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  1. Chizilds is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Oregon
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    484

    Posted On:
    7/24/2007 4:32pm


     Style: BJJ - SBGi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Already done... and It's the best decision i have made in a long time. I actually expected the same response from the BJJ guys at the gym about giving up seeing as they never gave me crap for training in crap. But they all understood. The TKD school along with 90% of all others around are sport driven, yet they have this fantasy idea that they are teaching self defence. As far as sport TKD goes, I'm good... and I dont need a belt colored black to tell me that. Especialy if I have to pay 300$ for it. Every other belt test every 3 months or so was 50-70$.... its a joke if you really start to look at it. Let me break it down for you (granted this is only 90% of the TKD schools I have seen).

    1. Tuition - $100/month.... not bad and I can come every day if I want.

    2. Demo uniform (captain) - $160... did it to be part of the group and help promote the school.... what a waste of time.

    3. Lack of training... we hit hand held snap pads and sometimes just kicked the air... did push-ups and jumping jacks until if felt more like a jazzersize class that a MARTIAL art.

    4. Testing every 3 moths reguardless if you were ready... I was always ready, but how many people are WORTHLESS there and still being promoted....

    5. Its a day care for parents...... There were a handful of adults maybe 10 of us..... sad.

    Add that up and you have $100 * 3 years + $160 for uniform + $160 for maxi pad protection and gear = $3920 ..... almost 4K for what? To learn to kick with my hands down and never punch? Look if you are good enough for the Olympics great.... but don't call yourself a fighter or claim to have self defense with TKD.... its ridiculous. I have experienced it first hand.... My 3 years of Enshin were worth 25 years of TKD. I wish I never had to move back from college or I would have my black in that.... ALMOST getting a black in TKD is like getting a green belt in anything else....

    I could have spent that 4K in so many other places.... Now look at my new gym...

    1. Its a straight blast gym for christ sakes!!! @ $85/month for 3 days a week.

    2. No belt testing fee's and you test when THEY say you are ready.... you don't even know you just start rolling with tons of people and then you start to realize they are testing you.

    3. No life ending contracts or guilt trips.... no demo teams....

    4. Instructors ACTUALY train you.... if you do something wrong, they correct you until its right.... not just say.... "close enough"

    5. Our self defence? is actual self defence..... none of this "grab my wrist.... NO OTHER WRIST"..... crap.



    I am venting... but my venting has a purpose.... This "master" I trained under was like a second dad.... and when I told him my reason for quitting, and the financial burdon it put on me.... he said that I will have to deal with the manager of the dojang about the contract.... I tried to shake his hand and he wouldn't even look at me. He said to not talk to any students for fear i would take them with me?

    Welcome to TKD.... McDojo Heaven.... Thank God I saw the light... because to me? Black belts in TKD don't hold much respect.... I sparred with a BB the other night at MMA and wailed on him.... his kicks were tough kicks... big deal.... grab one.... throw him down and pound him till he squeals. God TKD pissed me off.... AHHHHHHHHH!
  2. TEA is offline
    TEA's Avatar

    Now iz BBQ Timez?

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    Posted On:
    7/25/2007 8:47am

    Join us... or die
     Style: TKD, Relson GJJ, Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Chizilds
    The TKD school along with 90% of all others around are sport driven, yet they have this fantasy idea that they are teaching self defence.
    Yes, this is the problem with the majority of TKD schools these days, which is why I didn't give you too much **** over this:

    neat story... too bad each time I have seen the above story happen... it ends a little something like this...

    "So, after practice, out in the parking lot (shades of Omar, Kat, JFS and Osiris), they square off. The Bully wades in trying to throw some punches before taking the new guy down for some GnP (we were all football players, after all, and GnP was pretty much how all of us ended our fights). Low and behold, Newding parries the Bully's jab and attempts to hit him with a standing side kick to the gut when the Bully grabs his leg and pounds him in the face. Newding staggers back and comes in again wondering how he saw his telegraphed TKD kick coming? This time, Newding taps him with the side kick before he can throw a punch. Bully takes the TKD kick and grabs him again, pulling him to the ground. Now Newding has no idea what to do and takes a tremendous beating to the face and body . Again, Newding is currious as to why his TKD one step sparring didn't defeat the man who can obviously take a TKD side kick. Newding is repeatedly pounded by the bully until he throws his hands up in the air begging for him to stop.

    FYI... I'm going to my TKD Dojang after work today to quit and cancel my contract.... I'm a Red belt. One away from Black.... and I realized a long time ago.... its only for show and sport. One good thing I have taken away is flexability and some stronger kicks.... Another thing is now I know how to negate pretty much every technique in TKD.... close the distance and finish it simple.
    Note that my story was back in 1978. At that time, TKD was not nearly as popular as it is now (it was actually fairly obscure), was not in the Olympics and the WTF was still developing its rule set for competitions. Most TKD schools, if they did compete, had to compete in Karate, Kickboxing, or the rare bare knuckle NHB tournaments. Prior to the spread of the WTF's new rule set for competition and the proliferation of strip mall dojang like mushrooms after TKD became an Olympic demo sport, most TKD schools trained like hard contact Karate schools with lots of punching to the body and head.

    A lot of the champion kick boxers of the '70s and '80s had TKD/Tang Soo Do backgrounds. Most TKD schools also allowed sweeps and takedowns in sparring, so defending against a leg grab when kicking was common knowledge, as was what to do when someone closed the distance and started throwing hands. True, TKD back then did not have much of a takedown defense in the clinch, but at least it was better than what is the norm in the sport style TKD dojang of today (most of the first wave of Korean instructors were also well versed in Judo and the first generation of American instructors at least learned some watered down Judo techniques). I'm sorry that these type of TKD schools are now a rarity and that the norm are either sport oriented or day care centers, and I'm sorry that you haven't had the opportunity to see the difference.

