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  1. SFGOON is offline
    SFGOON's Avatar

    and humble, too!

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    Posted On:
    9/30/2007 10:46pm


     Style: Systema, BJJ, Arrestling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    But what if you don't want to kill the person, just nonviolently engage them? I would rather be mugged than harm a brother (or sister!) human being, who, out of oppression and desperation, tries to rob me and rape my wife. This is why aikido is great for self defense, and all handguns should be melted down and made into a shrine for world peace and understanding.
  2. AikiZenDragon is offline

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    Posted On:
    9/30/2007 11:25pm


     Style: Aikido

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Virus
    "wrist grab", which means catching the punch out of the air like aikido, crapkido ect.

    well trying to describe physical movements verbally is tough... and i agree with you this is total bullshit, BUT this sequence might be better described as blocking/parrying the blow and trapping the arm leading into an arm/wrist control/grasp...

    this is noobie mistake number one in aikido and some other arts... trying to reach out and pluck the arm/wrist in mid air... you see similar types of moves in JKD and FMA where the initial contact with the attack is not a grab but more establishing contact with the attacking arm or leg and then transitioning into some sort of grab or hold

    :occasion1
  3. Vince Tortelli is offline

    Light Heavyweight

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    Posted On:
    9/30/2007 11:28pm

    supporting member
     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Wasn't it one of these "make contact with attacking arm or leg" moves that got Randy Couture's arm broken against Napao?
  4. AikiZenDragon is offline

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    Posted On:
    9/30/2007 11:46pm


     Style: Aikido

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    and those little gloves do not prevent you from breaking your hand... i have never heard of something like the described technique happening, but rich franklin broke his hand with those gloves on, although i think it was as a result of a punch... and i am waiting for some GNPer to bust his hand/wrist when he misses and hits the mat just so... any time two objects make forceful contact there is a chance of some sort of breaking or injury, but generally speaking this is why "hard" force against force blocks are not the only method of making contact with an attacking limb or weapon, but they do have their place in your tool box.
  5. Naszir is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/01/2007 12:17am


     Style: BJJ, Judo, SAMBO

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Vince Tortelli
    Wasn't it one of these "make contact with attacking arm or leg" moves that got Randy Couture's arm broken against Napao?
    No. He raised his arms up to block the shin with his forearms and got the nightstick fracture. I think the kali destruction he was referring to is more of a parry into the elbow than grabbing/blocking the shot.

    However, speak of the devil...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l9t56owrkHE
  6. ysc87 is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/01/2007 12:26am


     Style: crapp-lawl-ing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by AikiZenDragon
    but generally speaking this is why "hard" force against force blocks are not the only method of making contact with an attacking limb or weapon, but they do have their place in your tool box.
    (Small radius/forward moving + angled) hard blocks "have their place" in an effective fighter's toolbox because they are, simply put, much easier to apply under pressure than other types, and also generally leave you in a significantly better position to hit back (unless talking about going against an easily parried jab).

    I think what you're talking about in the other post is what I would call (don't know the official term) an "attacking" block. It's where you stuff any defensive/offensive movements your opponent would make by (anticipating your opponent's response/planning your own attack) and making inital contact with the opponent's lead defending limb/s before transitioning to something else, thanks to quick response times. IMHO, it's what actually applicable 'trapping'/stop-hitting is. I saw a short DB clip on youtube that explained what I'm talking about pretty well... I think it was "kali tudo."
  7. AikiZenDragon is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/01/2007 12:36am


     Style: Aikido

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    i am actually meaning both beating him to the punch (stop hit) or as in the excellent video making contact after the attack is launched... either way you never really start the MOVE trying to GRAB HIS WRIST, but after the contact is made (either hard block or soft parry) transitioning/flowing into a grasp of some kind... i have done some arnis and had the privilege of going to a few seminars with Remy Presas and found the way they flowed into the trap/grab was almost identical to how it was done and explained to me in aikido... i can't tell you how many times i was told by my sensei "DON"T GRAB!" and when i watched beginners it started to sink in that you don't grab you just flow into the grab... you have to gain position and setup the grab... if you just start grabbing of course it never works...
  8. eyebeams is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/01/2007 2:47am


     Style: Kickboxing/Grappling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I think the consensus around here is a little rough on standing joint locks. They have their place. It's not the kind of thing you're going to pull off on a cautious person probing in and out of striking range and choosing their angle of attack, but that's not how things go all the time and in those cases, a standin lock is sometimes a quicker way to get the result you want. I have in fact done the whole "wristlock from shirt grab" thing to somebody who wanted to cave my face in and dumped them satisfactorily -- twice. I don't think they're all created equal, though; the standing shoulder lock and wrist out turn (kotegaeshi in aikido) are the two that seem to do okay in some situations.
  9. Virus is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/01/2007 3:06am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I know what you are talking about with the "don't grab" thing. We were taught that in bujinkan. I think you mean it's like a block but you cup over the hand after attachment has been made. I agree that it's less silly than snatching a punch out of the air. Although I don't think the wrist as a primary point of control is very effective.
  10. Homersmyid is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/01/2007 4:15am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: TKD

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    OK, I think I understand where you guys are coming from. I guess a bunch of people come on claiming that their style is a "killing art"and can't be used in the ring. So making claims and offering no verifiable way to prove it?

    In this way I totally agree with the idea of testing out your skills in a MMA stlye match, because even if you weren't trying to be champion, you'd still want to know if you have any obvious weaknesses. If you can get taken down in 2 seconds then pretty much you can't DEFEND YOUR SELF (a very important component of self defense, or so I'm told)

    And BTW, I wan't trying to provoke anything. It's just that well there's alot of Bullshido in bjj. Many of the same guys who as kids thought wrestling was real are now the guys that idol worship the MMA tournaments and are armchair warriors. But from reading this forum I can see that there's serious people from a variety of backgrounds, and I'm learing alot. And my training is in TKD mostly. I really didn't want to put anything because I hardly have any experience, and came here partly to get some ideas of where to go. I mean there's no Krav or BJJ anywere near me, however it seem that judo is pretty regarded, there might be one in my area.
    Last edited by Homersmyid; 10/01/2007 4:21am at .
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