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  1. Rene "Zendokan" Gysenbergs is offline
    Rene "Zendokan" Gysenbergs's Avatar

    fist first Philosopher

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    Posted On:
    12/13/2008 9:17pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Savate (LBF/SD/LC) - BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by American HKD
    Your not well informed and profanity shows your ignorance and poor character.

    Ji is by far the majority source of HKD in the world and Bong Soo Han was a student of Ji he may have seen Choi in some seminars. I have personally seen Master Ji's bok of rank containing the rank he received from GM Ji.

    Han Bong Soo holds no rank from Choi which in Korean Arts is the sign of a Master/Student relationship. Many people claimed Choi was there teacher with no proof mainly after Choi died.

    Remember this is Bullshido and your info is pure BS.

    Go learn your fact and history then come back and talk intellegently.
    English is my third language, what's your excuse?

    Korean history is a minefield, remember the 2000 year old history of Taekwondo.

    My teachings say that GM Han Bong-Soo was a senior student of GM Choi. GM Han Bong-Soo also reckonized GM Ji as a more senior student of GM Choi.
    It's a damn pity that GM Han Bong-Soo past away, or we could have asked him personal.
    I didn't bother to ask him a signed declaration stating him as a student of GM Choi when I had met him in 2000,2002 and 2003.
    Or are you implying that GM Han Bong-Soo was a liar? Be very careful with your answer.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jiujitsu77
    You know you are crazy about BJJ/Martial arts when...
    Quote Originally Posted by Humanzee
    ...your books on Kama Sutra and BJJ are interchangeable.
    Quote Originally Posted by jk55299 on Keysi Fighting Method
    It looks like this is a great fighting method if someone replaces your shampoo with superglue.
    The real deadly:
  2. It is Fake is offline
    It is Fake's Avatar

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    Posted On:
    12/13/2008 9:26pm

    staff
     Style: xingyi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by American HKD
    I see thanks.

    I know MA change and adapt that's to be expected, even GM Ji knows it and talks about it. We're far from blind to change.

    Problem is when "just anybody" makes changes they're often just mixing arts pot luck style and they stir the pot but make no significant contribution to MA.

    In every generation there's only a hand full of real special people the rest are follwers.

    B. Lee, Ji Han Jae, J. Kano, H. Gracie, Ed Parker, Uyesiba, to name a few are rarities.

    These people had a vision and depth to create something big and something worth while.

    Some guy mixing Kung and HKD or Muay Thai and Bjj is not the same thing as the greats.
    It is funny that those who you call greats, are the ones who ended up creating some of the biggest most questioned Martial ats in recent History.

    Minus Kano and Gracie.


    Did you notice something else about your list?

    The two on the list that are highly respected, pretty much without question, do competition based arts.

    I'd also argue rarity vs accepted but, that is another entirely different debate. This thread is about a specific school and we (you primarily) have led to two different derails in the style forums.


    *edit*

    Before you say it, please look up Kano.
    Last edited by It is Fake; 12/13/2008 9:28pm at .
  3. American HKD is offline

    Featherweight

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    Posted On:
    12/14/2008 12:04am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Sinmoo Hapkido, Bjj, FMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Zendokan
    English is my third language, what's your excuse?

    Korean history is a minefield, remember the 2000 year old history of Taekwondo.

    My teachings say that GM Han Bong-Soo was a senior student of GM Choi. GM Han Bong-Soo also reckonized GM Ji as a more senior student of GM Choi.
    It's a damn pity that GM Han Bong-Soo past away, or we could have asked him personal.
    I didn't bother to ask him a signed declaration stating him as a student of GM Choi when I had met him in 2000,2002 and 2003.
    Or are you implying that GM Han Bong-Soo was a liar? Be very careful with your answer.
    It's well known Han Bong Soo was NOT ever a student of Choi and held no rank from CHoi.

