William V Aguiar III sues Ashida Kim and Floyd Webb

**Sam Browning** · Posted On: 10/05/2007 10:37pm

Was Keehen ever in the American military or was he claiming that he had fought in the cuban revolution?

**ninjoo** · Posted On: 10/05/2007 10:56pm

In this particular article he claims to have joined the Marines, and THEN the Army. He said he was in Korea and Vietnam. He never mentions Cuba. He say after he was done in the Military he spent most of his time in the "Far East".

**bobyclumsyninja** · Posted On: 10/06/2007 3:53am

My computer's been down, I see I haven't missed too much. This is how the copyright office sees fair use. I have a question, is there money to be made from the documentary (not Ashida's mess, but the other one)? Or is this a scholarly pursuit?

(US copyright office) One of the rights accorded to the owner of copyright is the right to reproduce or to authorize others to reproduce the work in copies or phonorecords. This right is subject to certain limitations found in sections 107 through 118 of the Copyright Act (title 17, U. S. Code). One of the more important limitations is the doctrine of “fair use.” Although fair use was not mentioned in the previous copyright law, the doctrine has developed through a substantial number of court decisions over the years. This doctrine has been codified in section 107 of the copyright law.

Section 107 contains a list of the various purposes for which the reproduction of a particular work may be considered “fair,” such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, and research. Section 107 also sets out four factors to be considered in determining whether or not a particular use is fair:

1. the purpose and character of the use, including whether such use is of commercial nature or is for nonprofit educational purposes;

2. the nature of the copyrighted work;

3. amount and substantiality of the portion used in relation to the copyrighted work as a whole; and

4. the effect of the use upon the potential market for or value of the copyrighted work.

The distinction between “fair use” and infringement may be unclear and not easily defined. There is no specific number of words, lines, or notes that may safely be taken without permission. Acknowledging the source of the copyrighted material does not substitute for obtaining permission...

(This is from the copyright office website updated in '06

**johnpatricio** · Posted On: 10/06/2007 4:07am

Originally Posted by ninjoo

In this particular article he claims to have joined the Marines, and THEN the Army. He said he was in Korea and Vietnam. He never mentions Cuba. He say after he was done in the Military he spent most of his time in the "Far East".

Floyd Webb has gotten Dante's military records and confirms that he was indeed in both the army and the marines... however, he did not find any evidence of Cuba being true. He mentioned these things quite awhile ago, so maybe something has changed since then. I don't know. I guess you will have to read his old blog posts to read about it yourself.

I think it's kind of weird being in the army and the marines (as I'm sure most of you do too). Most people pick one branch or the other I think, but he has the records so it must be true. I guess we'll have to watch the documentary to see them ourselves.

**bobyclumsyninja** · Posted On: 10/06/2007 4:50am

Is the documentary a nonprofit venture? may I ask?

**lamokio** · Posted On: 10/06/2007 6:14am

Originally Posted by johnpatricio

Yeah, but like I said, you posted about this right on the countdante.com forum right after I sent that email to Bill. You brought it to publics attention first... and it wasn't on this forum.

It really doesn't matter much anyhow, if the story was false (like Robert Dias Esquire was) then no one has anything to worry about.

By the way, I said that you were untrustworthy because you said you talked to the detective, then said you didn't... not because I said you posted the story first. Re-read my last post dummy. You really need to get your reading comprehension under control!

Edit: fixed spelling error

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Author Comment Lonehitman

Aug 29, 07 - 10:56 PM If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

I don,t understand if your mad at this guy. Why did you talk and give him info
John Patricio

Aug 31st, 2007 - 11:13 AM

Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

In 2005 Webb and Aguiar were not having problems yet.

The question you should be asking is why did Creeden contact Webb (and Barron) in 2007, AFTER Aguiar and Webb were having problems. Website: http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/1bdfs/

lonehitman

Aug 31st, 2007 - 6:15 PM

Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

But what I've read off of Count Dante .com. Both you and Creeden both betrayed Mr.Aguiar. The flyer's you,ve posted are very rare from the 60's i'd assume that Mr Webb has them know. From what i've seen in the forum.

But from what I understand Creeden sold some footage from what i understand. You gave him rare paper's that even Mr. Webb couldn't find . I think you both have betrayed the man,s confidence

I'm going to shoot Mr Aguiar an e-mail and this Creeden guy to get their side of the debate. You say this Creeden guy brain washed Aguiar.

How did you get the e-mail's from this guy Barron and Webb must be pretty close considering the circumstance's . If you don't mind
John Patricio

Aug 31st, 2007 - 7:53 PM

Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

You can believe whatever you want, but I did NOT betray Aguiar. The only 2 items I ever sent Floyd Webb was a flier and the cover of the National Informer. The only reason I sent him these was I was trying to prove to him that Dante really did challenge Muhammad Ali. I also sent Aguiar a copy of all the emails between me and Floyd.

After I sent Floyd the Muhammad fliers he sent me an email saying that he would use them in his film and that he would credit me for them. I sent him an email back saying:

"These are for your review only, not publication. Although they are "in my collection/possession" I do not own the copyrights nor have the authority to grant permission to you to use these in your video or
any other medium. (Keep that in mind when your doing your interviews and someone hands you a photo or other material... possessing something does not necessarily give a person the right to distribute it for publication.) Thanks for your thoughts on crediting me and so forth, but I cannot give you what is not mine to give. For that you will have to get permission from Bill Aguiar."

Now does that sound like someone who was trying to mess with Aguiar?

