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  1. sambosteve is offline
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    Stillness is death

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    Posted On:
    8/14/2007 11:26am

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     NY Combat Sambo Style: combat sambo

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Weeping Style Ju Jitsu??

    On another thread we were discussin a TKD school that also offers "Weeping Style Ju Jitsu". Upon some quick Googling of Weeping Style, it seems there are a ton of TKD schools offering this JJ style. From an outsider's point of view, it seems to be a way for them to give "credibility" to the fact that they offer "MMA". Looking through the websites of some of these schools, it seems the TKD backgrounds are vast...or at least credible. But the coaches in most cases have no experience with mma, only TKD or Karate....some minor grappling experience. Some of the schools claim to offer BJJ as well.

    Here are some the the google results for weeping style. I was shocked at how many TKD schools were offering this...

    This school was the focus of the original thread: www.tkdsites.us/ima/index.cfm

    A quick search gave me these other TKD schools that teach weeping style ju jitsu:

    1) Michael Deese's Taekwondo America, Winston-Salem, NC. Seems they offer certification seminars as well. http://deesetkd.com/index.htm

    2) Revolution Combat and Fitness. Instructor Abby Zeimer. This place is another TKD based club offering MMA. Benton, AR. Their link to the Weeping style JJ association is dead. http://www.revolutioncombatandfitness.com/index.html

    3) On the ICSF website, they have this TKD/Weeping style school listed in their dadtbase as an MMA club: http://www.livingdefense.com/live/ (Arkensas)

    4) yet another...snyders TKD/Weeping style jujitsu: http://www.snydertkd.com/jujutsu.htm

    I found many more karate/TKD based schools like this. Too many to post here.

    Does anyone know anything about the "Weeping Style"? It has been suggested that it is simply Japanese JJ renamed for a naive American audience.
    Last edited by sambosteve; 8/14/2007 11:30am at .
  2. Necroth is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/14/2007 11:57am


     Style: Vale Tudo

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    At your fourth link, I read these lines and suddenly was boggled:

    "This art offers the original techniques taught to the Japanese Samurai Warrior to be used on the battlefield. It is the ultimate in martial art hand-to-hand subject control utilizing joint locks, throws, ground fighting, pressure points, multi-attack situations, and much more. Donít confuse this with other arts using similar titles; these techniques have been tried and tested in battle conditions!"

    I never realized that Tae Kwon Do allows one to go back in time to witness exactly what "the Japanese Samurai Warrior" trained at. Amazing. I must learn what kata transports you back in time.

    It appears LDMA (Living Defense Martial Arts) is "the headquarters of the Weeping Style Jujutsu Association" and provides Snyder's with it's WSJJ and BJJ instructors. Any followup and inspection of credentials or style merits/flaws should probably go through them, as "headquarters" suggests all WSJJ started there.

    A word of warning: LDMA has a "Little Dragons" program. For 3 to 5 year olds. "I see a McBelt in your future, young Padawan. Would you like to learn the last, living artform of the Samurai?" I doubt they'll be very forthright with anyone concerning credentials, short of spouting off that they have Nova Uniao affiliation, so they have to be teh r3l Jiu Jitsu hombres.
  3. krazy kaju is offline
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    I'm not witty enough for this custom title.

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    Posted On:
    8/14/2007 12:18pm


     Style: In Hiatus

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Well, Jujitsu is the original H2H martial art used by the Samurai. Traditional Japanese Jujitsu has no groundfighting or striking at all, just throws and joint locks performed right after the throws, somewhat similar to aikido (but not really, lawlz).

    On the other hand, it cannot be pinned to any one style of Jujitsu, and 'Weeping Style' Jujitsu sounds like someone tried to combine something that sounds kung fu-ish with a 'jujitsu' at the end to get all the wanna-be "ultimate fighters" and all the wanna-be ninjers/kung fools to take their classes.