    Rank is the Key here nothing else matters, even if Han Bong Soo studied with Choi for some lenght of time it makes no difference.

    Myung Hwang Sik a well student of Ji's and an Instructor from Ji's school Korean schoold the Sung Moo Kwan also claims to be a student of Choi yet has all his ranks under Ji.

    These folks are pure Bullshido.
  4. American HKD is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/14/2008 12:15am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Sinmoo Hapkido, Bjj, FMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by It is Fake
    It is funny that those who you call greats, are the ones who ended up creating some of the biggest most questioned Martial ats in recent History.

    Minus Kano and Gracie.


    Did you notice something else about your list?

    The two on the list that are highly respected, pretty much without question, do competition based arts.

    I'd also argue rarity vs accepted but, that is another entirely different debate. This thread is about a specific school and we (you primarily) have led to two different derails in the style forums.


    *edit*

    Before you say it, please look up Kano.
    I don't put down Judo or Bjj because they compete, as you see I respect them very much.

    HKD has many throws that are the same as Judo from Judo's Jujutsu roots and HKD shares many aspects in common with Bjj, more from the self-defense side vs. the sport side.

    They're all really rooted in Jujutsu anyway so we're all cousins.

    Ok no more derailing back to the subject.

    IMO this school teaches a mix of HKD and other stuff.
  5. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/14/2008 12:25am

    staff
     Style: xingyi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by American HKD
    It's well known Han Bong Soo was NOT ever a student of Choi and held no rank from CHoi.

    Rank is the Key here nothing else matters, even if Han Bong Soo studied with Choi for some lenght of time it makes no difference.

    Myung Hwang Sik a well student of Ji's and an Instructor from Ji's school Korean schoold the Sung Moo Kwan also claims to be a student of Choi yet has all his ranks under Ji.

    These folks are pure Bullshido.
    Okay apparently, after all of these threads, you haven't learned a cardinal rule of bullshio.

    Calling someone bullshido or a fraud needs to be backed up with EVIDENCE.
    Your anecdotal stories and love for your grandmaster is fine.
    Your running around saying your GM is the true Hapkido God is fine.
    You getting upset because we don't fall down in awe of your rank is fine.

    Rank is the Key here nothing else matters, even if Han Bong Soo studied with Choi for some lenght of time it makes no difference.
    Now, this is bullshido. If this is truly the case then Bruce Lee is a bullshido artist.


    Calling someone bullshido or a fraud, without proof, is not. Please post FACTS books, links, (no not wiki), an instructor list, etc. not your opinion.

    Yes, this is one of the few bannable offenses on bullshido.

    Post facts or explicitly state it is your opinion.
    Last edited by It is Fake; 12/14/2008 12:45am at .
  6. American HKD is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/14/2008 8:13am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Sinmoo Hapkido, Bjj, FMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by It is Fake
    Okay apparently, after all of these threads, you haven't learned a cardinal rule of bullshio.

    Calling someone bullshido or a fraud needs to be backed up with EVIDENCE.
    Your anecdotal stories and love for your grandmaster is fine.
    Your running around saying your GM is the true Hapkido God is fine.
    You getting upset because we don't fall down in awe of your rank is fine.

    Now, this is bullshido. If this is truly the case then Bruce Lee is a bullshido artist.


    Calling someone bullshido or a fraud, without proof, is not. Please post FACTS books, links, (no not wiki), an instructor list, etc. not your opinion.

    Yes, this is one of the few bannable offenses on bullshido.

    Post facts or explicitly state it is your opinion.
    BS

    Why don't jump on the guy who made the claim that Han BS is a legit student of Choi???

    He made the ckaim before I said BS, where's his proof.

    If he can make a claim unchallenged and get away with it???

    Do you have double standards when it comes to me???
  7. Urban Achiever is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/14/2008 9:23am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    It looks like we are all back together again. Awesome!
  8. It is Fake is offline
    It is Fake's Avatar

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    Posted On:
    12/14/2008 12:21pm

    staff
     Style: xingyi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by American HKD
    BS

    Why don't jump on the guy who made the claim that Han BS is a legit student of Choi???