As far as the items being "rare". Well the National Informer pic isn't rare, and the flier, although rare, has been distributed to the public before (almost 40 years ago) and therefore is considered "fair use" whether Aguiar owns the copyrights or not.

By the way, for the record I haven't received any copyright complaints from Bill or anyone else yet... but if anyone does have a problem I will be happy to look at the situation right away.

As far as the reason I opened this site I'll tell you. I warned Aguiar and Creeden not to kick me from the BDFS message board. They laughed it off, so here we are. Maybe the next time they will think a little before they laugh. If I had been treated better this site wouldn't be open at all.

I do love Bill like a brother, but he seems to have kicked me to the dirt... so why should I worry about whether or not I do something to upset him now? He was better off treating me like a friend and he would've got friendlier cooperation from me. But, if after 18 years of tight friendship he is ready to declare me a traitor without giving me the chance to defend myself, than why should I care?

Last but not least, I don't need to defend myself with you or anyone else, but I'm happy to humor you 1)because I think that you are Creeden and 2) because the only people that think I screwed Aguiar over is Aguiar and Creeden. No one else who went to the BDFS board believes that I purposely messed over Bill. I have already spent a decade online sticking up for him! Website: http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/1bdfs/

lonehitman

Sep 1st, 2007 - 7:36 AM

Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

1. I'm not Creeden why so paranoid

2. I'm Mr Aguiar's lawyer

3. The catalog of images that I have seen from Mr Aguiar do not fall under fair use. Fair use is only considered to film and documentary. Which you do not fall under fair use. You will be charged with conspiracy to de-fraud and your social security benefit's will be suspended if any transaction's between you and Mr. Webb or Mr.Sheppard. As for Mr Creeden I have signed affadavit's from him stating that he will testify. Because their was no binding agreement's or verbal agreement's between Mr. Webb and Mr. Sheppard

From what i've seen Mr. Creeden has not had no verbal agreement's. Were Mr Creeden's taped conversation's with Mr. Webb and Mr.Sheppard did not state at all their was that.

I have the post's from were you threaten Mr Aguiar's child. And state that Mr. Aguiar has something to do with someone on a highway. In a businees entity that is slander and defamation of character. I'm not John Francuer. I'm a criminal attorney who represent's Mr Aguiar and have been retained for this proceeding.

1. the purpose and character of the use, including whether such use is of commercial nature or is for nonprofit educational purposes;

2. the nature of the copyrighted work;

3. amount and substantiality of the portion used in relation to the copyrighted work as a whole; and
4. the effect of the use upon the potential market for or value of the copyrighted work.

These are the 4 issues of fair use you should read them. Because I downloaded the exotic flier's from the 60' of Mr. Keehan from you web site. You purpotrated a fraud because i looked for those flyer's in my research. And only Mr. Aguiar has them then the burden of proof is on you to prove that you got them somewere else.

Mr. Robert Dias Esquire
John Patricio

Sep 1st, 2007 - 12:03 PM

Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

1. You spell just as badly and know just about as much about the law as Creeden, so I believe you ARE him.

2. A lawyer wouldn’t spend his time posting on a web forum, he would busy be sending me a cease and desist order if I did in fact break any laws. IN FACT, if you are truly planning to take me to court you HAVE TO notify me of any copyright violation first. Without formal written notification first, there is no court.

3. As far as threatening Aguiars child, that DID NOT HAPPEN. I did threaten to support Aguiar’s ex-girlfriend in any court case for child custody (Aguiar is an alcoholic and marihuana user), but have since decided against that. And lastly, as to the body in the woods, on the highway between Providence and Fall River… don’t you think that is something better off not talked about at all? As for me, I have reconsidered both these subjects and decided against them. The more you (Creeden) brings these subjects up the more info about them gets revealed… so do the smart thing and just stop talking about them.

As for transactions between me and Floyd or Barron… there never ever were any. And by the way, those taped conversations are inadmissible in court and federal criminal charges DO NOT result in suspension of Social Security benefits.

As for the fair use laws that you cited:

A. This site is indeed for nonprofit educational purposes.
B. The nature of the works is article, advertisements and fliers that were seen by thousands of people decades ago.
C & D. As to the amount and substantiality of the work and the effect on the market… I’m sorry to say, but Aguiar doesn’t own the copyrights for everything on this site. If he does own some of them, well he is welcome to send me proof of ownership,… but so far I haven‘t gotten one complaint from him.

I would also like to make a couple of points about your last sentence about the fliers from the 60‘s… I do not have to prove that I got them from somebody other than Aguiar. These fliers were distributed to hundreds of people, hung in windows and on telephone poles etc. Aguiar is not the only person to have them. Don’t you think that some of the people that actually fought in these tournaments saved a souvenir copy? Either way, whether I got them from Aguiar or somebody else doesn’t make any difference if something is fair use or not.

Now I think that you (Creeden) should really stop harassing me and pretending to be a lawyer, etc or it is you that will end up in small claims court for slander and harassment. Website: http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/1bdfs/

lonehitman

Sep 1st, 2007 - 1:02 PM

Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

Why are you so worried about this Creeden guy? From my interview with him he says he did it to expose you and other people. He broke no civil or criminal law's. Harrasement came from you slandering my client and under mining his business deal with Mr. Webb. Furthermore Mr. Aguiar is sending you a cease and deciest order in the mail promptly. By the way lawyers do do this to see if they have a solid case.

