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  1. h_sh_m is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/15/2007 1:41am


     Style: Injured for 1+ years

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Oh, on the other points:

    1) I don't mind UFC=MMA right now, because I think the UFC has a pretty damn good ruleset and great competitors. So it's kinda protecting MMA from turning into the sensationalistic nonsense that is the IFL. But this definetly needs to change, because it's bad for the fighters and there are some pretty good leagues out there that need to get some burn (Bodog for example).

    2) Yeah i miss Pride too.

    3) I think it's disingenous for us to complain about MMA being called a Bloodsport. Initially we got done dirty by prejudice. But nowadays it's so well known that the main reason the bloodsport stigma remains is due to our efforts to maintain it. People like Dana White spend half their time extolling it as a safe athletic competition while promoting the UFC using gladiator imagery, editing promos showing knockouts, knees, blood, and using phrases like "this kid'll rip your face off" (I think he said something like that about Joe Lauzon on TUF) and creating titles like UFC 89 'Hateful Blood Fire'.
    And forget Dana White, so many of the guys doing it are constantly boasting about it's brutality. How many times did you hear the words "smash his face" in the latest season of TUF? How many of y'all honestly don't boast about how brutal your hobby is? (sure some of you don't, but you know a bunch of you do)
    Realize Judo guys call themselves Judo *players*, not Judo fighters. I don't think you'll hear them boast too much saying dumb **** like 'Tap or Snap!'. But hell, so many people who are knowledgeable about MMA pimp the violence.
    And you know what? It's all good. Go for it. But please shut the **** up and stop complaining about being portrayed as a bloodsport when (if you're an owner) you're caking off of it or (if you're an MMA hobbyist) you're winning that much needed fear and admiration from your uninformed peers.


    ..Oops, NoMan just said the same thing in point#3 while i was posting. Glad someone else noticed it too.
    Last edited by h_sh_m; 10/15/2007 1:45am at .
  2. PasleyPMT is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/15/2007 3:19pm


     Style: Muay Thai

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by h_sh_m

    UFC 89 'Hateful Blood Fire'...How many times did you hear the words "smash his face" in the latest season of TUF? How many of y'all honestly don't boast about how brutal your hobby is?...
    I admit I've been proud of participating in a sport that is mostly for "tough guys," although I haven't boasted of it.

    It just seems as though too many MMA competitors rely on the "badass" image. Although all of them are talented athletes it seems like they feel like, or they're forced, to present an almost comical persona.
  3. Don Gwinn is online now
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    BJJ wins again!

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    Posted On:
    10/15/2007 3:37pm

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     Style: Guns

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    First of all, the average football fan knows **** all about football. He thinks he knows all about it, but generally, that's self-delusion.

    Secondly, both teams getting booed for things like a scoreless half happens in football all the time--in certain places with certain cultures. Mess up in Pittsburgh or Philadelphia and they'll boo you. On the other hand, screw up in Chicago, and people will laugh and say "Wait till next year!"

    Third, it is possible to wish Zuffa had more competition without hating Zuffa. I think Zuffa does a lot more right than they do wrong. I just think it would still be better if they had a major competitor.

    Fourth, if you think MMA fighters are stupid or classless, you should look into pro football, basketball, and baseball. Those sports are full of thugs . . . . and guys who would come up way short on IQ tests. That's what you get when you tell somebody that nobody is ever going to care whether he does, thinks, or creates anything worth knowing about as long as he can read a defense. That's just the natural consequence of paying men millions of dollars for playing a child's game.
    *********************************************
  4. TehDeadlyDimMak is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/15/2007 3:48pm


     Style: Sanda, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Vince Tortelli
    Why is it that whenever anyone starts talking about "Things That Are Bad in MMA" David Abbot is usually the first one mentioned? I never got that. It's not like he blatantly cheated in his matches a la Gerard Gordeu, or was blatantly disrespectful to his opponents like Ortiz, Bisping, Diaz, etc, etc. And his brutal beat downs weren't any worse than those perpetuated by Cro Cop, Wanderlei, or Butterbean.
    I personally always thought he was a fun guy to watch, always brought some pizaz to a card, since he was either going to give or receive a brutal KO (or get caught in a slick submission).

