Fang Shen Do: Tales From the Inner Circle

**Corvus** · Posted On: 3/28/2008 12:19pm

Originally Posted by kracker

Are you guys sure they are really doing this? (I haven't read the whole forum and probably coudn't get through it in under a year.)

The quotes you read above are directly from the Fang Shen Do website blog. I **** you not.

**old1o1** · Posted On: 3/29/2008 11:51pm

From: Wikipedia:Articles for creation/2008-03-07

Fang Shen Do
This request for creation has been declined. Please do not modify it.
This request for creation has been reviewed. The reviewer comments appear below the article text.

If you want to make changes and try again, copy and paste your article into a new submission and make your changes there.

Fang Shen Do is a martial art founded by Jacques Patenaude.

The clubs are located in Ottawa, Montreal and Toronto.
Declined. We cannot accept unsourced suggestions or sources that are not reliable per the verifiability policy. Please provide reputable, third-party sources with your suggestions. Third party sources are needed both to establish the verifiability of the submission as well as its notability. MSGJ (talk) 23:12, 7 March 2008 (UTC)

Rejected... Again.... How is fsd ever going to meet the tough criteria set out in the last sentence.... Hey! That's what Bullshido was asking for! Wikipedia joins forces with Bullshido!

Old1o1
News Digester

ps. As you can see from the pic below, his sifools are still loyal. They were out of wallet size photos, I guess.

**fanger123** · Posted On: 3/30/2008 4:24pm

laughed hard at that pic... i love the seafood/cijoe varieties.

**fanger123** · Posted On: 4/02/2008 1:55pm

from the FSD blog

"Maybe because of those same 5 guys criticizing us on different martial art forums, we should close all of our schools and take up Banjo lessons.

Or maybe even....

APRIL FOOL'S!!!!"

we are being monitored, yet ignored... i think it's a first that sMP (or the guy who writes the blog for him?) that they acknowledged this site. i hope it pushes some current curious fangers to come here and have some discussion.

**chump** · Posted On: 4/03/2008 8:41am

I want the names and addresses of the "5 guys".

**sempaiman** · Posted On: 4/03/2008 8:53am

Nothing to add, just want to make this 1000th reply relative to original post....

**n00b** · Posted On: 4/03/2008 10:12am

Originally Posted by chump

I want the names and addresses of the "5 guys".

Heh.

What the powers that be in Fangy-land don't get is that criticism is GOOD. When my instructor critiques my technique, it helps me become a better fighter. And that gets driven home with more and more clarity as I progress. He can tell me about the (many?) small things that are preventing me from getting it right and improve my results.

If all he did (just as an example), was tell me stories about how tough his dad was, I probably wouldn't get better very quickly.

**greenguy** · Posted On: 4/04/2008 11:13am

Linda, Stephane, Martin, Jacques, Sylvain, Gerry, Stephane D., and all the rest of the Fang Shen Do / Fang Shen Do Sanshou / Fang Shen Do Modern Wing Chun and whatever else you call yourselves:

Your blog post on April Fool's Day is amusing. Perhaps there are only 5 people currently contributing new material to this particular thread. Of course, as you often do, you ignore the obvious. Many more than five people have contributed over the course of the years since the first Fang Shen Do thread was written. There have been first hand accounts of things that happened in your classes and in your schools. There have been first hand accounts of things that happened at training camp. There have been first hand accounts of Fang Shen Do instructors attacking people in bars. There have been multiple critiques of your style and "skill". Every once in a while, someone else who has experienced the Fang Shen Do bullshido shows up to share their stories. There are a few more than five people here.

There are some regular posters here. No one questions it. Some people continue to keep an eye on you the same way you are keeping an eye on this website. Those people continue to post new information. The whole idea is to expose crappy martial arts schools and have people get value for their money.

Fang Shen Do does not provide value for money. It is that simple. There is plenty of evidence to back it up.

So far the vast majority of Fang Shen Do's response to this has been to threaten people. Very grown up I must say.

I will ask you some simple questions: Do you honestly believe that no one other than the posters read this website? Has it not occurred to you that people searching for information about Fang Shen Do will read through some of the threads on Bullshido and decide to head somewhere else? Do you think that Fang Shen Do is developing a positive international reputation since there have been posters on here from the United States, Australia, and Europe? Does it not occur to you that just as you lurk on this site, that others lurk too without posting?

For the longest time I gave Fang Shen Do and the Patenaude family the benefit of the doubt. You run a business, so of course you have to make money. What I have noticed as time has gone on is that you don't care how you make that money. As an organization I think you lack in both morals and ethics.

So yeah, go play the banjo. And have fun with that. The world needs more music, so at least you would be making a positive contribution to society.

**MrJ** · Posted On: 4/04/2008 9:43pm

Originally Posted by greenguy

Has it not occurred to you that people searching for information about Fang Shen Do will read through some of the threads on Bullshido and decide to head somewhere else?

Bullshido.net comes up as second item when Fang Shen Do is googled. Maybe people are still happy to pay for FSD training. I'm going to finish my beer and subscribe to their FREE training newsletter. Should be entertaining and won't pay for services.

**Askari** · Posted On: 4/05/2008 6:17am

Originally Posted by fanger123

from the FSD blog

"Maybe because of those same 5 guys criticizing us on different martial art forums, we should close all of our schools and take up Banjo lessons.

Or maybe even....

APRIL FOOL'S!!!!"

Just to be absolutely clear. This is what is known as an ad hominem argument being put forward by the FSD blog. I have kept track and there are hundreds and hundreds of people posting on this forum and others in criticism of Fang Shen Do.

(Much of the following is directly from the definition of Ad Hominem and not solely my own writing)

By launching their current defence by claiming these obviously limited numbers the blog writer is attacking a characteristic of the person making the argument or claim, rather than by addressing the substance of the argument or producing evidence against the claim. The process of proving or disproving the claim is thereby subverted, and the argumentum ad hominem works to change the subject. It is most commonly used to refer specifically to the ad hominem abusive, or argumentum ad personam, which consists of criticizing or personally attacking an argument's proponent in an attempt to discredit that argument.

Ad hominem is also used when an opponent is unable to find fault with an argument, yet for various reasons, the opponent disagrees with it.

Just in case it was not blatantly obvious to everyone reading these threads, Ad hominem arguments are always invalid.