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  1. Virus is offline
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    Senior Member

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    Aug 2005
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    Australia
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    Posted On:
    10/09/2007 7:33am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    You've got to wonder about these instructors out there that are teaching these "good enough" techniques. Did he actually point out that it isn't likely to work against a real takedown? I'd hazard a guess that he taught it as valid grappling defense, then when you were called on it by actual grapplers here you rationalized training in the nonsense as being "good enough" against someone that doesn't train.
  2. It is Fake is offline
    It is Fake's Avatar

    Administrator

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    Posted On:
    10/09/2007 7:47am

    staff
     Style: xingyi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I doubt it. My McDojo instructors never did. They were adamant about the elbow to the spine and the eye gouge. What's sad is reading the noobs and other boards it is a universal lie in the TMA world.

    I read these threads and hear the exact same excuses from every area of the US. All you have to do is read threads from Kamon guy, Tonu(early posts), Scyber Monk etc, to see it is a world wide lie.

    The lie continues even after the TMA vs BJJ abortion of JFS vs OS. Seriously whether you believe OS owned or not, you can't deny both techniques failed.

    You train eye gouges, elbows to the spine and dirty fighting. You are then taken out by a BJJ guy who bites you finger. Does anyone else see the irony? I watched three TMA truths get shattered in that video.
    1) Elbows to the spine are not a high percentage technique.
    2) Eye gouges are not a high percentage techniques
    3) Bites can be done by an untrained grappler.

    These are all excuses I have read and arguments I have had in private.
  3. Kamon Guy is offline

    Registered Member

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    Nov 2005
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    Posted On:
    10/11/2007 10:11am


     Style: Wing Chun

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    If someone tries to take you down to the floor, fight it, but be ready for floorwork.
    There is no way that you can stop a takedown by a good BJJ practitioner by using spine attacks or eye gauges etc.

    Sure you might get lucky on an untrained fighter who is trying to rugby tackle you, but too many kung fu people believe that 'they will never get taken to the ground'

    They will

    A lot of the good wing chun schools (yes I said good and wing chun in the same sentence), will work on BJJ, catch wrestling or sombo to cover clinch work and floorwork.

    You can't stretch an art to cover everything
  4. Jadonblade is offline
    Jadonblade's Avatar

    Hoo Ha!

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    Sep 2007
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    england
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    1,676

    Posted On:
    10/20/2007 6:37am

    supporting member
     Style: San Da, Judo, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    In a good Kung fu school you will be taken to ground and hard. But then left alone and allowed to stand up. Which is a shame but its a movement in the right direction. However I am unsure about Shuai Jiao, I know it involves alot of stand up grappling. I dont think it involves much on the ground, similar to judo. I could well be wrong though.

    A good kung fu school should have San Da and Shuai Jiao in addition to its traditional art, in my opinion. My school did not offer Shuai Jiao :(.
  5. Mor Sao is offline
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    Nothing for Show, All for use

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    Aug 2005
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    Tampa, Florida
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    1,622

    Posted On:
    10/20/2007 9:15am

    supporting member
     Style: Jook Lum South Mantis,

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Jadonblade
    In a good Kung fu school you will be taken to ground and hard. But then left alone and allowed to stand up. Which is a shame but its a movement in the right direction. However I am unsure about Shuai Jiao, I know it involves alot of stand up grappling. I dont think it involves much on the ground, similar to judo. I could well be wrong though.

    A good kung fu school should have San Da and Shuai Jiao in addition to its traditional art, in my opinion. My school did not offer Shuai Jiao :(.
    Combat Shuai is not sport shuai. In combat you would throw him on his head or into something or you would stick something sharp into him(an icepick or knife) use it as a handle and throw them.







  6. Permalost is online now
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    pro nonsense self defense

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    Nov 2012
    Location
    San Diego
    Posts
    12,555

    Posted On:
    10/23/2007 12:03am

    supporting member
     Style: FMA, dumbek, Indian clubs

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Dale Dugas
    Combat Shuai is not sport shuai. In combat you would throw him on his head or into something or you would stick something sharp into him(an icepick or knife) use it as a handle and throw them.
    What methods, if any, are used to practice these things besides developing safe throws so you can modify them later?
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