniques from other styles is a much ninjutsu as spray painting walls and pissing in stairwells.