    However, this thread wasn't supposed to be about the tired old "sport TKD sucks for self-defense" theme that has been beaten to death. This thread is supposed to be about sharing the first time you ever saw TKD and what you thought of it then.
    Last edited by TEA; 7/25/2007 9:06am at .
  3. Devil is online now
    Devil's Avatar

    His heart was visible, and the dismal sack that maketh excrement of what is eaten.

    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    6,683

    Posted On:
    7/25/2007 9:02am

    supporting member
     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Chizilds
    Already done... and It's the best decision i have made in a long time. I actually expected the same response from the BJJ guys at the gym about giving up seeing as they never gave me crap for training in crap. But they all understood. The TKD school along with 90% of all others around are sport driven, yet they have this fantasy idea that they are teaching self defence. As far as sport TKD goes, I'm good... and I dont need a belt colored black to tell me that. Especialy if I have to pay 300$ for it. Every other belt test every 3 months or so was 50-70$.... its a joke if you really start to look at it. Let me break it down for you (granted this is only 90% of the TKD schools I have seen).

    1. Tuition - $100/month.... not bad and I can come every day if I want.

    2. Demo uniform (captain) - $160... did it to be part of the group and help promote the school.... what a waste of time.

    3. Lack of training... we hit hand held snap pads and sometimes just kicked the air... did push-ups and jumping jacks until if felt more like a jazzersize class that a MARTIAL art.

    4. Testing every 3 moths reguardless if you were ready... I was always ready, but how many people are WORTHLESS there and still being promoted....

    5. Its a day care for parents...... There were a handful of adults maybe 10 of us..... sad.

    Add that up and you have $100 * 3 years + $160 for uniform + $160 for maxi pad protection and gear = $3920 ..... almost 4K for what? To learn to kick with my hands down and never punch? Look if you are good enough for the Olympics great.... but don't call yourself a fighter or claim to have self defense with TKD.... its ridiculous. I have experienced it first hand.... My 3 years of Enshin were worth 25 years of TKD. I wish I never had to move back from college or I would have my black in that.... ALMOST getting a black in TKD is like getting a green belt in anything else....

    I could have spent that 4K in so many other places.... Now look at my new gym...

    1. Its a straight blast gym for christ sakes!!! @ $85/month for 3 days a week.

    2. No belt testing fee's and you test when THEY say you are ready.... you don't even know you just start rolling with tons of people and then you start to realize they are testing you.

    3. No life ending contracts or guilt trips.... no demo teams....

    4. Instructors ACTUALY train you.... if you do something wrong, they correct you until its right.... not just say.... "close enough"

    5. Our self defence? is actual self defence..... none of this "grab my wrist.... NO OTHER WRIST"..... crap.



    I am venting... but my venting has a purpose.... This "master" I trained under was like a second dad.... and when I told him my reason for quitting, and the financial burdon it put on me.... he said that I will have to deal with the manager of the dojang about the contract.... I tried to shake his hand and he wouldn't even look at me. He said to not talk to any students for fear i would take them with me?

    Welcome to TKD.... McDojo Heaven.... Thank God I saw the light... because to me? Black belts in TKD don't hold much respect.... I sparred with a BB the other night at MMA and wailed on him.... his kicks were tough kicks... big deal.... grab one.... throw him down and pound him till he squeals. God TKD pissed me off.... AHHHHHHHHH!

    I respect your decision, and your teacher sounds like a cock.

    Just don't feel like you're walking away empty handed. If nothing else, you've experienced first hand the weaknesses of an all-striking approach to fighting. That in itself is of more value than just being told about the weaknesses. And you will be able to glean some things from TKD that you can adapt to a more realistic style of training. Your timing and ability to spot openings will carry over, no matter how much you have to alter your technique.

    Good luck.
  4. Chizilds is offline

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    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Oregon
    Posts
    484

    Posted On:
    7/25/2007 12:36pm


     Style: BJJ - SBGi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by TEA
    Yes, this is the problem with the majority of TKD schools these days, which is why I didn't give you too much **** over this:



    Note that my story was back in 1978. At that time, TKD was not nearly as popular as it is now (it was actually fairly obscure), was not in the Olympics and the WTF was still developing its rule set for competitions. Most TKD schools, if they did compete, had to compete in Karate, Kickboxing, or the rare bare knuckle NHB tournaments. Prior to the spread of the WTF's new rule set for competition and the proliferation of strip mall dojang like mushrooms after TKD became an Olympic demo sport, most TKD schools trained like hard contact Karate schools with lots of punching to the body and head.

    A lot of the champion kick boxers of the '70s and '80s had TKD/Tang Soo Do backgrounds. Most TKD schools also allowed sweeps and takedowns in sparring, so defending against a leg grab when kicking was common knowledge, as was what to do when someone closed the distance and started throwing hands. True, TKD back then did not have much of a takedown defense in the clinch, but at least it was better than what is the norm in the sport style TKD dojang of today (most of the first wave of Korean instructors were also well versed in Judo and the first generation of American instructors at least learned some watered down Judo techniques). I'm sorry that these type of TKD schools are now a rarity and that the norm are either sport oriented or day care centers, and I'm sorry that you haven't had the opportunity to see the difference.

    However, this thread wasn't supposed to be about the tired old "sport TKD sucks for self-defense" theme that has been beaten to death. This thread is supposed to be about sharing the first time you ever saw TKD and what you thought of it then.
    sorry about that... I'm hot about TKD right now because of the things I am going though... carry on my friend.
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