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  1. schuyler is offline

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    Fort Collins, CO
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    Posted On:
    7/05/2007 3:46pm


     Style: Kyokushin

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Fort Collins, CO : McMahon Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu

    So I just moved up to Fort Collins Colorado and found a pretty sweet looking BJJ school less than three blocks from my house. Noting that they had a very nice storefront and professional signage, I decided to email them before going in to check out classes to check for mcdojoisms (ie contracts and hidden costs). Here's a copy of my email and their response (once you read the response you'll know why I posted this):
    Greetings,

    I just moved into the neighborhood (Parker St) and saw your gym. I have two questions: What is the cost of the beginning adult program, and do you require a contract? I'm currently involved in another martial art but hope to supplement my training with BJJ, but only if I can do it in an affordable manner and on a month by month basis (maybe a punch card or something to that effect).

    Thanks for your time,

    Schuyler

    Reply:
    Dear Schuyler,

    Thank you for your interest in McMahon BJJ! I certainly respect your
    efforts to build on your martial arts skills.

    What martial art are you involved with currently? Are you planning to
    continue your training there as well?

    I ask because we have a policy that requires our students to train
    exclusively with us, or with one of our teammates' schools. The reason
    for this is that we are committed to providing the best possible
    training for our students, and we can't do that if our students are
    training at a few different places and can't make it consistently to our
    BJJ classes.

    If this doesn't work for you, and you prefer a different set-up, I can
    definitely recommend a couple other places in town that can help you
    with your ground skills.

    That being said, please know that if this policy does work for you, you
    are more than welcome to begin training here and becoming part of the
    team!

    Sincerely,

    Tessa McMahon
    McMahon Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu
    1725 S. College Ave.
    Fort Collins, CO 80525
    970.482.5601
    contact@mcmahonbjj.com


    So, is this normal for a commercial BJJ school with multiple locations? It seems that with the popularity of MMA it would be bad business to limit students to training only at your school. Anyone train there? There website is www.mcmahonbjj.com.
  2. Wolf is offline
    Wolf's Avatar

    T3h R34l Gangnam Style!

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    Indianapolis, IN
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    Posted On:
    7/05/2007 3:52pm

    staff
     Style: MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Are you sure that's not McDojo BJJ because that's what it sounds like. No it's not normal in BJJ schools. Look elsewhere. The instructor (Finnie McMahon) seems legit, but the exclusivity rule is terrible. No gym worth a damn won't let you cross-train.
  3. Teh El Macho is offline
    Teh El Macho's Avatar

    Senior Member

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    Posted On:
    7/05/2007 4:02pm

    supporting member
     Style: creonte on hiatus

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    To the OP, stay away from it and look for more affordable alternatives. It has a blue belt program, a purple belt program and a black belt program, each one of these consisting of different number of classes per week. I bet you that each has a different price range and contract lenght. Put that next to them requiring their students to train exclusively with them, and, ding ding ding, smells like a McDojo (which has nothing to do with the instructors' credentials.)

    To the OP, just for **** and giggles, ask them if they can explain the pricing and contract requirements for the blue belt, purple belt and black belt programs. See if they reply back with the numbers or if they go around the subject. BTW, most BJJ/MMA schools will have no qualms in telling you, right of the bat, about the prices of their classes.

    -- edit --

    Plus, this is retarded.

    At our academy, you will learn the same techniques the Gracie Family and their students have used to dominate Mixed Martial Arts Competitions.
    Have used implies domination that started in the past (which is true) and that is still true in the present (which is not.)
    Last edited by Teh El Macho; 7/05/2007 4:08pm at .
    Read this for flexibility and injury prevention, this, this and this for supplementation, this on grip conditioning, and this on staph. New: On strenght standards, relationships and structural balance. Shoulder problems? Read this.

    My crapuous vlog and my blog of training, stuff and crap. NEW: Me, Mrs. Macho and our newborn baby.

    New To Weight Training? Get the StrongLifts 5x5 program and Rippetoe's "Starting Strength, 2nd Ed". Wanna build muscle/gain weight? Check this article. My review on Tactical Nutrition here.

    t-nation - Dissecting the deadlift. Anatomy and Muscle Balancing Videos.

    The street argument is retarded. BJJ is so much overkill for the street that its ridiculous. Unless you're the idiot that picks a fight with the high school wrestling team, barring knife or gun play, the opponent shouldn't make it past double leg + ground and pound - Osiris
  4. EternalRage is offline
    EternalRage's Avatar

    WARNING: BJJ may cause airway obstruction.

