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  1. ironlurker is offline
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    How do Chameleon Circuit?

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    Posted On:
    9/21/2007 6:46pm


     Style: jkd

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    To make this argument stronger you'd need examples of where schools were held liable in some way for training violent offenders.
  2. JJson is offline

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    Posted On:
    9/21/2007 7:06pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I would not sign up at a school that did background checks and I have nothing to hide. It is the principle. We're a free nation. People like privacy.
  3. JJson is offline

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    Posted On:
    9/21/2007 7:13pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by new2bjj
    How many instructors/school owners do background checks of a potential student's arrest record? I just ask this because, as we learn more and more effective ways to bust someone up, isn't there some responsibility to NOT teach thugs? Or, do we just hope that the moral teachings or chi cultivation takes care of all the bad intentions?
    There is a better way to deal with this-- Have a code of conduct policy. It is simpler and does not invade anyones privacy.
  4. ffsparky26 is offline

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    Posted On:
    9/21/2007 7:19pm

    supporting member
     Style: MMA/BJJ/Kickboxing

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Our club does, but we are a MMA based combatives club so we go shoot pistols together and do knife work too. It's like RBSD paranoia with aliveness. We require a valid CCW permit, LEO or Mil Creds, or getting a state background check.

    You can get in big trouble for having a felon around guns, not shooting just around. So we require the permit/creds.

    The 9/11 hijackers trained with a guy named Burt Rodreguiez in FL, CBC Article on 9/11 attackers training

    Burt Rodreguiez trained a couple of them in kickboxing and knife work.
  5. Kid Miracleman is offline
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    Rowsdower!

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    Posted On:
    9/21/2007 9:20pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: On Hiatus

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I'd feel uncomfortable going to a school that requires a background check before I'm allowed to receive any type of instruction. Do private secondary schools and private universities normally implement such policies? If so, then a martial arts school could probably get away with doing this on account of the precedent set by these private institutions.

    Then again, I'm not a lawyer (nor did I attend any private schools), so my opinion probably wouldn't count very much...
  6. new2bjj is offline

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    Posted On:
    9/21/2007 9:21pm


     Style: TKD, MT, KEMPO

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I like all the answers- I like my privacy, but, at the same time, I worry that some guy that is a bully is going to be even harded to deal with. I'm thinking of it more of in the moral sense, not one more law or liability. We've got enough laws and regulations for some pretty trivial ****, and on the other hand, not enough for the important stuff.
  7. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    9/21/2007 9:36pm

    staff
     Style: xingyi

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by ffsparky26
    Our club does, but we are a MMA based combatives club so we go shoot pistols together and do knife work too. It's like RBSD paranoia with aliveness. We require a valid CCW permit, LEO or Mil Creds, or getting a state background check.

    You can get in big trouble for having a felon around guns, not shooting just around. So we require the permit/creds.

    The 9/11 hijackers trained with a guy named Burt Rodreguiez in FL, CBC Article on 9/11 attackers training

    Burt Rodreguiez trained a couple of them in kickboxing and knife work.
    There are schools like yours in every state that are exlusive to what you named. It doesn't prevent anything really IMO. If someone is going to nut up they will, regardless of credentials.


    I know give me time.
  8. Virus is offline
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    Senior Member

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    Posted On:
    9/21/2007 10:01pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Judo

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    My judo club is so hard we only take people that have done time.
  9. Marrt is offline
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    Posted On:
    9/21/2007 10:16pm


     Style: default std

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by new2bjj
    I like all the answers- I like my privacy, but, at the same time, I worry that some guy that is a bully is going to be even harded to deal with. I'm thinking of it more of in the moral sense, not one more law or liability. We've got enough laws and regulations for some pretty trivial ****, and on the other hand, not enough for the important stuff.
    I think this poses a couple of different issues, that aren't insurmountable, but would make it ultimately unattractive to most school owners (assuming most school owners aren't exactly "making bank" running a martial arts school).

    1) Information privacy - if I'm soliciting this kind of information regarding members and prospective members, how am I managing this information? how am I storing it? who has access? what am I signing up for regarding protecting individuals information and the disposal and disclosure of it? And what do I have a right to know regarding someone's background check and what "crime" constitutes refusal vs. acceptance? Does it become an ongoing thing - year over year my members get ongoing checks in-case they do something during the year? $30 will go up pretty quickly and I doubt my members are going to love me passing on those costs

    2) By implication - to protect society or protect my business - why shouldn't I extend the same concern to the health of prospective clients - shouldn't all my clients produce a valid medical certificate from their doctor confirming they have no health issues that might inhibit their training or create a serious issue (collapse on the floor in my class). ****! I oughta be able to know that too, to protect my business and potentially for the greater good, I mean - it wouldn't be good if I killed someone in class - think of the impact on their family

    3) Rigor and standards - so, if I can ask you for your criminal record because I want to not teach "the skillz" to crims that might aid them in their felonious activities. Then, you should probably expect me to be able to prove that my teachable "skillz" really are deadly (or at least as dangerous as I suggest) or else I should perhaps expect to be sued for invasion of privacy with insufficient cause, false advertising, fraud - take your pick. An end to McDojo and bullshido - except that many instructors probably realize what a bunch of ass their training is, so - they're not going to advocate anything that might put an onus on them to actually prove anything.

    cheers
  10. JJson is offline

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    Posted On:
    9/21/2007 10:35pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Marrt
    2) By implication - to protect society or protect my business - why shouldn't I extend the same concern to the health of prospective clients - shouldn't all my clients produce a valid medical certificate from their doctor confirming they have no health issues that might inhibit their training or create a serious issue (collapse on the floor in my class).
    LOL, and while they are doing a background check and getting medical information, why not ask for a credit check?

    Once this becomes the norm, then the businesses can change clauses to sell the information they obtain. That will offset the cost of obtaining the information.

    This is a bad path to start on.
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