Berkley, MI: Robert Brown's "School of Chinese Martial Arts"

***DerAuslander*** · Posted On: 9/16/2009 11:57am

If you'd rather train with a cult leader who misuses religious teachings for his own benefit, then I would say that you have a problem.

**stoodawg** · Posted On: 9/16/2009 4:34pm

Well, that's your entitled opinion, based on your perceptions.
My perspective is rather different, and so is my opinion.

***DerAuslander*** · Posted On: 9/16/2009 4:59pm

That's not my opinion.

That's objective fact.

He is misusing the teachings of Zen for profit.

**apopofski** · Posted On: 10/06/2009 11:38am

How about this? I just found this today. Being one of the few Braz. JJ black belts in Michigan, I know he is lying about this...unless he has a new instructor.

http://marketplace.theoaklandpress.c...3092&cat=12343

**IXxAZAZELxXI** · Posted On: 10/08/2009 12:40am

Is that for real?

**It is Fake** · Posted On: 10/08/2009 6:54am

Originally Posted by apopofski

How about this? I just found this today. Being one of the few Braz. JJ black belts in Michigan, I know he is lying about this...unless he has a new instructor.

http://marketplace.theoaklandpress.c...3092&cat=12343

In fact please research before you imply someone is lying.
http://zenmartialarts.com/blog/archives/129

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October 6, 2009 at 1:38 pm · Filed under Current News

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**IXxAZAZELxXI** · Posted On: 10/08/2009 4:47pm

Im really missing out now

**Goon** · Posted On: 2/16/2010 9:32pm

I know this is a little late but, I had to get my 2 cents in. I've visited SCMA years ago. I never participated in a class/intro but, I did go visit the school. I really liked the facility and location. It was clean, in great condition and a good sized building. Parking was cool too. I've seen the school featured on some local news casts as well.

Now, the Dagon guy-and others-have brought up some legitimate questions about the school but, many of the questions I saw repeated here were just plain stupid. Stuff like, "How long does it take to get to the advanced class?" are dumb-at least loaded-questions to ask. Some people learn faster than others. Many of the questions the Dagon guy asked seemed just like this-loaded and/or stupid. Ask a stupid question, get a...

Dagon did seem to have about as many good points as he did dumb questions though. When I experience a school that says it's Chinese but, everything inside the "dojo" is Japanese and Korean then that really makes me wonder. If the school is Japanese then butterfly swords and a Korean flag probably aren't the best things to hang on the wall. If the school is Chinese, then it's best not to have a daisho on display in the "dojo." I can understand if there are a few anachronisms but, it/they should be the exception-not the rule. It's been said that the SCMA Si Fu (and yes, Si Fu does mean teacher) was brought up on Japanese arts. Cool...but, if one wants it to be a Japanese school then just say so. I'm not going to open up a pizza joint, start selling fried chicken and then say, "Hey! I was brought up on chicken!" Either SCMA's a Chinese joint or it isn't. That's a big pet peave with me. So what if people are more familiar with Japanese terms? If they can't learn new terms then how can they learn new techniques and lifestyles? How did they come to learn the Japanese terms to begin with then? I hate it when "Chinese" schools award belts, and when Japanese schools wear Kung fu unis. I can see Dagon's skepticism on this part. If you're teaching Kung Fu then it's probably better to use the right lingo...and it's also respectful to acknowledge the system's originating culture by using its language and terminology.

The first thing that raised an eyebrow with me a long time ago was that one time I contacted the school and asked them what they taught. I was told "Shao Lin." Later I visited the school and was told "Yue Chia." Now some people do use the term Shao Lin loosely but, it sounded a bit fishy to me.

A lot of the issues talked about here are a matter of opinion though. For example I understand why it takes longer for most Chinese systems to reach the point of sparring compared to others. Some schools start contact early on and some don't. Really it's up to you. In general it comes down to what you're looking for and I think all the questions Dagon got from SCMA were aimed at that. Some people wanna be the next Bruce Lee, Michelle Yeoh or Jackie Chan...and then some people just want to loose some weight. Some people wanna win trophies and contests while others just don't want to get raped or mugged. If you are a strict purist who wants to learn Chinese martial arts in their purest form then maybe SCMA is not your first choice. If you want to go into MMA then maybe it's not your first choice. If you just want to learn self defense however...or maybe just want to lose some weight or take on a new healthy life style then this school may be just what the doctor ordered. One thing I will say is that the SCMA has been around for a while and that says something...usually really crappy schools eventually fold. Maybe SCMA is not the Ching Mo Academy or such but, I can think of a whole lot worse. Remember that school of "Chinese Martial Arts" on 9-Mile and Woodward in Ferndale? Now there's a real joke...

**Mtripp** · Posted On: 2/16/2010 11:38pm

Yes, indeed. I have been in Michigan my entire life. I am aware of all the players, and know where all the bodies are buried.

There have been a great many major frauds and bullshido here in the Metro Detroit area. From NAAMA to Judo and Karate Schools of America; we have had a great many, and I know of them all.

Of THIS school, I can go back a great many years when Jim Harper was speaking of them a great deal. I remember him plugging their weekend "ground fighting" seminar. As I recall your "sifu" taught that one, but whomever it was, they were clueless.

I remember my questioning students at a demonstration about why would a school in traditional chinese uniforms, claiming to teach traditional chinese martial arts, use japanese terms for all of their techniques? You can say that doesn't matter, but of course it does. NO LEGITMATE teacher of traditional chinese martial arts (or TCMA) would use anything other than the Chinese, UNLESS either they or whomever taught them, was a fraud. It simply would not happen.

Finally, I keep to myself these days, and it is possible someone has come here that I know nothing of. However, I KNOW Angelo is legit. I have seen him fight and know his background and how he came up the ranks. I do not know this person claiming to be the highest ranked BJJ black belt in Michigan.

**IXxAZAZELxXI** · Posted On: 2/27/2010 8:16pm

Call it what ever you will, It's still a great place (probably the best place) To learn martial arts weather it be japanese or chinese, it's still just martial arts. I have been to many a places in the recent years here in texas. Ive practiced at Gracie Barra schools down here, Green power ranger school (Rising sun,HAHAHA, It was laughable.) And a kuk sool won school and I'll tell ya even if y'all think your being scammed there, Trust me these so called "legit places" can't even come close to what you can learn there. So if you people think sifu is a fraud, then I say probably the best experienced fraud i have ever had the pleasure of practicing with in my life. And trust me, ive being practicing for about 14 years, I know what Im looking at.