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  1. ScyberMonk is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/30/2007 4:27am


     Style: Way of the Void

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I, personally, had a freakin' blast.

    Jim is exactly as big as his name indicates, and the holds he demo'd on me were just scruptious.

    I didn't get to do any real stand up sparring with deadmeat, which is just as well, as Monk is hiiiideously out of shape. But the grappling was fun, and I will do things differently now that I know which rules they imploy.

    The eye gouge was utterly unintentional, I was going for your mouth again. And when I tried to smother, you almost bit me, you cheeky sod!*grin* It was good to see that response, actually.

    And you didn't do too adly with Yoshi, but that one toss was freakin hilarious.

    I apologize for my intensity, I have not sparred in any form of light contact for maaaaany years, and thus, am out of touch with the gentler aspects. I will be internalizing all this, and doing differently on a return.

    Thank you so much for having me, I look forward to it happening again, with maybe my petrol tank not deflating so quickly, and some harder contact sparring between us. I'd also like to tinker around with some holds and locks, because those are always fun.

    Tell Jim and Yoshi I say thank you again, I had an absolute blast!
  2. bob is offline
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    Prophet of Apathy

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    Posted On:
    8/30/2007 4:35am


     Style: MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Deadmeat
    My conclusion is that Monk can fight - admittedly, in a somewhat unorthodox manner, but well enough to beat an untrained individual. I do not feel he is of sufficient proficiency to teach individuals intending to compete in MMA, nor to compete in MMA himself.
    Nice work DM.

    I realise the vids are going to be up at some point and everyone's going to make up their own mind, but I'm going to put you on the spot here and ask - his own fighting ability aside - do you think that he has sufficient proficiency and technical knowledge to be teaching any martial arts to punters off the street? Any opinions from your colleagues?

    My 2c - from what I've seen on the videos and from what you've said monk sounds like an enthusiastic amateur who could be a decent fighter with training. This emphatically does not translate to being qualified to teach anyone anything, particularly if you're taking money off them.
    Last edited by bob; 8/30/2007 4:39am at .
  3. Conztant is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/30/2007 5:14am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Judo/TKD noob/BJJ noob

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Thank you to DM, Monk, Yoshi, and big jim!! cant wait to see the vids.

    Im glad for monks willingness to learn maybe now you ({monk} could possibly do some formal training also.

    And yes from what you've discribed sounds like a enthusiastic amateur. but it still sounds like through the discription that he dosnt have much to teach thats all but I will keep my scepitcism back untill the vids come out. Agreed Bornsceptic...

    Again thanks to all who participated in this event!!! cant wait for the vids!!!
  4. jtkarate is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/30/2007 5:56am


     Style: karate,judo,JJ,Aikido,TKD

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by bornsceptic
    Nice work DM.

    My 2c - from what I've seen on the videos and from what you've said monk sounds like an enthusiastic amateur who could be a decent fighter with training. This emphatically does not translate to being qualified to teach anyone anything, particularly if you're taking money off them.


    Agreed.



    DM ..excellent writeup...sounds like a good time was had by all .



    Monk ...I will own up and give you your props for being true to your word and showing up.

    Too many times when you (for lack of a better phrase) call someone out they talk big about how they will do this and that but wuss out in the end.

    Hopefully you gained from this experience that you may need to get your skills squared away first before trying to teach anyone.

    Once again good job guys can't wait to see the Vids.
  5. GoldenJonas is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/30/2007 9:02am

    Join us... or die
     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Great write-up DM;

    Much respect to Monk. Regardless of whether he is a competent fighter or teacher he at least had the balls to show up and put what he knows on the line.

    Many MA's can be described as "unorthodox" as far as practical, i.e., realistic and usable, theory go; but, not many guys who practice those arts would be willing to put their "styles" to the test against proved fighting systems in a fully resistant environment, i.e., MMA, BJJ, Muay Thai, Judo, Submission Grappling, for fear of having there MA illusory bubble destroyed.

