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  1. kwoww is offline
    kwoww's Avatar

    poser

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    Jan 2007
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    Lower Hudson Valley / Rochester
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    1,986

    Posted On:
    6/05/2007 7:53pm


     Style: punching bag / crew jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Hey! You Got Your Philosophy In My Martial Arts! (and vice versa)

    About a year ago, the master at my dojang was turned onto all this stuff about The Secret and the Law of Attraction and so on. Great. But soon, he was teaching it as part of the "Leadership Team" curriculum, which is a special program for the kids who actually try and give a ****, and a few who pretend they do. Not that they'd be tested on it, but they talk about it constantly, and the most recent "Leadership Seminar" consisted of watching the movie and then discussing what one thing . This got me thinking: what's this got to do with Taekwondo?

    Now for my question to all of you. This is not a thread about whether all that Law-of-Attraction-ish stuff is BS. Save it for Sociocide. What I am wondering is whether teaching it has any place in a martial arts program for adults. How ethical for a teacher is it to impose such a belief system on his students, who may or may not share his views? Is The Secret even relevant to the martial arts, or, if not, can it be adapted to them? Is my master unwittingly teaching bullshido? What about things like the Five Tenets of Taekwondo? They might work in kids classes, but are they irrelevant in an adult program?
  2. roly is offline

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    Posted On:
    6/05/2007 8:59pm


     Style: judo, karate, jap jj

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    if i wanted philosophy, i would spend my time and money on class about philosophy

    instead i want judo, so i spend my time and money on judo classes. that kinda crap has no place in martial arts imo (unless you want to do it, and know what you are paying for)
  3. SifuJason is offline

    Senior Member

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    Posted On:
    6/06/2007 11:42am


     Style: WHKD (Kaju), Sub. Grapple

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by roly
    unless you want to do it, and know what you are paying for
    I think that is the key point. Almost all martial arts instructors incorporate philosophy into their teachings, even if it's only "don't go randomly attack people." Some do a lot more, however. If you don't like it, then don't go to that school. As for it being bullshido, that depends on if the quality of instruction is being affected by the philosophy.
  4. fightin Penguin is offline

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    Jun 2005
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    Scranton, Pa
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    Posted On:
    6/06/2007 1:54pm


     Style: ex-wrestler, Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I think teaching that crap to children is worse than teaching it to adults. At least adults can call it on its bullshit. As the other posters said, it only sucks if you don't want to learn it. You get what you pay for.
  5. Don Gwinn is offline
    Don Gwinn's Avatar

    BJJ wins again!

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    Virden, IL
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    Posted On:
    6/06/2007 2:04pm

    supporting member
     Style: Guns

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    No place at all, but you're going to have a hard time separating that from the BS nature of "The Secret."
    *********************************************
  6. From Bell2Bell is offline

    Registered Member

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    Atlanta
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    Posted On:
    6/06/2007 2:04pm


     Style: The Sweet Science

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I just imagined someone trying to spout philosophy in my boxing gym, and mental image made me laugh so hard I just inhaled a piece of the pretzel I was eating. I doubt this thread will still be in MABS when I get back from blowing my nose.
  7. p00rusan is offline

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    May 2007
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    3

    Posted On:
    6/06/2007 6:54pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Freestyle

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I always thought that if you were a traditional Martial Artist it was the main point and the fact that some Martial Arts taught have been passed down from warriors and in a sense we are learning the "Ways of the Warrior". I believe in the importance of philosophy in Martial Arts training but then again i do study philosophy anyway.
  8. roly is offline

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    Posted On:
    6/06/2007 9:41pm


     Style: judo, karate, jap jj

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by p00rusan
    I always thought that if you were a traditional Martial Artist it was the main point and the fact that some Martial Arts taught have been passed down from warriors and in a sense we are learning the "Ways of the Warrior". I believe in the importance of philosophy in Martial Arts training but then again i do study philosophy anyway.
    martial art = learning to fight, sure there is baggage attached to that eg. dont be a phsycho and plunder/kill/maim/rape/whatever

    but when all the philosophy gets in the way of the "learning to fight" part. thats the point where it slips from legitimate teaching and into bullshido
  9. Grashnak is offline
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    Old School DM

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    Ottawa
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    Posted On:
    6/06/2007 9:50pm

    supporting member
     Style: Nothing current

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by kwoww
    Now for my question to all of you. This is not a thread about whether all that Law-of-Attraction-ish stuff is BS. Save it for Sociocide. What I am wondering is whether teaching it has any place in a martial arts program for adults.
    Um, its hard to separate the Secret from the BS. If the point of Bullshido is to point out BS in the martial arts, then that should include teaching BS philosophy. Hell, if THE SECRET worked, no one would need to know a martial art - they could just imagine that the bad mugger was really a nymphomaniac cheerleader who wanted no strings attached sex and voila, no mugging.
    Jesus loves you. I think you're an asshole.
  10. fightin Penguin is offline

    Registered Member

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    Scranton, Pa
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    500

    Posted On:
    6/06/2007 11:28pm


     Style: ex-wrestler, Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by roly
    martial art = learning to fight, sure there is baggage attached to that eg. dont be a phsycho and plunder/kill/maim/rape/whatever

    but when all the philosophy gets in the way of the "learning to fight" part. thats the point where it slips from legitimate teaching and into bullshido
    Not always. Tai Chi and Aikido have more to do with philosophy and chi and bullshit like that, especially Tai Chi. I do believe that martial arts dojo should teach (maybe teach isn't the word) but atleast instill character and all that in its students. No teaching any specific philosophies in general, but I think you know what I mean.
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