    Just the name screams bullshido.
  4. Rubberduck is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/14/2007 1:16pm


     Style: Savate

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    What kind name is Weeping Style anyway? Is there also Sobbing Style, Bawling Style, Crying Like River Style, Emo Style?:jerk:
  5. stray_bullet is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/14/2007 3:12pm


     Style: Inactive

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I dont know a lot about the Weeping (also Weeping Willow) style in particular, but here are a few links with descriptions of the Weeping Willow Curriculum. In case it was missed, Weeping Willow Jujutsu is led by a man named Berl Parsons.

    http://72.14.205.104/search?q=cache:...lnk&cd=2&gl=us

    http://72.14.205.104/search?q=cache:...lnk&cd=3&gl=us

    The LDMA WW Jujutsu curriculum description: "At LDMA, the Weeping Style Jujutsu program focuses on standing joint locks and control holds. Aspects of Kickboxing and Brazilian JiuJitsu are blended in this class in order to make it a VERY effective class for pure self defense."

    As far as LDMA is concerned, they are a legit school. Judging from the little time I had spent there, the school was very well run and had a strong combat sports curriculum. From what i recall, Danny Dring has a a 5th Dan in Joe Lewis Kickboxing Systems, is a black belt in BJJ, master level rank in Taekwondo, as well. Even his TKD curriculum had a good dose of realism in it while still retaining the classical aspects of the art.

    For a long time his school was the center of MMA / BJJ / Kickboxing in Central Arkansas. About a year and a half ago Danny and his Senior Student/Assistant Instructor, Matt Hamilton went in different directions and now Matt owns a very nice MMA gym across town http://kickboxingandbjj.com .Since the split LDMA looks to have gone downhill and now there is what seems to be a lot of bad blood between the two schools and their affiliate clubs.

    One thing that sticks out in my head is looking around in the lobby and seeing Danny's Certificates of Rank along the walls. I recall seeing plaques that listed his rank in Weeping Willow, and him going up from 1st, 2nd, 3rd, etc. until a 6th dan with a year between each dan rank. I always thought of that as being a bit suspect.
  6. kismasher is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/14/2007 3:17pm

    supporting member
     Style: boxing/muy thai

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    http://www.usmaf.org/systems/systems.html

    well, i'm not seeing anything here. ^^
  7. KayRoc is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/14/2007 3:33pm


     Style: Crappling (BJJ Hiatus)

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    It makes me want to weep.
  8. Askari is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/14/2007 4:12pm


     Style: BJJ, Ju-Jitsu

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by stray_bullet
    As far as LDMA is concerned, they are a legit school. Judging from the little time I had spent there, the school was very well run and had a strong combat sports curriculum. From what i recall, Danny Dring has a a 5th Dan in Joe Lewis Kickboxing Systems, is a black belt in BJJ, master level rank in Taekwondo, as well. Even his TKD curriculum had a good dose of realism in it while still retaining the classical aspects of the art.
    Worth repeating before the thread drifts away.

    Dring also host Grappling tournaments and a Modern Ringsport MMA tournament in February of 2007.

    The name of their style might be goofy, but they are fighting and cross training appropriately.
    "Sifu, I"m niether - I'm a fire dragon so don't **** with me!"
  9. sambosteve is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/14/2007 4:18pm

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     NY Combat Sambo Style: combat sambo

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I found an old thread on some forum when searching for weeping style. This guy "Berl Parsons" claimed to be a "covert CIA opperative" in the 1970's. OK, why would a covert guy brag about being covert...LOL. It defeats the purpose even if the guy is retired. Anytime people brag about their "Special Forces" or "Special Ops" or "Covert" backgrounds for marketing purposes, my BS detector starts to vibrate.

    One thing that sticks out in my head is looking around in the lobby and seeing Danny's Certificates of Rank along the walls. I recall seeing plaques that listed his rank in Weeping Willow, and him going up from 1st, 2nd, 3rd, etc. until a 6th dan with a year between each dan rank. I always thought of that as being a bit suspect.
    Interesting for sure...
  10. sambosteve is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/14/2007 4:25pm

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Matt Hamilton's gym looks good based on the website. Do you know who awarded Hamilton and Dring their BJJ black belts?

    I suppose, assuming LMDA is legit, the question is...what goes into their handing out of belts to these other instructors?
    Last edited by sambosteve; 8/14/2007 4:30pm at .
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