    It is encouraging that you are going to consider returning to train at DM's gym. From DM's write-up you seem young, athletic, and eager to learn, all of these traits could potentially make you into a good practitioner providing your have the right coaching and skill set.

    On the "teaching" issue, I whole-heartedly agree with the above posters and DM's conclusion that you should not be teaching anything right now; but I look forward to seeing the video.
  6. djrand is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/30/2007 9:12am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: judo, bjj

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Deadmeat,
    You say he shouldnt be training people to compete in mma, but what about training people period? That was the main issue of this thread and it seems to have become slightly glossed over in all this. His ability to fight was only called into question in regard to his teaching others to fight. So what do you think about monk teaching his style to other people?

    On a side note monk you do get props for actually showing up, and I apologize for calling into question your mental stability from what deadmeat writes you seem to be an ok individual, however I do still have great doubts about your teaching and your style in general. But seeing as you were respectful and receptive to deadmeat perhaps we can train together when you come back to the BG area and I can get a first hand look as DM did.
  7. Deadmeat is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/31/2007 1:36am


     Style: Mixed Martial Arts

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by bornsceptic
    Nice work DM.

    I realise the vids are going to be up at some point and everyone's going to make up their own mind, but I'm going to put you on the spot here and ask - his own fighting ability aside - do you think that he has sufficient proficiency and technical knowledge to be teaching any martial arts to punters off the street? Any opinions from your colleagues?

    My 2c - from what I've seen on the videos and from what you've said monk sounds like an enthusiastic amateur who could be a decent fighter with training. This emphatically does not translate to being qualified to teach anyone anything, particularly if you're taking money off them.
    Quote Originally Posted by djrand
    Deadmeat,
    You say he shouldnt be training people to compete in mma, but what about training people period? That was the main issue of this thread and it seems to have become slightly glossed over in all this. His ability to fight was only called into question in regard to his teaching others to fight. So what do you think about monk teaching his style to other people?

    On a side note monk you do get props for actually showing up, and I apologize for calling into question your mental stability from what deadmeat writes you seem to be an ok individual, however I do still have great doubts about your teaching and your style in general. But seeing as you were respectful and receptive to deadmeat perhaps we can train together when you come back to the BG area and I can get a first hand look as DM did.
    Honestly, It's hard for me to say. The sparring was conducted in a way that was clearly alien to Monk, and I didn't observe much of what he would teach in his class. If I had to exercise my personal judgement, It probably sounds like hedging but all I can say is that I don't feel he is qualified to teach Martial Arts in the capacity that I know them. he's teaching what seems to be some form of RBSD with a heavy dose of oriental philosophy thrown in, and archaic rather than modern weaponry. He stated that he has trained in various arts since he was "knee-high to a grasshopper", but did not give any lineage or specifics. To all intents and purposes he doesn't appear to have any licenses/accreditations/credentials to teach any recognised system, but because he refuses to state that he is teaching any established style, he doesn't need them.

    if I wanted a loved one to get martial arts training, would I send them to Musashi's Bar and Grill? The answer is no.

    Having said that, his students are returning.

    Quote Originally Posted by Conztant
    Thank you to DM, Monk, Yoshi, and big jim!! cant wait to see the vids.

    Im glad for monks willingness to learn maybe now you ({monk} could possibly do some formal training also.

    And yes from what you've discribed sounds like a enthusiastic amateur. but it still sounds like through the discription that he dosnt have much to teach thats all but I will keep my scepitcism back untill the vids come out. Agreed Bornsceptic...

    Again thanks to all who participated in this event!!! cant wait for the vids!!!
    Obviously, Monk enjoyed the experience immensely, and it seems likely that he will seek out the same sort of training. I sincerely doubt that that he will stop teaching his class. More likely, he will start incorporating the things he learns into his classes.