This is no harrasement to you Mr. Patricio only question's. And you will lose you benefit's if convicted of a crime if you so smart check the statute
. The way I type what are you working in the F.B.I in handwriting forensic's. Mr. Aguiar has informed me off your situation he would love you to tell your stories to the proper authorities.

Furthermore you are withholding any criminal information of a crime you will be held liable for i'm
an officer of the court and responsible to report all criminal activity. I'll will be speakin to Mr.Aguiar on Monday to show him an-update on this matter.

Robert Dias Esquire
John Patricio

Sep 1st, 2007 - 1:49 PM

Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

First of all I am not worried about Creeden (you). In fact, you (Creeden) have a lot more to fear legally from me than I do you.

A lawyer would come to this site to download evidence, but a lawyer would not spend him time posting on a message board.

You (Creeden) are not asking me questions. You are accusing me of doing things that I did not do… that IS slander and harassment!

I don’t know what the statute you are talking about with Social Security but, I am positive that you are wrong. I am also positive that even if you were right I still have nothing to worry about because I broke no laws.

No I do not work for the FBI, lol… but it is easy to tell the difference between a real lawyer and an uneducated, immature martial artist.

Lastly, a lawyer is NOT an officer of the court at all and does not have to report all criminal activity. In fact, lawyers legally withhold criminal activity of their clients all the time!

If you are indeed a lawyer then please post or email me your address and phone number so that I can have my lawyer contact you.

I would like to close this by saying that if you are planning to sue me then just do it and stop talking about it... I’m dying for the chance to defend myself! I remember Aguiar telling me that he wasn’t going to bother suing Asshida because he had no money…. What do you think I have, lol? I’m in a wheelchair and haven’t worked in 3 months! Do your worse… but be prepared to get my worse back in return. I’m tired of playing these games! Website: http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/1bdfs/

mschremp

Sep 1st, 2007 - 2:27 PM

Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

Sounds like Creeden to me.

Verne Gilbert

Sep 1st, 2007 - 3:04 PM

Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

Good Afternoon John

Also sounds like Creeden to me. Makes sense as he has been pretty much shut down on all the other forums that I know of. There just can't be two people that know each other who spell the word now " know ".

Enough about him. In ref to your statement about tournament flyers and folks who fought in them. I did in fact fight in quite a number of them in 1965, 66 and 67, in the white and brown belt divisions. Thanks for the memories.

Respectfully
Verne Gilbert Email: sensei@kazokubudokan.com

Website: http://kazokubudokan.com

John Creeden

Sep 1st, 2007 - 4:53 PM

Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

You now what's funny it ain'e me check the ip's and spelling Bill told me about this place. Went here 2 on my lab top just to down load this stuff. I could care less about the cripple. In a couple of week's the **** is going to hit the fan. So all you wanna be martial artist's

1. Billy had a hour and a half conversation with Floyd Webb and he said that their was no contact between you and him. And you posted what 20 e-mail's between them

2. Mr Dias nice guy he ain't me that's for sure . Go head check the ip's it ain't me

3. The body or person on the highway you speak so what Billy took his eye out so what I've done that a hundred times. Ive been charged with 6 attempted murder's so bring it on

4. Billy doesn't want to ever talk to you again.

5. The weed was your in your house the plant's that Billy copped to to save you behind . You took acid and mushroom's and snorted herion with you fat obese mother. To bad she spawned a loser like you.

6 The stuff about his child custody. I ever see you buddy . They won't have to look in the highway you'll be gone

7. To side with Webb and his cronies is discusting. you are gone from Billy's life and Joey and Jim. Evrybody know here so stay in gay town that's were you belong

8 I don't have to hide

9 I don't judge someone from their typing skill 4 year freshman and i got my g.e.d

10. Verne and msremp I never got banned from anyone's forum so screw . I know Samuel Browning from Bullshido. Do you losers know me know. This board is going to have a short life anyway. Email: Lamokio@comcast.net

John Patricio

Sep 1st, 2007 - 5:59 PM

Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

1. Whatever Floyd told Bill has nothing to do with me. All I know is I have always posted the truth and that’s why I voluntarily posted all the emails between Floyd and myself. I have nothing to hide.

2. It’s not to hard to hide your IP address. If it wasn’t you it was Bill, because he is just as bad a speller as you… either way it definitely wasn’t a lawyer! And you are definitely using a different ID because I never approved you for membership, yet here you are, lol.

3. What Bill did wasn’t an attempted murder… it was a murder, period… and until you opened your big mouth the only person who said anything about it was me. Thanks for being a corroborating witness! Now people know I wasn’t just making that up.

4. I don’t care! I don’t need friends who call me brother for 18 years and then because of one persons lies shuns me. Who needs friends like that.

5. The weed I was talking about was the weed you and him were smoking the last time I called him. What your talking about is the time Bill showed up at my house at 3 AM with 12 of his pals. I don’t care what bull he told you but, it was HIS weed. I can get and will publish copies of the police report if you pursue further claiming that it was mine. The police report will tell how Bill went running into another room right in front of the cops to hide it. It will tell how they only entered the apartment from the hall in the first place AFTER Bill ran into the other room. The report will tell how they found an ounce of weed hiding inside the same box with Bill’s paintball gun in the other room that he ran into. Yes, its true I did have a plant growing, but it was only one plant and you need a male and female in order to actually grow any marihuana. Tell Bill to either start telling the truth or just keep his mouth shut to begin with. I got arrested because of him and I’m still ****** about it!