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    Long Island
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    Posted On:
    7/05/2007 4:15pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Bajillion Joo Jizzu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Their school is listed in OntheMat.com (formerly BJJ.org)'s database, so they can't be all that bad, but I think that cross training clause is a little weird as well...
  5. Ryno is offline

    Senior Member

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    Posted On:
    7/05/2007 4:32pm


     Style: FMA, Jujutsu/Judo/SAMBO

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Schuyler, that sounds pretty fishy. I take it you're still training in Kyokushin? I just don't see how they can demand that you drop other activities and/or training to be able to train with them. If their training is so damn hot, it should make you want to commit more time to it, but they shouldn't require this.
  6. money is offline
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    Flyweight

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    Posted On:
    7/05/2007 4:33pm

    supporting member
     Style: BJJ, MT, MMA, CQB

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Judging from the website it looks pretty tight. It lists the lineage of both instructors and their competition records. Their schedule stresses both training and conditioning. It seems like the "blue belt/purple belt/black belt" are increases in intensity as you get farther in, but I'd be interested to see what the pricing structure was. The no crosstraining does sound a bit peculiar.
    :Determined:
    HTFU and join Bullshido on Fitocracy!
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  7. schuyler is offline

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    Fort Collins, CO
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    Posted On:
    7/05/2007 4:34pm


     Style: Kyokushin

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I did write them back again asking about prices and contracts. I'll post the response when I get it. If they let me I'll take them up on the 'free intro class' and see first hand what the training is like.
  8. schuyler is offline

    Registered Member

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    Posted On:
    7/05/2007 4:39pm


     Style: Kyokushin

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Ryno
    Schuyler, that sounds pretty fishy. I take it you're still training in Kyokushin? I just don't see how they can demand that you drop other activities and/or training to be able to train with them. If their training is so damn hot, it should make you want to commit more time to it, but they shouldn't require this.
    I'll be training Kyokushin until I can't throw low kicks anymore. I assume if questioned about MMA competition they'd claim they teach all the necessary standup one would need to compete. But, neither of the instructors with the exception of the dude that took Kempo when he was a kid, has jack in their bio about stand up fighting.
  9. schuyler is offline

    Registered Member

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    Posted On:
    7/05/2007 4:41pm


     Style: Kyokushin

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    My response and their reply:
    I am currently involved in Kyokushin Karate and Muay Thai. I'm not very keen on giving up either of those....

    So, do you require contracts and what are your prices? I'd still be interested in checking out your school, especially if you offer a stand-up game alongside the BJJ.

    Thanks,
    Schuyler

    Reply:
    Dear Schuyler,

    We do have "contracts" in the sense that we use a billing company to do
    our billing for us on a monthly basis. We are not, however, like some
    gyms who charge cancellation fees, etc. It all just comes back to
    providing the best instruction for our students, and doing it this way
    helps us to focus on our students and not on the money side of things.

    For our basic/beginner program, it is a one year commitment at
    $139/month. This includes 3 bjj classes a week and 2 conditioning
    classes. We do some basic striking, though our focus is definitely on
    takedowns and techniques on the ground.

    Hope this helps make your decision - let me know and we can schedule you
    for a free intro class!

    Sincerely,

    Tessa


    Yeah, I'll take your free class! Do those prices sound fair?
  10. artard is offline

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    Boulder
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    Posted On:
    7/05/2007 4:47pm


     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    McMahon BJJ is run by current/former students of my school (Easton BJJ) and a lot of our students go over there to train sometimes (Finnie and Tessa are great teachers BTW). That e-mail wording seems unclear because at Easton BJJ they're cool with students taking classes at other judo/etc schools but what they don't allow is for the students to train at other BJJ/MMA schools, so I would assume it's a similar policy there. Also assuming the school is run the same way as here, the blue/purple/black belt programs do have increasing fees, though you are still allowed to attend all the lower classes as you advance so you're essentially paying more to be able to attend more classes. I'm not really going to try to defend or trash this practice, that's just how they do things and I attend as many classes as I can so I feel I get my money's worth but there's a lot of students who go 3 hours a week or less and they're probably not getting the best deal. Regardless, you will get definitely high-quality instruction and coaching if you decide to attend there so it's up to you to decide if it's worth the price.
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