    WAR TANK! BEAT KIMBO!
    Mocking the convulsions of an unconscious opponent had something to do with it. I personally found Tank entertaining as well, but at this point he's being signed for his street cred rather than his talent.

    I have no problem with him being in an undercard, but headlining a main event feels like a waste to me.
  5. Vince Tortelli is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/15/2007 3:52pm

    supporting member
     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Actually I believe the Tank/Kimbo fight was cancelled, which I think was a shame. Beating Tank (I was supporting the original Huntington Beach Bad Boy, but let's face it, he hasn't won a fight in a long time) would have been a great next step for Kimbo. It will be interesting to see what EliteXC does with Mr. Slice now that he has signed with them.
  6. Kintanon is offline
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    Yes, I am smarter than you are.

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    Posted On:
    10/15/2007 3:55pm

    supporting memberstaff
     Style: TKD, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by PasleyPMT
    You and Wolf do make good points, but I still believe in what I said. He might not be the stupidest person in the world, but the point I was trying to make was that the majority of people would see him as a howling buffoon.

    People might see one fight that Rampage commented on or see one of his interviews and immediately think, "Damn, is that what MMA fighters are like?"

    To me, from what I've seen from countless interviews, post-fight "talk throughs", and TV specials, he's pretty dense.

    Plus, I didn't start a post about Rampage. I started a post about my stupid opinions.
    Not to mention, Rampage is probably better educated than you are at this point in your life. He did go to Junior College before getting in to MMA. He's not some brain dead thug. He's also VERY eloquent and humorous in his interviews. I think he's probably a good spokesperson for the sport.
  7. Teh El Macho is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/15/2007 4:59pm

    supporting member
     Style: creonte on hiatus

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by PasleyPMT
    As a fellow Memphian I'm kind of ashamed to acknowledge that Quinton Jackson was born a few miles away from me.
    What exactly do you know about him that makes you embarrased?

    And just so that there is no mistake or confusion, let me rephrase the question, in bold and capitals, with the most important verb collored in yellow:

    WHAT EXACTLY DO YOU KNOW ABOUT HIM?


    -- edit --

    Just so you know, he publicly condemned the judges that gave him a split win over Murilo 'Ninja' Rua. He publicly said Ninja won the fight and tried to give him the trophy, in front of the camera, in front of the judges, in front of the audience. That's the type of man that embarrasses you.

    I'm really looking to hear an answer to my question, because, quite honestly, I don't think you know what the **** you've been talking about about Jackson at all.
    Last edited by Teh El Macho; 10/15/2007 5:05pm at .
    Read this for flexibility and injury prevention, this, this and this for supplementation, this on grip conditioning, and this on staph. New: On strenght standards, relationships and structural balance. Shoulder problems? Read this.

    My crapuous vlog and my blog of training, stuff and crap. NEW: Me, Mrs. Macho and our newborn baby.

    New To Weight Training? Get the StrongLifts 5x5 program and Rippetoe's "Starting Strength, 2nd Ed". Wanna build muscle/gain weight? Check this article. My review on Tactical Nutrition here.

    t-nation - Dissecting the deadlift. Anatomy and Muscle Balancing Videos.

    The street argument is retarded. BJJ is so much overkill for the street that its ridiculous. Unless you're the idiot that picks a fight with the high school wrestling team, barring knife or gun play, the opponent shouldn't make it past double leg + ground and pound - Osiris
  8. PasleyPMT is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/15/2007 6:21pm


     Style: Muay Thai

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Seeing as how tons of people think everyone from the South is stupid anyway, I figured Jackson would add to the bad reputation.

    I base my opinions on the way he conducts himself sometimes.

    I guess a lot more people on this site like him than not. People have called me stupid repeatedly, yet someone who foolishly represents himself (sometimes) on TV gets defended by people who don't know him.

    This thread is not about Quinton Jackson.

    I made one comment based on the things I've seen on TV and the internet. If someone disagrees with my opinions on Jackson-fine.
  9. NoMan is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/15/2007 7:35pm


     Style: Boxing, Judo, BJJ, M.T.