The fact is that the person who first started me smoking pot in the first place was Bill. That’s one reason why his mom was mad at me… she figured that because I was older I started him… but she was wrong! It was him. Bill was also the first person that I ever did acid or mushrooms with. Bill used to do that crap all the time on a weekly basis. I did both maybe 2 or 3 times each and that’s it! Another thing is that I haven’t done any of those drugs in well over a decade! When was Bill’s last time?

I know Bill’s mad at me, but he really should watch what he is saying about me… especially when he is just as guilty as I am if not worse. I don’t have a business to run, but I don’t think to many parents would be happy sending their kids to an Aguiar’s school when they find out this stuff.

As for my dead “fat obese mother”. First of all, I never did any drugs while she was alive. Secondly, I can’t believe Bill would be so crude to talk like that about a women he once called Mom. It’s despicable! He can hate me all he wants, but when he starts badmouthing my dead mother that just shows how classless he is.

6. That sounded like a death threat. Thanks, that’s great evidence. As far as Bill losing custody of his kid… If he doesn’t do anything wrong he won’t have to worry about that, right? I already told you I had a change of heart about that. Are you trying to get me to be more proactive on this?

7. I didn’t side with anybody. Bill sided against me!

8. Congratulations

9. I usually don’t judge people by their typing skills either… but I do judge their education level from them.

10. Yeah, I’ve read what the guys on Bullshido think of you… and it ain’t much. Read this one forum and laugh your ass off: http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=58950 Website: http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/1bdfs/

John Creeden

Sep 1st, 2007 - 9:00 PM

Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

1. Ask yourself this question John why isn't Bill mad at me?

2. Why is everybody mad at me?

3 Why because I exposed all the behind dealing's about you and Floyd and Barron.

4 You stuck your nose after he told you not to.

5 As for weed who care's

6 You've done harder drug's than I've ever done.

7 You talk like you know me you don't John

8 Murder your an accessory during and after the fact if their was one [ which I doubt ] So if he goes so do you . And I know that's the law and that's a fact.

9 He goes and you go

10 Your like a leech sucking something that's not your to begin with. Because you jealous of Bill and your not a man cripple to attck or threaten someone's child. I know this if you lived here you wouldn't be doing this.

11 Your like Barron Sheppard all talk.

12 Threat's to Bill are like so stupid. From what I got in my archive of Dante and Bill's you people got nothing.

13. I learned about people from his dad and i saw you from a mile away.

14 The way you acting you got 7500 from Sheppard or Webb hand's down.

CRIPPLE Email: Lamokio@comcast.net

John Patricio

Sep 1st, 2007 - 10:24 PM

Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

1. Bill isn’t mad at you because he isn’t very intelligent. Since you came into the picture Bill has just had more and more problems. First the matter with Barron and now this website. Bill wouldn’t have any of these problems if it weren’t for you! If he is too stupid to see that, that’s his problem.

2. I don’t know? Why is everybody mad at you? The only people mad at me are people that I don’t matter.

3. You didn’t expose any dealing because there were none… and I am dying to prove that in court. Please give me the chance to vindicate myself. I can’t wait to see the look on the judges face after he/she reads all these messages you’ve left.

4. That’s one of the problems… Bill told me… he should have asked nicely, it would have gotten him further.

5. Obviously you cared… you brought the subject up.

6. Yes I probably have. And let’s remember Bill has too… and he has done tons more than I ever did.

7. Doh! **** right I don’t know you. I hang with a better class of people.

8. I don’t know anything about it firsthand… only what Bill told me. I don’t know if it’s true or not, but I believed Bill when he told me and it probably is. That probably does make me an accessory, I don’t know, but since Bill might be looking at jail too it would be best for Bill if you didn’t bring this up anymore… don’t you think. Oh I forgot… you don’t think.

9. Yep… which is why you should shut up.

10. Like I said… I haven‘t gotten any complaints yet. And I’m not going to explain the child thing again. In fact, I told you that I had a change of heart about that… are you trying to push me into it again?

11. OK, if I remember correctly it was you who was all talk when Barron offered to fight you. We all saw how you squirmed out of that…. hypocrite, lol.

12. If we “people got nothing“ than what are you complaining about?

13. .You have great eyesight to see a mile away. Too bad your brain wasn’t as developed.

14. The way your acting you got $1,000 from Floyd or Webb hands down. I have yet to see one shred of evidence.

Lastly “CRIPPLE”!!! And you call yourself a soldier? Shame on you!!! 16,000 of your fellow soldiers are now without arms or legs because of Iraq and your going to call me a cripple! Why don’t you go to a vets hospital and say that fool. You are a mentally dysfunctional person and the more you say just proves it. I wonder if those 3 BDFS members that you said are serving would like hear that. Man, you’re even dummier than I thought. Website: http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/1bdfs/

John Patricio

Sep 1st, 2007 - 10:33 PM

Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

lol, By the way I did compare IP addresses and the IP the "lawyer" used and Creeden used were the same. Creeden is to stupid for me to even spend time arguing with and after his last "cripple" comment I banned both ID's. I don't think he is smart enough to know how to disguise his IP so hopefully he won't be back. What a jerk, lol. Website: http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/1bdfs/

Verne Gilbert

Sep 1st, 2007 - 10:38 PM

Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

Hi John

An excellent move!!! I was afraid that you were going to allow him to drag this site to the dark side.