    The sparring vids will be out as soon as I can get them from Lance - the Muay Thai Guy. He had to leave early due to work commitments, but I'll be catching up with him over the weekend. I will be chasing him for them because as the saying goes - no vid = didn't happen.

    For your entertainment, here's a clip I spliced together from the footage Monk took - it's basically Yoshi demoing some no-gi throws on me. I was asked to use a few different grips by Jim, so he could observe what Yoshi would do. It wasn't Randori - just me being a grapple dummy.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tiigbcybKQ0
    Last edited by Deadmeat; 8/31/2007 1:44am at .
  8. Deadmeat is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/31/2007 2:00am


     Style: Mixed Martial Arts

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by ScyberMonk
    I, personally, had a freakin' blast.

    Jim is exactly as big as his name indicates, and the holds he demo'd on me were just scruptious.

    I didn't get to do any real stand up sparring with deadmeat, which is just as well, as Monk is hiiiideously out of shape. But the grappling was fun, and I will do things differently now that I know which rules they imploy.
    The main thing is that you enjoyed yourself, and I'm sure your fitness will return easily enough. To be honest, though, you probably wouldn't have gassed as quickly if you were a little less tense in the upper body.

    Quote Originally Posted by ScyberMonk
    The eye gouge was utterly unintentional, I was going for your mouth again. And when I tried to smother, you almost bit me, you cheeky sod!*grin* It was good to see that response, actually.
    I knew that mate, and you were quite gentlemanly about it, lol. I hope I didn't make it seem that it was an intentional thing on your part. In regards to the almost biting thing, that was a result of your hand moving around my mouth for the smother attempt - an automatic response to your finger pressing against my palate. To reiterate your conduct was totally fine, and I know that you had absolutely no intention of eye gouging

    Quote Originally Posted by ScyberMonk
    And you didn't do too adly with Yoshi, but that one toss was freakin hilarious.
    Yeah. The cracked ribs were an unpleasant surprise, but at least I was able to carry on and do a couple of rounds kickboxing with him afterwards.

    Quote Originally Posted by ScyberMonk
    I apologize for my intensity, I have not sparred in any form of light contact for maaaaany years, and thus, am out of touch with the gentler aspects. I will be internalizing all this, and doing differently on a return.
    Intensity isn't an issue when sparring someone with whom you are familiar. It's adviseable to be a bit more relaxed if you are "feeling each other out." Lance and I tend to spar with harder contact, probably because he's a MT guy, and that's how they play, but I'm much more familiar with him, so it's appropriate.

    Quote Originally Posted by ScyberMonk
    Thank you so much for having me, I look forward to it happening again, with maybe my petrol tank not deflating so quickly, and some harder contact sparring between us. I'd also like to tinker around with some holds and locks, because those are always fun.

    Tell Jim and Yoshi I say thank you again, I had an absolute blast!
    No problem. Thanks again for coming. I'll message you once the vids are up, and if you want a copy of the original files, let me know.
  9. Scrapper is offline
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    Fear and bullets.

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    Posted On:
    8/31/2007 7:03am

    staff
     Style: MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Well done Deadmeat and Monk. This is was a highly satisfactory result of this thread. I hope Monk finds real training, and becomes a real fighter. It sounds like he has the chops for it. I also hope he stops teaching until he has some real experience. All that Aside, Monk, you deserve a lot of credit for the wringer you've been through.

    Good work both of you.
    And lo, Kano looked down upon the field and saw the multitudes. Amongst them were the disciples of Uesheba who were greatly vexed at his sayings. And Kano spake: "Do not be concerned with the mote in thy neighbor's eye, when verily thou hast a massive stick in thine ass".

    --Scrolls of Bujutsu: Chapter 5 vs 10-14.
  10. Deadmeat is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/31/2007 11:57pm


     Style: Mixed Martial Arts

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I'm meeting with Lance for a training session on Monday Night. I will be getting the vids from him then, and will post them either that night or the following day.
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