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  1. andrewa is online now

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    Posted On:
    10/12/2008 12:46pm


     Style: Grappling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Just found these posts under the original FSD article. Since the article is not part of the regular forums many of us would not have seen these fairly recent posts from the summer. It does offer some new info.

    http://www.bullshido.net/modules.php...&page=14&pp=10


    "I was a student of patenaude for 10.5 years. I have Achieved "Black Belt" ranks in MT (Sucart siam #1), JKD/KALI KALI Kabayama Bashidokan, and Savat.

    I achieved a black Sash two brown stripes within 2 years of Grant and Fred Richardson. I trained with Lief Niefeld, Jordy and Mike Horra. I have established that I am "old School".

    In the early days of the school it was much like what a school should be. A bunch of happy pratitioners laughing and training. We had little rules, 1. respect one another 2. train each other. 3. good hygiene.

    I learned alot, and it came in handy. We where encouraged to go out and learn from other styles and friends.

    Then it started happening. A seminar would slip in, a new mandatory uniform. A fee for testing, a new reguistration fee. $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ $$$$$$$$$$$$$$

    We moved from the basement studio on Catherine to the upper floor. Several things really ring true from the article, patenaude got greedy. patenaude started getting offended by questions, patenaude got sued...alot. Hitting students in anger, getting in fights in public. Beating a person that came up to see a class and happened to be in a Karate/TKD uniform.

    Then it happened. James W. Demille patitioned the Wing Chun governing body and revieled that patenaude attended some seminars (not full time classes). He issued an open letter in a popular martial arts mag that patenaude was not authrized to use his name or style name.

    I was offended by this and as a loyal student I started investigating on my own and found out he attended alot of seminars and started claiming ranks (not awarded to him). Some wrote that he no longer claims "black belts" in certain styles, this is not from honesty but because legal actions took place.

    When I became ill with testicular cancer, my beloved mother called to let them know that I needed surgery and Chemo. You would think that my Mom would get sympathy for her son and there at the time for her son and there VERY loyal student.

    NOPE.

    Linda and "SIJO" both started calling and asking for fees. No card signed by the class, no flowers, no how are things. I had to this point never crossed Jock or missed fees.

    MONEY.

    What Linda and "JOCK" did not know is that my father is a very successful tort laywer. He proceeded to call them and tried a friendly, "there is no contract (I never, ever signed one and always paid in advance) and that there calls had no basis.

    "Jock" answered by calling my beloved mother and yelling at her.

    Remember I was in CHEMO.

    COURT. My father proceeded with, you guessed it, a tort. During the back ground checks we got "Jocks" finacial and criminal records and found the assaults, drug charges and the stint in Kingston compliments of the taxpayer.

    We contacted all the schools he "studied" at and most if not all meantion mabye a seminar and some cursed his name out right. Suffice it to say my eyes openned to his really motivations in life. I was given alot of support by his former "teachers".

    We sued and won.

    I was refunded 8 years of fees.

    The judge admonished him and said that he should not be claiming to be something he is not and that he was considering advising the crown of his fraud. Jock yelled at the judge and the judge threatened to have him jailed if he did not appoligize to him and to my mother.

    OH He did. there are court transcripts and I have em.

    "JOCK" proceeded to disolve the corp., closed the schools for a week and up from the ashing rose FANG SHEN DOn't.

    I have proceeded to 1. become healthy. 2. Learn that you can train for veru little money, ask questions, not stand at attention and have fun. 3.There is a reason that FANG SHEN DOn't is not at tourneys, it is not welcome. All you members of the cult try and join one, you will find that your paperwork will not get processed. It is not from a fear of the style, it is from the embarrassment that they feel for you.

    If you want a nice meal you go to a great restaurant like a Spago or Rain, (JKD, MT, MMA)

    If you want a nice lunch or simple dinner you go to a Kelsey's or milestones (Five animal Gung FU, Karate)

    In the mood for simple and cheap, The Swiss Chalet (TKD, JUDO)

    And in the mood for an assault on the heart and colon you go to Mcdonalds (Wendo)

    And if you want to eat out of a Dumpster and join a frigin CULT, Join Fang Shen DOn't

    Stop watching just one channel, take off the blinders and remove the ear plugs. It is not a valid style and they are just taking advantage of scared women and kids that think a Van Dam movie is cool.

    signed,

    Former very loyal student."
    Last edited by andrewa; 10/17/2008 6:35am at .
  2. andrewa is online now

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    Posted On:
    10/12/2008 12:47pm


     Style: Grappling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    And the second post.

    "I remeber when stephanie got certed by SIBOK, or SIJO or whatever title Jock gave himself. He had just returned (stephanie) from a Stick seminar with (apparently) Guru Inasanto.

