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  1. Matt W. is offline
    Matt W.'s Avatar

    Community Corrections Officer

    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Spokane, WA
    Posts
    3,621

    Posted On:
    8/27/2007 2:13pm

    supporting member
     Style: Judo, TKD BB

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    DT's, gun disarms and Redman suit stuff

    I'm cross-posting this from my training log for discussion of the relevant topics.





    I had 3 days of Defensive Tactics training last week, now called “Control and Impedance Tactics.” Unfortunately, I can’t go into too much detail regarding the specific techniques we trained because the department would frown on me posting detailed descriptions of our tactics on the internet. But I will cover some generalities for my own benefit and for possible discussion.

    The 3 days were basically broken down like this: Day 1 consisted of a half day of classroom instruction on the Use of Force, followed by “Level 1” control techniques. Day 2 covered takedowns (also considered Level 1 techniques), reviewed the techs from Day 1 and then had the physical testing portion. Day 3 covered weapon retention and disarms, “ground survival” and a Redman suit drill.

    Day 1 covered four different wrist locks used fro pain compliance. Now, I have a dim view of wristlocks. The wrist is difficult to control on someone who is actively resisting. Also, due to the fact that the physical requirements for Probation Officers are even less than they are for other LEOs, the instructors really and to dumb stuff down and teach to the lowest common denominator. So this means everything was done compliantly and with a minimum of intensity. And we all know how effective that kind of training is…

    On the plus side, however, the techniques did seem useful for what they were intended for, which is this (are you listening Aikidoka???): Those level one techniques are only meant to be used on someone who is resisting passively (just standing there unresponsive), statically (tensing their muscles, but otherwise not moving) or egressively (they are pulling away). They are not meant to be applied to someone who is aggressively attacking you.

    In addition, the techniques are meant to work together and do flow quite well from one into the other. And finally,. they changed the curriculum (due to complaints about the lack of realism) so that these techniques were all practiced starting from a neutral, hands off position where you are facing the offender. And that is an improvement, IMO. So overall, Day 1 was not bad.

    Day 2 covered the takedowns, of which there were two. Both were arm based, and one was a variation after a failed attempt at the other. Again, they seemed to flow together well and worked well for what they were intended, which is the same as the other level 1 techniques. The testing was easy for me, of course, but everyone else passed too. No surprise there as the class is designed to pass people.

    Day 3 was the fun day. We worked with focus mitts and (the obligatory) BOB dummy. Palm strikes, elbow strikes, knees and a stop kicks. Most of it pretty standard stuff and decent. I’m unconvinced about the efficacy of palm strikes, though. We had the standard “hard to soft, soft to hard” justification for them, but they just don’t seem to have the power of punches. Can you break your hand punching bare-knuckle to someone’s dome? Of course. But I think I’d rather take that risk in the hopes of putting a guy down instead of bitch slapping him or shoving him in the chest which I’m pretty sure will do nothing.

    Ground survival was fun, but simply a chance for me to show off since even my white belt level groundfighting is light years beyond what they were teaching. Nevertheless the stuff they taught (basic positioning and a couple of mount escapes) was standard and very practical. In fact, it is stuff that could save an officer’s life if they find themselves underneath and offender who is going for their gun.

    Weapon retention was pretty straight forward. The principles was based on Trap, Blast, Detach, Move and Cover. Nothing fancy. The disarms were also cool. In truth, this was the first time I ever actively trained any gun disarms. There were no illusions. The scenario presented was one where you are reasonably sure the guy is going to kill you so you might as well try. For all they, the disarms were simple and effective. I really held on tightly to the blue training gun and the female officer I was working with was still able to get it away from me. Could I have still shot her? Who knows? But the disarm itself worked.

    Last we did the Redman suit drill. This is the first time I ever worked with one. It is far inferior to free sparring. BY FAR. Yet, I see the benefit. The people in the class capable of free sparring consisted exactly of myself and the two instructors. The suit gave all the other people a chance to apply the stuff they learned in a drill that was alive and where they could use full power.

    Here’s how my 30 seconds (yeah, that’s all) went. Started in interview stance, giving verbals. Offender came in on me and threw a haymaker. I stepped inside, grabbed and threw some knees, then hooked the arm and hip tossed. Guy landed in a perfect set-up for a Juji Gatame, but stop was called as it is basically impossible to wrestle in that suit. We reset and basically were just getting started again when time was called.

    Fun stuff. Not as good as Judo, but I get paid to do this. The only thing better is getting paid to shoot!
  2. Permalost is offline
    Permalost's Avatar

    pro nonsense self defense

    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    San Diego
    Posts
    12,472

    Posted On:
    8/28/2007 1:44am

    supporting member
     Style: FMA, dumbek, Indian clubs

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt W.
    Fun stuff. Not as good as Judo, but I get paid to do this. The only thing better is getting paid to shoot!
    I just started a self defense class that I'm getting college credit for that's almost entirely judo (the instructor was watching videos of judo competitions while waiting for everyone to arrive). I'm pretty happy about it.

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