Respectfully
Verne Gilbert Email: sensei@kazokubudokan.com

Website: http://kazokubudokan.com

John Patricio

Sep 1st, 2007 - 11:39 PM

Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

No worries Verne. That's not going to happen... it's gone too far already. Website: http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/1bdfs/

**lamokio** · Posted On: 10/06/2007 6:15am

BDFS Archives & Virtual Library
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Author Comment
Lonehitman

Aug 29, 07 - 10:56 PM If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

I don,t understand if your mad at this guy. Why did you talk and give him info
John Patricio

Aug 31st, 2007 - 11:13 AM Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

In 2005 Webb and Aguiar were not having problems yet.

The question you should be asking is why did Creeden contact Webb (and Barron) in 2007, AFTER Aguiar and Webb were having problems.
Website: http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/1bdfs/

lonehitman

Aug 31st, 2007 - 6:15 PM Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

But what I've read off of Count Dante .com. Both you and Creeden both betrayed Mr.Aguiar. The flyer's you,ve posted are very rare from the 60's i'd assume that Mr Webb has them know. From what i've seen in the forum.

But from what I understand Creeden sold some footage from what i understand. You gave him rare paper's that even Mr. Webb couldn't find . I think you both have betrayed the man,s confidence

I'm going to shoot Mr Aguiar an e-mail and this Creeden guy to get their side of the debate. You say this Creeden guy brain washed Aguiar.

How did you get the e-mail's from this guy Barron and Webb must be pretty close considering the circumstance's . If you don't mind
John Patricio

Aug 31st, 2007 - 7:53 PM Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

You can believe whatever you want, but I did NOT betray Aguiar. The only 2 items I ever sent Floyd Webb was a flier and the cover of the National Informer. The only reason I sent him these was I was trying to prove to him that Dante really did challenge Muhammad Ali. I also sent Aguiar a copy of all the emails between me and Floyd.

After I sent Floyd the Muhammad fliers he sent me an email saying that he would use them in his film and that he would credit me for them. I sent him an email back saying:

"These are for your review only, not publication. Although they are "in my collection/possession" I do not own the copyrights nor have the authority to grant permission to you to use these in your video or
any other medium. (Keep that in mind when your doing your interviews and someone hands you a photo or other material... possessing something does not necessarily give a person the right to distribute it for publication.) Thanks for your thoughts on crediting me and so forth, but I cannot give you what is not mine to give. For that you will have to get permission from Bill Aguiar."

Now does that sound like someone who was trying to mess with Aguiar?

As far as the items being "rare". Well the National Informer pic isn't rare, and the flier, although rare, has been distributed to the public before (almost 40 years ago) and therefore is considered "fair use" whether Aguiar owns the copyrights or not.

By the way, for the record I haven't received any copyright complaints from Bill or anyone else yet... but if anyone does have a problem I will be happy to look at the situation right away.

As far as the reason I opened this site I'll tell you. I warned Aguiar and Creeden not to kick me from the BDFS message board. They laughed it off, so here we are. Maybe the next time they will think a little before they laugh. If I had been treated better this site wouldn't be open at all.

I do love Bill like a brother, but he seems to have kicked me to the dirt... so why should I worry about whether or not I do something to upset him now? He was better off treating me like a friend and he would've got friendlier cooperation from me. But, if after 18 years of tight friendship he is ready to declare me a traitor without giving me the chance to defend myself, than why should I care?

Last but not least, I don't need to defend myself with you or anyone else, but I'm happy to humor you 1)because I think that you are Creeden and 2) because the only people that think I screwed Aguiar over is Aguiar and Creeden. No one else who went to the BDFS board believes that I purposely messed over Bill. I have already spent a decade online sticking up for him!
Website: http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/1bdfs/

lonehitman

Sep 1st, 2007 - 7:36 AM Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

1. I'm not Creeden why so paranoid

2. I'm Mr Aguiar's lawyer

3. The catalog of images that I have seen from Mr Aguiar do not fall under fair use. Fair use is only considered to film and documentary. Which you do not fall under fair use. You will be charged with conspiracy to de-fraud and your social security benefit's will be suspended if any transaction's between you and Mr. Webb or Mr.Sheppard. As for Mr Creeden I have signed affadavit's from him stating that he will testify. Because their was no binding agreement's or verbal agreement's between Mr. Webb and Mr. Sheppard

From what i've seen Mr. Creeden has not had no verbal agreement's. Were Mr Creeden's taped conversation's with Mr. Webb and Mr.Sheppard did not state at all their was that.

I have the post's from were you threaten Mr Aguiar's child. And state that Mr. Aguiar has something to do with someone on a highway. In a businees entity that is slander and defamation of character. I'm not John Francuer. I'm a criminal attorney who represent's Mr Aguiar and have been retained for this proceeding.

1. the purpose and character of the use, including whether such use is of commercial nature or is for nonprofit educational purposes;

2. the nature of the copyrighted work;

3. amount and substantiality of the portion used in relation to the copyrighted work as a whole; and
4. the effect of the use upon the potential market for or value of the copyrighted work.

These are the 4 issues of fair use you should read them. Because I downloaded the exotic flier's from the 60' of Mr. Keehan from you web site. You purpotrated a fraud because i looked for those flyer's in my research. And only Mr. Aguiar has them then the burden of proof is on you to prove that you got them somewere else.

Mr. Robert Dias Esquire
John Patricio

Sep 1st, 2007 - 12:03 PM Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

1. You spell just as badly and know just about as much about the law as Creeden, so I believe you ARE him.

2. A lawyer wouldn’t spend his time posting on a web forum, he would busy be sending me a cease and desist order if I did in fact break any laws. IN FACT, if you are truly planning to take me to court you HAVE TO notify me of any copyright violation first. Without formal written notification first, there is no court.

