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  1. Cuchulain is offline

    Keeping you safe from Mongolians

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    Posted On:
    7/26/2007 9:42am


     Style: Sanda/Taijiquan *Hiatus*

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Help from San Da players, (plus Taijiquan practitioners)

    I'm gonna be entering a Sanda comp in Sept, i've been preparing for a kickboxing ring fight that has fallen through, so i've opted for this as an alternative.

    This will be my first fight, let alone my first Sanda match. My question is how should/can i adopt to this new ruleset? What won't work from my Thai boxing training? i.e stance?

    My next concern relates to throws... I don't know any. Well i can get underhooks and pick someone up, i train that and also single and double leg, though from what i understand i don't want to go to the ground with them in Sanda, i need to stay standing. What throws should i practice? I figure i should just learn 2 or 3 and get good at them.

    In Tai Chi i've been shown a couple from the forms but have never drilled them. I think;

    1, 'Brush knee and step' for catching kicks
    2, ' Snake Creeps down' for slipping a cross (called a shoulder wheel throw in judo)

    What do you think?
  2. Jack Rusher is offline
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    Posted On:
    7/26/2007 10:09am


     Style: ti da shuai na

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    From your questions, you seem to know what you should work on. The two big problems most fighters encounter when switching from MT rules to san da rules are coping with the side kick and avoiding/performing takedowns. I would recommend:

    1) Get the best side-kicker at your gym to punish you with sidekicks while working the various counters discussed in this thread. The standard Thai stance leaves an open target on the low belly for quick push kicks, so expect to get hit there quite often while you're working on this.

    2) Work with someone from your gym who is a good kick catcher to learn how to deal with getting your round kick caught (balance, counters, &c). One combination you'll see in san da is a rear leg round kick that gets caught followed by the kicker punching with the hand on the same side as his kicking foot while the defender still has his hands down on the kicker's leg (sort of using the kick to draw down the defender's guard). Try it, you might like it.

    3) In addition to working your own kick catches, do loads of judo/shuai jiao throwing drills while wearing the type of gloves required by the tournament. You'll want to get used to using gloved underhooks instead of grabbing.

    Good luck and have a great time.
  3. Ronin.74 is offline

    霍氏八极拳徒弟

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    Posted On:
    7/26/2007 10:47am


     Style: CMA,Muay Thai ,Yudo,TKD

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Jack has pretty much summed up what you need to do. Work your kick catches, if you can catch the kick you can kick his support leg out which counts as a throw.

    You should be able to treat side kicks the same as a front kick. All of your MT teepe defenses should pretty much work the same against a side kick with little or no modification.

    Train reaping throws from the clinch (sorry don't know the judo name for it) and your MT coach should know some upper body throws from a clinch position since MT does have them.

    You should also get details from the event sponsor on what constitutes a successful throw. In some fights if the person executing the throw does not remain standing, he receives no points for the throw. If this is the case everytime you feel yourself going over trying tying up as best as you can and pulling him down with you. I was at a 3 team event in China that had this rule, since the foreigners were easily outclassed in the throwing dept. they resorted to this tactic to stop points from being earned on throws, this forced the Chinese fighters to remain standing and bang it out with them.
  4. Ming Loyalist is offline
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    solves problems with violence

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    Posted On:
    7/26/2007 11:23am

    supporting member
     Style: Judo, Hung Family Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    good points by jack and ronin.

    some tournaments give more points if the thrower remains standing than if the thrower also falls down. if the thrower does also fall down, some tournaments will give a point if they land on top.

    beware hip throws and trips from the clinch because (as i understand the MT ruleset) they are illegal in MT. you will be especially vulnerable to throws when kneeing in the clinch, so be careful.
    "Face punches are an essential character building part of a martial art. You don't truly love your children unless you allow them to get punched in the face." - chi-conspiricy
    "When I was a little boy, I had a sailor suit, but it didn't mean I was in the Navy." - Mtripp on the subject of a 5 year old karate black belt
    "Without actual qualifications to be a Zen teacher, your instructor is just another roundeye raping Asian culture for a buck." - Errant108
    "Seriously, who gives a **** what you or Errant think? You're Asian males, everyone just ignores you, unless you're in a krotty movie." - new2bjj
  5. Permalost is offline
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    pro nonsense self defense

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    Posted On:
    7/26/2007 11:59am

    supporting member
     Style: FMA, dumbek, Indian clubs

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I've seen sloppy thai clinches end with someone getting double legged, reaped, or end up in a bodylock/double underhook position. Because a san da fighter may be more adept at throws, you may want to avoid the clinch (but if you have a solid MT clinch game you should still be able to use lots of it).

    Coming from MMA you may be familiar with sacrifice throws. These are not your friend in san da (but I've worked under rules where they score points if you end up on top). I see you train double and single leg. One of my favorites is the double leg from behind, because the opponent can't drag you down with him (and a sit out makes both people end up on the ground). Reaping throws can work well because the side kick mentality lots of people have means they will have one leg well forward.
  6. Jack Rusher is offline
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    Posted On:
    7/26/2007 12:13pm


     Style: ti da shuai na

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Also, here's some solid kick catching advice from one of the better athletes in the sport:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U7xbDZfZvSo
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AD6qHIa_
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xdTCXhanxzk
  7. Permalost is offline
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    pro nonsense self defense

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    Posted On:
    7/26/2007 12:18pm

    supporting member
     Style: FMA, dumbek, Indian clubs

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by seanyseanybean
    In Tai Chi i've been shown a couple from the forms but have never drilled them. I think;

    1, 'Brush knee and step' for catching kicks
    2, ' Snake Creeps down' for slipping a cross (called a shoulder wheel throw in judo)

    What do you think?
    I learned snake creeps low as a fireman's carry.
  8. Cuchulain is offline

    Keeping you safe from Mongolians

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    Posted On:
    7/26/2007 12:23pm


     Style: Sanda/Taijiquan *Hiatus*

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Cool thanks for the advice everyone. That vid is actually the 'Brush knee and step' i was talking about. Though i was refering it as a push rather than a strike, but that would probably be just as usefull.
  9. Cuchulain is offline

    Keeping you safe from Mongolians

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    Posted On:
    7/26/2007 12:35pm


     Style: Sanda/Taijiquan *Hiatus*

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by CodosDePiedra
    I learned snake creeps low as a fireman's carry.
    I learnt it as this

    http://www.judoinfo.com/images/anima...kataguruma.htm
  10. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    7/26/2007 1:09pm

    staff
     Style: xingyi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by seanyseanybean
    Basically, they are same thing.
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