Grasshopper Guard Shoulder Crank

**Roidie McDouchebag** · Posted On: 9/04/2007 5:26pm

Double underhooks pass is something I rarely use and wouldn't teach, but when it happens, it's done. I'm not going to fucking sit there and blow the guy. I'm sorry if you thought it worked that way, Hedge, but only your fellow BJ(j)ers are going to let that happen.

Honestly, I bet I can keylock people from under sidemount more often than you can pull off your grasshopper move.

**Ryno** · Posted On: 9/04/2007 6:50pm

How many no-gi folks use double under pass? I use it with gi every now and then, but it seems like it'd be a lot trickier without a belt or pants to grab in no-gi.

I've never seen anyone caught in grasshopper guard at my club, but only a handful of people use double under pass frequently and they tend to have pretty good posture.

**Roidie McDouchebag** · Posted On: 9/04/2007 7:00pm

I don't use it because every time anyone has used it on me, I only let'em have on leg. No one has ever gotten this grasshopper nonsense on me, and I have a hard time believing anyone could hold it even if I let'em have the position.

**Red Elvis** · Posted On: 9/04/2007 7:04pm

I use single under hook elbow tucked in and double underhook all the time no-gi. Never been put in a bad spot like this. It doesn't necessarily mean I'm gonna pass 100% using it but then my passes are never textbook clean anyway. They may switch mid pass depending on what the opponent does.

Perhaps I'm not understanding what people are doing with this double under though that allows this move or "guard".

Ryno - No-gi double under to me is basically hooking around the thighs and schucking opponent right or left with hip pressure or clasping hands and schucking opponent. I would think it harder with gi as thney can grab the collar but I haven't worn a gi in years.

**NSLightsOut** · Posted On: 9/04/2007 7:28pm

Originally Posted by RobT

I don't see the point in naming it as a type of guard though, it's not a position I would want to hang around in.

I definitely agree with this. AFAIK, the term was coined by a Canadian Brown Belt, Elliot Bayev who has the tendency to give just about any possible permutation of guard a funky name, in addition to some of his setups. This guy, in my recollection, also came up with the 'pink shirt' rank, as a way of trying to attract women to BJJ.

Some people try just a little too hard to put their mark on the art, in my opinion.

Originally Posted by Red Elvis

No-gi double under to me is basically hooking around the thighs and schucking opponent right or left with hip pressure or clasping hands and schucking opponent. I would think it harder with gi as thney can grab the collar but I haven't worn a gi in years.

It's not that much harder in a gi. I find someone grabbing my collar doesn't stop me from passing at all, just ties up one hand from doing something more productive, like trying to block me from passing to make space so my opponent can reestablish guard.

Incidentally, Leozinho has an awesome setup that he uses in both gi and no-gi for the double underhooks, where he stands, grabs the ankles or pants, and lifts the feet higher, so he can shoot in and get the double underhooks to pass. I've been using it of late on some training partners of mine with finicky open guards, and it works well

**Ryno** · Posted On: 9/04/2007 7:37pm

Yeah, I get you RedElvis, but I was thinking of another one with a belt grab the way Hedgehogey described it. Posture up, pop guard open, double under to grab back of belt, stand up and flip them ass over teakettle, spin and take back. Always high on comedy points for that one. Sure, just shucking them off should work fine, and would most likely avoid the whole grasshopper guard to begin with.

**NSLightsOut** · Posted On: 9/04/2007 7:49pm

Ryno - If you grab on their thighs, the less chance of getting into that particular shoulder lock's territory exists. I've always got the shoulder lock when someone's tried to grab my belt, as it doesn't seem to control the hips quite as well

***Cassius*** · Posted On: 9/04/2007 9:51pm

Originally Posted by Hedgehogey

Ok, who's tried this: You've countered a dump pass by weighing heavy and dropping your hips way to the ground, then hooking under his thighs with his arms now trapped by your legs. Grasshopper Guard.

Sure you could push his head through and past your groin then scramble over to the back, or collar choke his now isolated head. But why be practical when you can be a prick?

Get a grip on one of his sleeves under his wrist then push his wrist backwards. His forearm flares outward and back towards his feet, his elbow rotates inward on this axis. Does anybody understand me?

I've had difficulty hitting this reliably while rolling. With these hooks in, I generally to stick to cross collar chokes, guillotines, or comedically taking the back.

**Brandon7889** · Posted On: 9/04/2007 10:32pm

I use the double underhooks pass in mma sparring frequently. Only time it goes wrong is when I push forward too hard, instead of "turtleing" up.

**Ryno** · Posted On: 9/05/2007 11:18am

Originally Posted by NSLightsOut

Ryno - If you grab on their thighs, the less chance of getting into that particular shoulder lock's territory exists. I've always got the shoulder lock when someone's tried to grab my belt, as it doesn't seem to control the hips quite as well

Thanks for the tip, and maybe I'll give it a shot next practice. I've barely ever used this pass, but had been meaning to expand my guard passing toolbox anyway, so might as well try it out.