3. As far as threatening Aguiars child, that DID NOT HAPPEN. I did threaten to support Aguiar’s ex-girlfriend in any court case for child custody (Aguiar is an alcoholic and marihuana user), but have since decided against that. And lastly, as to the body in the woods, on the highway between Providence and Fall River… don’t you think that is something better off not talked about at all? As for me, I have reconsidered both these subjects and decided against them. The more you (Creeden) brings these subjects up the more info about them gets revealed… so do the smart thing and just stop talking about them.

As for transactions between me and Floyd or Barron… there never ever were any. And by the way, those taped conversations are inadmissible in court and federal criminal charges DO NOT result in suspension of Social Security benefits.

As for the fair use laws that you cited:

A. This site is indeed for nonprofit educational purposes.
B. The nature of the works is article, advertisements and fliers that were seen by thousands of people decades ago.
C & D. As to the amount and substantiality of the work and the effect on the market… I’m sorry to say, but Aguiar doesn’t own the copyrights for everything on this site. If he does own some of them, well he is welcome to send me proof of ownership,… but so far I haven‘t gotten one complaint from him.

I would also like to make a couple of points about your last sentence about the fliers from the 60‘s… I do not have to prove that I got them from somebody other than Aguiar. These fliers were distributed to hundreds of people, hung in windows and on telephone poles etc. Aguiar is not the only person to have them. Don’t you think that some of the people that actually fought in these tournaments saved a souvenir copy? Either way, whether I got them from Aguiar or somebody else doesn’t make any difference if something is fair use or not.

Now I think that you (Creeden) should really stop harassing me and pretending to be a lawyer, etc or it is you that will end up in small claims court for slander and harassment.
Website: http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/1bdfs/

lonehitman

Sep 1st, 2007 - 1:02 PM Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

Why are you so worried about this Creeden guy? From my interview with him he says he did it to expose you and other people. He broke no civil or criminal law's. Harrasement came from you slandering my client and under mining his business deal with Mr. Webb. Furthermore Mr. Aguiar is sending you a cease and deciest order in the mail promptly. By the way lawyers do do this to see if they have a solid case.

This is no harrasement to you Mr. Patricio only question's. And you will lose you benefit's if convicted of a crime if you so smart check the statute
. The way I type what are you working in the F.B.I in handwriting forensic's. Mr. Aguiar has informed me off your situation he would love you to tell your stories to the proper authorities.

Furthermore you are withholding any criminal information of a crime you will be held liable for i'm
an officer of the court and responsible to report all criminal activity. I'll will be speakin to Mr.Aguiar on Monday to show him an-update on this matter.

Robert Dias Esquire
John Patricio

Sep 1st, 2007 - 1:49 PM Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

First of all I am not worried about Creeden (you). In fact, you (Creeden) have a lot more to fear legally from me than I do you.

A lawyer would come to this site to download evidence, but a lawyer would not spend him time posting on a message board.

You (Creeden) are not asking me questions. You are accusing me of doing things that I did not do… that IS slander and harassment!

I don’t know what the statute you are talking about with Social Security but, I am positive that you are wrong. I am also positive that even if you were right I still have nothing to worry about because I broke no laws.

No I do not work for the FBI, lol… but it is easy to tell the difference between a real lawyer and an uneducated, immature martial artist.

Lastly, a lawyer is NOT an officer of the court at all and does not have to report all criminal activity. In fact, lawyers legally withhold criminal activity of their clients all the time!

If you are indeed a lawyer then please post or email me your address and phone number so that I can have my lawyer contact you.

I would like to close this by saying that if you are planning to sue me then just do it and stop talking about it... I’m dying for the chance to defend myself! I remember Aguiar telling me that he wasn’t going to bother suing Asshida because he had no money…. What do you think I have, lol? I’m in a wheelchair and haven’t worked in 3 months! Do your worse… but be prepared to get my worse back in return. I’m tired of playing these games!
Website: http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/1bdfs/

mschremp

Sep 1st, 2007 - 2:27 PM Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

Sounds like Creeden to me.
Verne Gilbert

Sep 1st, 2007 - 3:04 PM Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

Good Afternoon John

Also sounds like Creeden to me. Makes sense as he has been pretty much shut down on all the other forums that I know of. There just can't be two people that know each other who spell the word now " know ".

Enough about him. In ref to your statement about tournament flyers and folks who fought in them. I did in fact fight in quite a number of them in 1965, 66 and 67, in the white and brown belt divisions. Thanks for the memories.

Respectfully
Verne Gilbert
Email: sensei@kazokubudokan.com

Website: http://kazokubudokan.com

John Creeden

Sep 1st, 2007 - 4:53 PM Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

You now what's funny it ain'e me check the ip's and spelling Bill told me about this place. Went here 2 on my lab top just to down load this stuff. I could care less about the cripple. In a couple of week's the **** is going to hit the fan. So all you wanna be martial artist's

1. Billy had a hour and a half conversation with Floyd Webb and he said that their was no contact between you and him. And you posted what 20 e-mail's between them

2. Mr Dias nice guy he ain't me that's for sure . Go head check the ip's it ain't me

3. The body or person on the highway you speak so what Billy took his eye out so what I've done that a hundred times. Ive been charged with 6 attempted murder's so bring it on

4. Billy doesn't want to ever talk to you again.

5. The weed was your in your house the plant's that Billy copped to to save you behind . You took acid and mushroom's and snorted herion with you fat obese mother. To bad she spawned a loser like you.