    Jock announced his son now an instant expert in KALI (amazing how his cert is not lidted but the non traditionalist or the traditionalists. Then he awarded stephanie her little black sash. Then the first ever stripe appeared. just as the richardson where about to cert. Jocko always coddled stephanie.

    OH, and about never threatening anyone, Jocko and Linda Payenaude threatened my Mother when I was in the HOSPITAL.

    So stephanie was not only certed by an ex-con dad and his ex dancer mom but he is also a confirmed lier.

    Stephanie. People raised in a CULT are always blind to that. And why if your system is so marvelous do you not test it in an open forum, like MMA, Bodog, A kick boxing comp, or even rent a ring and invite challengers like the Grace's did.

    I here that Carver would welcome a school tourny, but I guess you might want to start with the young warriors at the boys and girls club. who knows, you might actually get a draw with the 4 year olds in the back picking there noses.

    If you are what your family claims you would have done this already. But Alas you will hide behind daddy and mommy and not venture out because you know that your style will crumble like a house of cards in the wind.

    "Momy I do not know what to do, the other guy actually questioned me and faught back! My students never did that before, wa wa wa"

    "Daddy I have fallen and I cannot see my grappling book I bought at chapters"

    "Daddy, Daddy can you cert me in something for christmas"

    Getting certed by your own parents is like being the only person in a foot race. Ya you win, but it means NOTHING to anyone. Grow up.

    I am calling you out to challenge the Shamrock's, the graces, ortiz's or even a Tyson. If you offer the best as your family has always claimed then prove it and post it on your website.

    I think that they will welcome a comedy event in the martial arts world.

    keep on teaching the wannabe's tough guy."
  3. Krackie is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/12/2008 1:00pm


     Style: Wing Chun

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Finally! Someone who knows the details about the stories of the history of WCD/FSD. Thank you for the confirmation of the criminal record for Jacques for assault and that he did spend time incarcerated as a result.

    Anyone from FSD wanting to comment on these tidbits of info????
  4. fanger123 is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/13/2008 3:32pm


     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    also posted on that original article :

    "Hi to all member of bullshido

    Im currently doing FSD for like 3 weeks now. And there is a lot of things that i must say. First of all, when i came to register i saw 2 things

    Registration Fee : 149.99$
    6 Months : 627$ +tax

    It was wow? soo much? my master told me if you want, you can pay one shot...the thing is i wont pay one shot for a thing that i dont really know about. So i refused and chose to pay each month... And yeah about the free month, he told me that i can use it to take off the registration fee. I guess that the free month is more to make u join the club and take of the registration fee then to make u try it. At the end, i will have to pay 120$ each month since i took off the regisration fee. When my first class started, it was really good :) i liked the trainning they gave us. But for the technic and all,,, i wasnt really in it. It is not that im not motivate to do it , it is just that i felt that something isnt right. 2 class later, i challenged a Bleu sash stripped to see how good he is. It ended up with me who almost knocked him out. Im not saying that im bruce lee or w/e it is just that that guy was here for like 2 years? After it , i was like maybe he wasnt the best of this school. After the end of the class, my master came to me and told me that i will join BBC in 2 months. I was like cool:D! The class later, i rechallenged the guy for a grappling match since BBC does grappling. I wanted to see how hes good in it. The match started n it ended with me having a triangle in him. The 4th class, a green sash was in the class. And again, i challenged another student of FSD but in sparring this time and i must say, he was good but in the end , i could knock him out. At the end of the 5 class, my master came to me n told me to now try BBC. I was really happy. A new student came out of no where after 2 class the master told him that he will join BBC . After 5 class the master told him to join BBC. Soo now my first Class of BBC. Again i challenged another Bleu sash stripped. He told me he did karate for like 10 years. The fight started n i was able to make a take down. At the end, it finished with me doing a kimera?( i dont know how to spell it O_O! ) . I was kinda disappointed to see me beating some of the best student they have. But then, the master challenged me, and yeah he was really good but really good. He won the fight by tap out ( guillotine ) . What i can say is my master is really good. Awesome power, speed, accuracy and all. But for his student, i dont know what to say. Then comes my 2nd class of BBC, a bleu stripped sash challenged me to a grappling match ( the guy who i ended doing a Kimera ) I was like sure Bring it. We started but he was starting to do excuse. I made a guilottine he hitted me in my face. It was like wtf? we r doing grappling!!!. He was like ahh but in UFC they do that. While he was talking to me, he putted his hand on mine n then he said go and break my lock. I didnt really care soo we continued and i managed to make a Triangle on him but the dude didnt want to tap out even with his red face now. I let go my lock and changed it to a arm bar. But the dude was like, yo watch out... It is like just (_*$@_#@*(# tap out . The match ended with him giving me a kick in the head. I have a video of it but i wont post it since my identity will be reveal but soon i will post it :) After all my testing of the studend of my school, i asked question to my master about how good is Sijo Patenaude, he answered me by saying that he was a street fighter n he did a lot of martial arts. I asked him does the sifu of FSD do Tournament like UFC? he answerd me yes n they never lost. I dont know if it is true or not but i never find anything about all these claim. Now, im still doing FSD BUT im going to leave it cuz i dont think that it is the art for me since many things do not feel right for me. The grappling is really wierd, the technique that my master show us doesnt reflect in his sparring, they give sash to whoever do their test. it is like almost impossible to fail a test from white sash to bleu sash. I went to their web site and it is all about making money. Maybe for some FSD is good for them,,, but for me i dont think so.


