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  1. Sophist is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/09/2007 10:09am


     Style: Judo, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    There isn't a lot of good weapons defence out there, period. Usual recommendations on this board include the STAB program (Survival Tactics Against Blade) and the Dog Brothers' material. These are heavily grappling-based because, frankly, trying to outstrike someone with a weapon is suicidal.

    Historic defence against a weapon while unarmed - western martial arts manuals, classical jujitsu - is again all grappling all of the time, and was usually seen as a collection of chancy stuff used as a last resort.

    However, most grappling arts as taught today do not focus heavily on dealing with an armed attacker. Tomiki Aikido does, but the restrictions on allowable techniques for the attacker and defender is often felt to severely compromise the effectiveness it achieves. And, obviously, there are lots of lying bastards out there in a variety of arts claiming to teach realistic self-defence against weapons who're trying to make worthless techniques look good through the power of choreography.
  2. Sophist is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/09/2007 10:15am


     Style: Judo, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    It's also worth pointing out that the Dog Brothers, who're some of the best stickfighters around, added BJJ to their repertoire after finding out how difficult it could be to stop someone rushing in and grappling you even when you have a stick to strike with. This evolved into what they call stickgrappling.

    Obviously this is less of a concern for someone with a sharp weapon who will need relatively little force to inflict devastating wounds. Against someone with a knife, you're well advised to do everything in your power to escape rather than tackle them.
  3. Lebell is offline
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    Just waiting for the paperboy.

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    Posted On:
    10/09/2007 10:47am

    supporting member
     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Rivington
    You're walking through your local Super Wal-Mart, buying a 55 gallon drum of cinnamon for a dollar when suddenly AL-QAEDA ATTACKS!
    uhm..fall on your knees and cry out: 'allahu ackbar, brothers! lets destroy these christian dogs!!!'

    ?
  4. Permalost is offline
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    pro nonsense self defense

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    Posted On:
    10/09/2007 12:17pm

    supporting member
     Style: FMA, dumbek, Indian clubs

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Listen to Sophist.
  5. AlienGunfighter is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/09/2007 12:50pm


     Style: Krav Maga (4), BJJ white

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Rivington
    You're walking through your local Super Wal-Mart, buying a 55 gallon drum of cinnamon for a dollar when suddenly AL-QAEDA ATTACKS!
    You're walking down the street when suddenly a SPACESHIP lands and disgorges a HORDE OF GAY ILLEGAL ALIEN LIBERALS who start giving ABORTIONS to people WHETHER THEY NEED ONE OR NOT!!!:zalien: :zalien: :zalien:

    Seriously though, a few months ago some freako went nuts in a local supermarket and started stabbing and slashing people with a knife. That (and gunpoint ATM robberies) are the flavor where I live. Those are more likely than me going to look for trouble in a bar or a dark alley.
  6. S0meguy is offline

    Featherweight

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    Posted On:
    10/09/2007 2:00pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Kyukido, TKD, Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I have t3h r34l knife defense here, and I learned it in Judo!

  7. recourse is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/09/2007 6:35pm


     Style: BJJ / MT

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by AlienGunfighter
    You're walking down the street when suddenly a SPACESHIP lands and disgorges a HORDE OF GAY ILLEGAL ALIEN LIBERALS who start giving ABORTIONS to people WHETHER THEY NEED ONE OR NOT!!!:zalien: :zalien: :zalien:

    Seriously though, a few months ago some freako went nuts in a local supermarket and started stabbing and slashing people with a knife. That (and gunpoint ATM robberies) are the flavor where I live. Those are more likely than me going to look for trouble in a bar or a dark alley.
    While those may be MORE likely than trouble in a bar they are still pretty UNLIKELY to happen to YOU.
  8. Sharkonis is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/09/2007 6:47pm


     Style: Tae Kwon Do, MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    While Krav Maga is not a " grappling MA so to speak, it has a wide range of defensive moves designed to disarm, stun, injure or kill.

    While serving in the USMC I trained for a breif while with the IDF. Our instructor was Herb Samra, who's idea of praticle application for training was to take us out in town and stir some **** at a night club in the hopes of someone pulling a weapon, preferably a knife.

    Sometimes it works, sometimes Oh **** !!
  9. antman is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/09/2007 7:37pm


     Style: Silat, New to Hsing- Yi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I thought Sambo might teach it. Several years ago a friend went to a Demo and thw guy was doing bat defense and doing throws off the swings
  10. aaaargh is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/09/2007 7:40pm


     Style: Inept BJJer

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by pnwnorseman
    Wow so assholes are out in force today. Well allow me to retort. I understand not everyone uses martial arts as self defense, but again that is not what I was asking was it? I was very carefull to phrase my question to only include not only grappling but grappling as a form of self defense because it was the most obvious style with lack of weapons training. And I used the street/bar fight scenario because that is what most people use as their theoretical scenario setting for fights on this board. I enjoyed the swinging a bo staff or sword in a dead pattern comment. What pattern a fucking triangle? Am I chasing you with a pool cue tracing the outline of a fucking trapazoid? . What am I training in my garage by myself in your mind? Is Star Wars Kid my fucking mentor here? You don't need to be an expert with something to use it effectively. Also twKoxinga I understand that there are no garuntees in fighting, but isn't that why you take martial arts? To better your chances of winning by learning how to fight in different ranges, styles, with different tools? Silly me asking if your art had a certain element of combat in it. I should know better.

    Also the "when you're grappling you can somewhat control the guy, so maybe you can lessen the damage inflicted if you can dominate them, however, this isn't really what grappling trains for." Yeah TMA doesn't train much to defend against grappling but people on this fucking board SURE do love to bring out how grappling destroys striking arts so hows about a few less double standards? The question wasn't "Does grappling train to defend against poorly trained aikido fighters? Does grappling train to lessen damage if I am dominating my opponent?" The question was very simple and logical. The majority of martial arts train in some variety of weapons. I was curious if grappling arts did too. And I guess I was a bit foolish to think that people training in a MARTIAL ART would be doing so for some sort of defense benefit. Aparently a lot of pacifists in Lebell's school, probably Aikido. Its a martial art and in training it you are training to learn to fight...thats where the martial comes from. You want to get in shape and be healthier go to a fucking 24 hour fitness and get some cardioboxing in. When has anyone ever trained in a grappling art to learn how to not fight? Lebell if you believe that not everyone trains in MA to learn to fight then why are you on a board that is dedicated to stopping the spread of martial arts that don't teach usefull fighting skills?

    Seriously is this just because grappling doesn't train any weapons and people are getting defnesive? Thats fine! I wasn't trying to rag on any art, I was just curious. I know about cross training arts to fill gaps between fighting styles but some arts don't require as much cross training as others. BTW responses like this are why people think grapplers and MMAers are arrogant. Just like they look down on TMAers. "You questioned my arts ability in an area? YOU ARE WRONG AND AN ASSHOLE!!!"
    Virtually no grappling style teaches realistic weapon-specific defense.

    Satisfied, I hope.
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