6 The stuff about his child custody. I ever see you buddy . They won't have to look in the highway you'll be gone

7. To side with Webb and his cronies is discusting. you are gone from Billy's life and Joey and Jim. Evrybody know here so stay in gay town that's were you belong

8 I don't have to hide

9 I don't judge someone from their typing skill 4 year freshman and i got my g.e.d

10. Verne and msremp I never got banned from anyone's forum so screw . I know Samuel Browning from Bullshido. Do you losers know me know. This board is going to have a short life anyway.
Email: Lamokio@comcast.net

John Patricio

Sep 1st, 2007 - 5:59 PM Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

1. Whatever Floyd told Bill has nothing to do with me. All I know is I have always posted the truth and that’s why I voluntarily posted all the emails between Floyd and myself. I have nothing to hide.

2. It’s not to hard to hide your IP address. If it wasn’t you it was Bill, because he is just as bad a speller as you… either way it definitely wasn’t a lawyer! And you are definitely using a different ID because I never approved you for membership, yet here you are, lol.

3. What Bill did wasn’t an attempted murder… it was a murder, period… and until you opened your big mouth the only person who said anything about it was me. Thanks for being a corroborating witness! Now people know I wasn’t just making that up.

4. I don’t care! I don’t need friends who call me brother for 18 years and then because of one persons lies shuns me. Who needs friends like that.

5. The weed I was talking about was the weed you and him were smoking the last time I called him. What your talking about is the time Bill showed up at my house at 3 AM with 12 of his pals. I don’t care what bull he told you but, it was HIS weed. I can get and will publish copies of the police report if you pursue further claiming that it was mine. The police report will tell how Bill went running into another room right in front of the cops to hide it. It will tell how they only entered the apartment from the hall in the first place AFTER Bill ran into the other room. The report will tell how they found an ounce of weed hiding inside the same box with Bill’s paintball gun in the other room that he ran into. Yes, its true I did have a plant growing, but it was only one plant and you need a male and female in order to actually grow any marihuana. Tell Bill to either start telling the truth or just keep his mouth shut to begin with. I got arrested because of him and I’m still ****** about it!

The fact is that the person who first started me smoking pot in the first place was Bill. That’s one reason why his mom was mad at me… she figured that because I was older I started him… but she was wrong! It was him. Bill was also the first person that I ever did acid or mushrooms with. Bill used to do that crap all the time on a weekly basis. I did both maybe 2 or 3 times each and that’s it! Another thing is that I haven’t done any of those drugs in well over a decade! When was Bill’s last time?

I know Bill’s mad at me, but he really should watch what he is saying about me… especially when he is just as guilty as I am if not worse. I don’t have a business to run, but I don’t think to many parents would be happy sending their kids to an Aguiar’s school when they find out this stuff.

As for my dead “fat obese mother”. First of all, I never did any drugs while she was alive. Secondly, I can’t believe Bill would be so crude to talk like that about a women he once called Mom. It’s despicable! He can hate me all he wants, but when he starts badmouthing my dead mother that just shows how classless he is.

6. That sounded like a death threat. Thanks, that’s great evidence. As far as Bill losing custody of his kid… If he doesn’t do anything wrong he won’t have to worry about that, right? I already told you I had a change of heart about that. Are you trying to get me to be more proactive on this?

7. I didn’t side with anybody. Bill sided against me!

8. Congratulations

9. I usually don’t judge people by their typing skills either… but I do judge their education level from them.

10. Yeah, I’ve read what the guys on Bullshido think of you… and it ain’t much. Read this one forum and laugh your ass off: http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=58950
Website: http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/1bdfs/

John Creeden

Sep 1st, 2007 - 9:00 PM Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

1. Ask yourself this question John why isn't Bill mad at me?

2. Why is everybody mad at me?

3 Why because I exposed all the behind dealing's about you and Floyd and Barron.

4 You stuck your nose after he told you not to.

5 As for weed who care's

6 You've done harder drug's than I've ever done.

7 You talk like you know me you don't John

8 Murder your an accessory during and after the fact if their was one [ which I doubt ] So if he goes so do you . And I know that's the law and that's a fact.

9 He goes and you go

10 Your like a leech sucking something that's not your to begin with. Because you jealous of Bill and your not a man cripple to attck or threaten someone's child. I know this if you lived here you wouldn't be doing this.

11 Your like Barron Sheppard all talk.

12 Threat's to Bill are like so stupid. From what I got in my archive of Dante and Bill's you people got nothing.

13. I learned about people from his dad and i saw you from a mile away.

14 The way you acting you got 7500 from Sheppard or Webb hand's down.

CRIPPLE
Email: Lamokio@comcast.net

John Patricio

Sep 1st, 2007 - 10:24 PM Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

1. Bill isn’t mad at you because he isn’t very intelligent. Since you came into the picture Bill has just had more and more problems. First the matter with Barron and now this website. Bill wouldn’t have any of these problems if it weren’t for you! If he is too stupid to see that, that’s his problem.

2. I don’t know? Why is everybody mad at you? The only people mad at me are people that I don’t matter.

3. You didn’t expose any dealing because there were none… and I am dying to prove that in court. Please give me the chance to vindicate myself. I can’t wait to see the look on the judges face after he/she reads all these messages you’ve left.