    He made the ckaim before I said BS, where's his proof.

    If he can make a claim unchallenged and get away with it???

    Do you have double standards when it comes to me???
    Do you know what Bias is?
    Do you know what a double standard is?
    You called two established teachers frauds. He didn't.

    Let's not try and confuse the issue and why you were dressed down. Of course, you are going to go the semantics route so, lets end your argument right now.

    Quote Originally Posted by AMHKD
    It's well known Han Bong Soo was NOT ever a student of Choi and held no rank from CHoi.

    Rank is the Key here nothing else matters, even if Han Bong Soo studied with Choi for some length of time it makes no difference.

    Myung Hwang Sik a well student of Ji's and an Instructor from Ji's school Korean schoold the Sung Moo Kwan also claims to be a student of Choi yet has all his ranks under Ji.

    These folks are pure Bullshido.

    Now, let's take a look at what Zendokan said:
    Quote Originally Posted by Zendo
    Korean history is a minefield, remember the 2000 year old history of Taekwondo.

    My teachings say that GM Han Bong-Soo was a senior student of GM Choi. [GM Han Bong-Soo also reckonized GM Ji as a more senior student of GM Choi.
    Notice, unlike you, he specifically states "HIS TEACHINGS." He doesn't state is a fact like you do.
    So yes I jumped all over you and not Zendo. No, it isn't bias because, unlike you, he completely and unequivocally explains where his information was found.

    It is the history he learned. So, if you really are a good teacher, you'd show him and everyone else why he is wrong. Of course, in your obvious arrogance and poor teaching skills, you can't/won't ever do that.

    Just to make sure you understand:

    Quote Originally Posted by AMHKD
    These folks are pure Bullshido.
    VS.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zendokan
    My teachings say that GM Han Bong-Soo was a senior student of GM Choi.
    Can "teachings" be wrong? Of course. Than again, that is why Bullshido and the style forums exist, to educate people.

    Oh and quit being a child. Even my children know better than to throw blame on someone else.

    "OMG look at what Zendo did...!!!" Worry about yourself and your actions not Zendo.


    Prove him wrong, with facts, or STFU.
  9. American HKD is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/14/2008 1:07pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Sinmoo Hapkido, Bjj, FMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Your a joke

    Ji Han Jae who is Bong Soo Hans senior proved it to me, I saw first hand the proof. That's better than some guys 3rd hand claim.

    Proof comes from Korean Master and Historian He Young Kimm's books HKD bible and his new Book Hapkido History that came out 2008.

    Han stated that he first began his study of Hapkido under its founder, Yong Sul Choi, in 1953.

    However some of his contemporaries like Kwon Tae-Man (Senior to Han as well) and Kimm He-Young assert that his training began first in Ji Han Jae's Sung Moo Kwan group and training with Choi Yong Sul came at a later time in seminar fashion.

    Again Han himself never produced a rank certificate showing he held rank from Choi. Han never backed up his own bogus claim fortunate for him people wouldn't ask him to produce the certificate. Now only the ignorant in HKD believe such claims

    Kimm, He-Young. Hapkido II. Andrew Jackson Press, Baton Rouge, Louisiana, 1994.
    Kimm, He-Young.Hapkido (alternately The Hapkido Bible). Andrew Jackson Press, Baton Rouge, Louisiana 1991

    You can buy these well respect books from this link

    http://hanmudo.com/merchandise.html

    Nowe let this guy produce a copy of his rank certificate!
  10. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/14/2008 1:29pm

    staff
     Style: xingyi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    "You are" I see you still can't get it right. I can't be a joke you actually tried to produce some evidence. Most people ignore a "joke."

    Oh and you still haven't proven he is a fraud. Hell, if he studied at seminars that does make him a student.
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