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  1. Gumby is offline

    BJJ Purple Belt

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    Sep 2004
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    881

    Posted On:
    8/07/2007 9:44am


     Style: Brazilian Jiu Jitsu

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    The kneebar is just as applicable in MMA as any other leglock is. I wouldnt say that the kneebar specifically leaves one vulnerable to strikes, but rather that leg locks as a whole leaves one vulnerable to strikes. As such, I think thats why you see less people use them.

    Im personally not a fan of leg locks. The only one that really has a place in my arsenal is a kneebar. So many people use leg locks in grappling, but they dramatically drop in an MMA match where your opponent does have the opportunity to throw a few shots at your face.

    That being said, I think kneebars work just fine, provided you dont attempt to "force" the technique when its not there. It also depends on how you position yourself and how you opponent defends. I believe Ricco Rodriguez won his KOTC championship match with a kneebar, so its very applicable, just not as much so in comparison with a grappling competition.
  2. M-Tri is offline
    M-Tri's Avatar

    Pseudo-Scrambler Extraordinaire

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    Posted On:
    8/15/2007 1:28am

    supporting member
     Style: Mixed Martial Arts

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Leglocks are great in MMA, especially kneebars...
  3. KuNg FooL is offline

    Registered Member

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    Posted On:
    8/15/2007 3:03am


     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Watch Sakuraba vs Newton in PRIDE. That was a good one. Most recently off the top of my head I remember Josh Barnett almost getting a good one on Nogueira, so the excuse of it not working nowadays isn't too accurate considering Nog knows his **** and still got really close to tapping to a kneebar.
  4. Donkey_Fizzle is offline

    Using Donkey Guard to Sniffz Your Feetz

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    Posted On:
    8/15/2007 9:28am


     Style: Kick Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Reverse kneebars are quite tasty and a lot easier to execute w/o have to 100% commit to one particular submission. That and you can easily transition to ankle locks or heel hooks. I for one love lower body submissions, particularly ankles. I am the "leg lock guy" in my gym and even with people knowing that I tap more people from hip/knee/ankle submissions that I do from everything else combined. But I have to agree with Gumby and say that kneebars aren't something that should be forced in an MMA situation. Almost every time I have tried to specifically set up a kneebar I have wound up putting myself in a comprimised position. But if it is there to be capitalized on then by all means take it. IME setting them up is the dangerous part, not the execution.
    Amateur MMA record: 8-3-1
    Pro MMA record: 3-1
    Status: Semi retarded... I mean retired
  5. Meager is offline
    Meager's Avatar

    Registered Member

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    Posted On:
    8/19/2007 9:33am


     Style: BJJ & MT

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Cracky McSlugHoot
    How often at ADCC for that matter?
    I haven't watched that much ADCC but from what I've seen most subs landed are your standard armbars, triangles and RNCs. Doesn't mean other subs don't have their place.
    Quote Originally Posted by KuNg FooL
    Watch Sakuraba vs Newton in PRIDE. That was a good one. Most recently off the top of my head I remember Josh Barnett almost getting a good one on Nogueira, so the excuse of it not working nowadays isn't too accurate considering Nog knows his **** and still got really close to tapping to a kneebar.
    If there were another 30 seconds on the clock I'm pretty sure Barnett would have finished it.
  6. J-Lau is offline
    J-Lau's Avatar

    UFC Fighter

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    Posted On:
    8/20/2007 2:21pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: MMA, No-Gi Grappling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    A kneebar is a great move when you can manipulate your opponent enough to stay away from his strikes and get the most leverage possible. Nothing is perfect though, so you gotta find that happy medium or getting it done and taking a little damage.
  7. Donkey_Fizzle is offline

    Using Donkey Guard to Sniffz Your Feetz

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    Posted On:
    8/20/2007 4:49pm


     Style: Kick Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    100% true or **** like
    <<<<<<<<<<<<that happens to ya.
    Amateur MMA record: 8-3-1
    Pro MMA record: 3-1
    Status: Semi retarded... I mean retired
  8. Hank8th is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/23/2007 11:25pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    In theory? Leglocks in general are pretty risky; you have to commit your whole body to one limb while leaving your opponents main ground-strking tools (his hands) with unrestricted access to whatever body part he can reach. And they seem to be pretty low-percentage subs.

    In reality? Ask Jeremy Horn, who was quick to tap when Frank Shamrock caught him in a kneebar. But what about those 'no striking to the back of the head' rules? Wouldn't that be a deterent to turning your back to an opponent on the ground? Ahh, then you'd have to ask Kimo, who was snagged in a kneebar and tapped anyway when the other Shamrock brother caught him. He seemed to be too busy wincing and tapping the mat to think of punching Ken in the back of the head, which was a perfectly legal strategy back then. I also seem to remember Minowa snagging a few kneebars...

    Are kneebars risky? Sure. Are they applicable? Obviously they are, given the situation. Are they a high-percentage sub? Not really, if you compare them to other, upper-body subs. Do they add another interesting dimension to ground-fighting and, therefore, MMA? I definitely think so.
  9. Angry-Monkey is offline

    Welterweight

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    593

    Posted On:
    8/23/2007 11:48pm

    supporting member
     Style: BJJ/Kickboxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by tabwyo
    I'd have to agree with Cracky, to a point. Kneebars are fun to do in practice but the risk vs reward factor in a MMA match doesn't compute. Frankly because when you can't finish it you are is a **** position. It's one of those submissions that stays in my little bag of tricks until it presents it self. I don't deliberately set them up.
    I like to use the kneebar to sweep from open guard to set up a more dominant position.
  10. Captain Spaulding is offline

    Registered Member

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    hmm... it's awful dark in here
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    Posted On:
    8/24/2007 11:17am


     Style: TKD, BJJ

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Frank Shamrock used one to beat Jeremy Horn. Horn had gotten to Shamrock's back while standing and was trying to take him down. Shamrock defended by holding onto the cage (which was legal at the time). Horn eventually succeeded, but one of his legs ended up inbetween Shamrock's, who then did a kneebar. I really only bring this up because it's my favorite fight, but one that not a lot of people know about.
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