4. That’s one of the problems… Bill told me… he should have asked nicely, it would have gotten him further.

5. Obviously you cared… you brought the subject up.

6. Yes I probably have. And let’s remember Bill has too… and he has done tons more than I ever did.

7. Doh! **** right I don’t know you. I hang with a better class of people.

8. I don’t know anything about it firsthand… only what Bill told me. I don’t know if it’s true or not, but I believed Bill when he told me and it probably is. That probably does make me an accessory, I don’t know, but since Bill might be looking at jail too it would be best for Bill if you didn’t bring this up anymore… don’t you think. Oh I forgot… you don’t think.

9. Yep… which is why you should shut up.

10. Like I said… I haven‘t gotten any complaints yet. And I’m not going to explain the child thing again. In fact, I told you that I had a change of heart about that… are you trying to push me into it again?

11. OK, if I remember correctly it was you who was all talk when Barron offered to fight you. We all saw how you squirmed out of that…. hypocrite, lol.

12. If we “people got nothing“ than what are you complaining about?

13. .You have great eyesight to see a mile away. Too bad your brain wasn’t as developed.

14. The way your acting you got $1,000 from Floyd or Webb hands down. I have yet to see one shred of evidence.

Lastly “CRIPPLE”!!! And you call yourself a soldier? Shame on you!!! 16,000 of your fellow soldiers are now without arms or legs because of Iraq and your going to call me a cripple! Why don’t you go to a vets hospital and say that fool. You are a mentally dysfunctional person and the more you say just proves it. I wonder if those 3 BDFS members that you said are serving would like hear that. Man, you’re even dummier than I thought.
Website: http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/1bdfs/

John Patricio

Sep 1st, 2007 - 10:33 PM Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

lol, By the way I did compare IP addresses and the IP the "lawyer" used and Creeden used were the same. Creeden is to stupid for me to even spend time arguing with and after his last "cripple" comment I banned both ID's. I don't think he is smart enough to know how to disguise his IP so hopefully he won't be back. What a jerk, lol.
Website: http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/1bdfs/

Verne Gilbert

Sep 1st, 2007 - 10:38 PM Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

Hi John

An excellent move!!! I was afraid that you were going to allow him to drag this site to the dark side.

Respectfully
Verne Gilbert
Email: sensei@kazokubudokan.com

Website: http://kazokubudokan.com

John Patricio

Sep 1st, 2007 - 11:39 PM Re: If your mad at this Creeden guy why did you talk to Webb in 05

No worries Verne. That's not going to happen... it's gone too far already.
Website: http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/1bdfs/

**lamokio** · Posted On: 10/06/2007 6:57am

Dante

**S.G.M. Aguiar** · Posted On: 10/06/2007 7:38am

From: John Patricio (johnpatricio@hotmail.com)
Thu 8/23/07 3:32 PM

Hello everyone,

The BDFS newspaper and magazine archives are now re-opened to the public at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/1bdfs. Please tell all your pals.

I am going to give Bill 24 hours tops to re-open his forum... and if he doesn't, I guess I will have no choice but to open my own, where I will reveal all the secret BDFS behind the scenes stuff. Stay tuned!

Why am I doing this? Because Bill Aguiar is allowing Creeden to post crap about me on his forum, but not allowing me to defend myself. It's ashame that Bill has no loyalty to true friends. So be it. If I have already lost Bill as a friend then I have nothing left to lose. If he thinks that Creeden is a true friend, even though he did in fact sell stuff and give tons of info out behind Bill's back, then so be it. At least I can honesty say I never did.

I warned Bill in advance... don't block me from posting on your blog or this would happen, but he did and now it is. It's really shocking too considering the things I know. I guess Bill's memory isn't so sharp anymore. I wonder if his EX needs help with child custody. I wonder if the police ever found out how that body ended up in the woods off the highway. I wonder if the parent's who brought their children to train at the BDFS knew what was going on in Aguiars office. These are just a fraction of the things I wonder. Will we have to wonder together? OR will Aguiar re-open his forum for us and give me the same opportunity he is giving Creeden by allowing me to defend myself?

By the way... should I end up murdered in the near future you know who has motive and I hope you will be sure to report that info to the police. I don't fear death... I've been suicidal for years, but I would still want the murderers punished.

Thanks,

John

**S.G.M. Aguiar** · Posted On: 10/06/2007 7:51am

"The Saga Continues, and he called me a "coon!""
4 Comments - Show Original Post Collapse comments

John said...

I guess you missed the earlier comment that Creeden left on the Official BDFS site that said something about you being proof that black people had small brains. Yes, Creeden is a racist bigot and that is really surprising considering how open to the black community Dante himself was and also the fact that Creeden claims he served in the military where I'm sure he had to work alongside a few fellow "coons".

He is a despicable excuse for a human being! Some of my (and Bill's) oldest friends in Fall River are black and John Cole who is an instructer at the BDFS is black.

Although, I did also have a black friend named Carl that for some strange reason was prejudiced against other black people... except for Jimi Hendrix, lol. I don't understand this racist crap at all.

10:49 PM
John said...

"I even have two forums dedicated to their gathering information about me and Ashida Kim(whom I have never met) and a whole forum dedicated to the William Aguiar lawsuit."

You do? Where? I want in, lol!

11:11 PM
floyd webb said...

Black people have small brains? Oh how he does project.

11:13 PM
mschremp said...

Floyd,

Don't feel too bad about being called a coon. He could have called you a lot of worse things. Such as Fall River White Trash. Hey, this comment is coming from a WASP....White Austrian Saxaphone Player. Seriously people that stoop to that level in this day and age don't even deserve the time of day. Then again, it is John Creeden.