    From A Student Of Fang Shen Do
    PS: Sorry if my english is that good >_< "


    yes i know it's a horribly condensed paragraph.

    i think it's very credible that any remotely trained grappler would out grapple a fanger. Also that fangers would use striking during grappling training. it happened to me during a pummeling exercise (they call it the endurance drill, pummeling to get the thai clinch) that the other fanger throw light knees at me... i guess it kept the exercise more st33t oriented.

    I still call bullshit on this guy owning all those fangers... both striking and grappling. it reads like a fantasy with all those "challenges". who the hell do challenges to other classmates? we either spar/roll. besides,YOU CAN'T SPAR IN FSD UNTIL YOU JOIN THE BBC FIRST AND START PAYING UP.

    he can't even spell kimura, yet he can transition triangle -> arm bar (yes i know it's a basic ttransition on paper. it still takes a certain level of skill to pull it off).

    unless he's an academically challenged MMA fighter who writes like a shy teenager.
  5. used2b is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/18/2008 3:36pm


     Style: ex-fsd

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    quoting from fanger123's post:
    "I still call bullshit on this guy owning all those fangers... both striking and grappling. it reads like a fantasy with all those "challenges". who the hell do challenges to other classmates? we either spar/roll. besides,YOU CAN'T SPAR IN FSD UNTIL YOU JOIN THE BBC FIRST AND START PAYING UP.

    he can't even spell kimura, yet he can transition triangle -> arm bar (yes i know it's a basic ttransition on paper. it still takes a certain level of skill to pull it off).

    unless he's an academically challenged MMA fighter who writes like a shy teenager."

    I was a member of jp's club for over 6 years. I left about 10 years ago, after Grant and Fred.

    What noname[25] says about the sparring at FSD is accurate in my opinion. There was never ANY real grappling training except for what occured naturally during sparring. If someone had previous experience then they would immediately have a clear advantage over any FSD student.

    We never did any transitions or submissions at FSD. None. Zero.

    As I read the noname[25] post I would guess that he's not a native English speaker and has had previous training, maybe in a couple of different styles. Seems credible to me - but that's just my opinion.
  6. andrewa is online now

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    Posted On:
    10/18/2008 3:39pm


     Style: Grappling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Used2b, what were the circumstances that lead to you leaving FSD?
  7. used2b is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/18/2008 4:24pm


     Style: ex-fsd

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    There was an xmas party at some girls place. She was a new member and somehow got talked into having the party. The room was pretty full and jp was holding court at one end of the room. I was at the other end of the room - well outside the audible range of anything that was being said. I tried to make some conversation with another student and for whatever reason he thought that I was being disrespectful to jp. So he pops up and closes on me with a bunch of chung chois. I was sitting back on a couch so I just covered up (he cut the crap out of his knuckles on my watch). Then I planted my foot in his belly and pushed him across the room. He says I was disrespecting jp and that jp doesn't like me and he wants to take it outside.

    The party has stopped at this point and we have every ones attention. So I straight out ask jp if there is something that I've done to offend him. jp launches into a series of inappropriate questions about what I do outside the club and how much money I make. It seemed like a setup.

    I decided to leave right then but waited a few weeks before I told linda that I didn't have time to attend classes anymore.
  8. Shifty is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/18/2008 4:29pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Brazilian JJ, former FSD

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Never a dull Xmas party with FSD
  9. used2b is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/18/2008 4:35pm


     Style: ex-fsd

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Yeah. That would be right. At least I don't think we had to eat the special tortiere and then publically rave about how wonderful it was.

    What really got to me was that we were at this girls place and it's a nice place. She has lots of nice things including a very large projection TV (was state of the art at the time and the little skirmish occurred right near it) and jp seemed to be fully prepared to watch us go at it. Zero concern for her stuff.
  10. Shifty is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/18/2008 4:41pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Brazilian JJ, former FSD

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Lol I missed that party, which is unfortunate because I typically like touriere. You mean to say you weren't obliterated by the double blast...unheard of. The student must have been extremely loyal or brainwashed to attack you though.

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