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Thread: Hidden in Forms

  1. #11
    Frank White's Avatar
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    Ive heard thai dancers are actually doing martial moves that would apply if the dancer were wearing blades affixed to their ankles and wrists. Although I didnt understand why women would be learning a dance that male fighters would be uaing in combat.

    And what about th tai chi guys? I was told they made their forms look softer so they could still practice under Mao's China, make it look like a chi dance, less like a fighting art.

    Might not fall under hidden techniques category, but anyone with tai chi or muay thai background would know.

  2. #12
    It is Fake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by switchblade
    Ive heard thai dancers are actually doing martial moves that would apply if the dancer were wearing blades affixed to their ankles and wrists. Although I didnt understand why women would be learning a dance that male fighters would be uaing in combat.
    MT don't know.
    And what about th tai chi guys? I was told they made their forms look softer so they could still practice under Mao's China, make it look like a chi dance, less like a fighting art.
    No that is what modern Wushu is supposed to be. Plus, softer Tai Chi is purposely slower for health reasons. Has nothing to do with hiding it in plain site. This is something said about many styles during Mao's reign not just Tai Chi.

    Also, out of all the books written about Tai Chi, I find it hard to believe not one person suggested this about Tai Chi. I mean if you go ahead and write about the separation between the health and martial Tai Chi, you would also explain why it was made softer for your reason.

    We've explained it somewhere here slow for health, medium for memorization/practice, fast for application/fighting.

    Might not fall under hidden techniques category, but anyone with tai chi or muay thai background would know.
    Cullion, Myself, Repulsive Monkey and a few others have Tai Chi Backgrounds.

  3. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by switchblade
    Ive heard thai dancers are actually doing martial moves that would apply if the dancer were wearing blades affixed to their ankles and wrists. Although I didnt understand why women would be learning a dance that male fighters would be uaing in combat.

    And what about th tai chi guys? I was told they made their forms look softer so they could still practice under Mao's China, make it look like a chi dance, less like a fighting art.

    Might not fall under hidden techniques category, but anyone with tai chi or muay thai background would know.

    If you are talking about the dance that is done at the start of a muay thai match I had heard that it was a way of praying or offering thanks to the gods and the people that helped get that person there.

    There are several martial arts that went underground and wound up disguised as a dance at one time or another.

  4. #14
    Scott Larson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by It is Fake
    Less obvious is not the same as hidden.
    Right, so sometimes its a wording issue. I've heard people say movements are hidden in forms, but had what was hidden explained to me. So it isn't always what you are talking about.

  5. #15
    It is Fake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hui_Xiu
    Right, so sometimes its a wording issue. I've heard people say movements are hidden in forms, but had what was hidden explained to me. So it isn't always what you are talking about.
    I'm sorry if you can't look at a form and tell what a large majority of the techniques are something is wrong. No this doesn't mean you don't need help practicing said form but, I should be able to tell the "flavor" of what is being performed.
    So, what part of this didn't you understand? Sounds like exactly what you are trying to chastise me about. I never said always I gave a specific example of what I was talking about.

  6. #16
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    I'm sorry if it seems I am chastising you. I was just offering a different viewpoint. More for the benefit of others than you.

  7. #17
    It is Fake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hui_Xiu
    I'm sorry if it seems I am chastising you. I was just offering a different viewpoint. More for the benefit of others than you.
    Like I said in my OP there are techniques to be worked out. People say hidden for a specific reason and it isn't vague. Unless you speak a foreign language.

    I gave a specific example so yes your viewpoint is valid but, not in the context I applied.

  8. #18
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    Not sure you can get a great deal of information on the style from a viewing a form, most of the importnant stuff is hidden within the forms.
    This is the context, does it make more sense now? So, your explanation doesn't fit with what this guy is saying at all.

    It comes from another forum.

  9. #19
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    Well, nothing is hidden per se in forms, but whether a form represent only the first and obvious technique depends, in my opinion, on how general the form is. Many forms are meant to represent a concept as well as an application, and applying that concept in other ways could be seen by some as an "hidden meaning". For instance, the first forms in many systems often contain their basic power generation methods. Many teachers would say, quite rightly in my own opinion, that if you get these basic forms, understanding the rest is trivial, since it's only other applications of the same stuff.

    But the people you're probably talking about, itisfake, are stretching this past its limit. NO, there is no hidden grappling in a striking form. And even if there were, training it in the air as a striking form will not make you good at grappling.

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guizzy
    Well, nothing is hidden per se in forms, but whether a form represent only the first and obvious technique depends, in my opinion, on how general the form is. Many forms are meant to represent a concept as well as an application, and applying that concept in other ways could be seen by some as an "hidden meaning". For instance, the first forms in many systems often contain their basic power generation methods. Many teachers would say, quite rightly in my own opinion, that if you get these basic forms, understanding the rest is trivial, since it's only other applications of the same stuff.

    But the people you're probably talking about, itisfake, are stretching this past its limit. NO, there is no hidden grappling in a striking form. And even if there were, training it in the air as a striking form will not make you good at grappling.
    Other applications still aren't hidden. Basic punch is still a punch. A more advance punch isn't hidden you just need to learn. To say you can't get the flavor of a style because things are hidden is ridiculous.


    It is like the dumb **** Omar was spewing about Pi Quan. A palm strike becomes a take down? WTF?

    Can you hit someone and knock them down with Pi quan? Yes.

    Is it a take down hidden inside a form? No. Seriously you might as well say a right cross, that knock someone out, is now a take down.

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