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Don Gwinn
    First of all, the average football fan knows **** all about football. He thinks he knows all about it, but generally, that's self-delusion.
    Please, the man who knew most about football was Dennis Miller. I'd say comparatively, if you were to have a test like "What's an option?" versus "What's a kimura", more fans of football would know what the option was versus a kimura, and that's a basic move. "Name three sweeps from the bottom", "defend against a guillotine", would be way beyond them. But, they do know enough to tell the difference between a rushing and passing play, how to return a punt, block a fieldgoal, etc.

    Secondly, both teams getting booed for things like a scoreless half happens in football all the time--in certain places with certain cultures.
    Have not seen it myself, I'll take your word on it. But it seems to happen incessently with MMA, even when it's not warranted.

    Fourth, if you think MMA fighters are stupid or classless, you should look into pro football, basketball, and baseball.
    Please don't forget soccer. It's known as a wuss sport in the states, (mostly), but the Europeans who play it tend to be in and out of court trouble.

    And I gotta ditto what everyone else says, Jackson is an awesome dude.
  10. Teh El Macho is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/15/2007 9:00pm

    supporting member
     Style: creonte on hiatus

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by PasleyPMT
    Seeing as how tons of people think everyone from the South is stupid anyway, I figured Jackson would add to the bad reputation.
    Hmmm, your stupid, baseless assumption about Jackson's conduct, education or IQ level didn't help much, you know.

    Quote Originally Posted by PasleyPMT
    I base my opinions on the way he conducts himself sometimes.
    Can you specify what exactly is wrong with his conduct that makes you say you are ashamed of being near where he's from?

    Quote Originally Posted by PasleyPMT
    I guess a lot more people on this site like him than not.
    It's not much about liking, but about respecting. He's quite an intelligent individual who's playing on a character to sell himself (just as Bas Rutten and Griffin have done) with an incredible work ethic - see my previous reference to his behavior towards "Ninja" Rua - you don't see that in MMA, or any combat sports ever. For that, he gets my respect.

    Quote Originally Posted by PasleyPMT
    People have called me stupid repeatedly, yet someone who foolishly represents himself (sometimes) on TV gets defended by people who don't know him.
    Well, there are two situations here:

    1. A person who doesn't know Jackson says he's embarrased to be from the same region he is and makes a whole bunch of unfounded assumptions on his character and level of education... despite the fact that he doesn't know him at all, simply because he finds his TV character foolish.

    2. A bunch of MMA fans (educated MMA fans) who although do not know Jackson personally, respect him not just for selling himself well, but for being educated, a superb athlete with outstanding work ethics, and who has no qualms to disagree in TV with the judges for giving him a win he didn't deserve... despite the fact they don't know him personally.

    Which of the two responses is stupider?

    Moreover, what have you done that deserves defending or respect over Jackson?

    If you think Jackson is stupid, even though you don't know him, why shouldn't we think you are stupid even though we don't know you?

    Quote Originally Posted by PasleyPMT
    This thread is not about Quinton Jackson.
    Dude, you don't have much of a saying on what this thread is about or not. The moment you made a stupid comment on an known athlete opened the door for others to hijack the thread and tell you that you are wrong. Think a little bit about the stuff you post or say next time.

    Quote Originally Posted by PasleyPMT
    I made one comment based on the things I've seen on TV and the internet.
    So don't be surprised if people are vocal in disagreeing with you. As for the internet, there is enough about him... you know... on the internet, to see some of your assumptions are waaaaaay off.

    Quote Originally Posted by PasleyPMT
    If someone disagrees with my opinions on Jackson-fine.
    I'm fine telling you I disagree with you and that your original post on Jackson was really, really, really uneducated... and stupid.
    Read this for flexibility and injury prevention, this, this and this for supplementation, this on grip conditioning, and this on staph. New: On strenght standards, relationships and structural balance. Shoulder problems? Read this.

    My crapuous vlog and my blog of training, stuff and crap. NEW: Me, Mrs. Macho and our newborn baby.

    New To Weight Training? Get the StrongLifts 5x5 program and Rippetoe's "Starting Strength, 2nd Ed". Wanna build muscle/gain weight? Check this article. My review on Tactical Nutrition here.

    t-nation - Dissecting the deadlift. Anatomy and Muscle Balancing Videos.

    The street argument is retarded. BJJ is so much overkill for the street that its ridiculous. Unless you're the idiot that picks a fight with the high school wrestling team, barring knife or gun play, the opponent shouldn't make it past double leg + ground and pound - Osiris
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