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  1. Roidie McDouchebag is offline
    Roidie McDouchebag's Avatar

    Injury Waiting To Happen

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    Posted On:
    5/18/2007 4:27am

    supporting member
     Style: Snatch Wrestling

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    MMA Private Lessons vs Group Classes vs Sparring Classes

    When you do a private lesson, you refine your technique, but you don't spar, at least not with anyone worth sparring with. They're either far better than you, or you shouldn't be doing privates with them anyway.

    When you do a group class, you get a chance to do a little technique refinement, and spar with people worth sparring with. They should be close to your level, close enough that they have to try in order to win. This way, you get some needed resistance added to your training.

    Sparring classes are the pinnacle of all training. You get to test out the techniques you've been refining during your other classes. You should have a wide variety of partners that are above and below your level, allowing you to win and lose with a great degree of resistance.

    The point of this thread is this:

    If you are only doing private lessons, you're going to fucking suck. You might as well be doing Kung Fu, because even if you're rolling around with your instructor, you will not improve or learn how to apply techniques properly.
  2. bob is offline
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    Prophet of Apathy

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    Posted On:
    5/18/2007 4:56am


     Style: MMA

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    What if you do private lessons with two or three people?
  3. sochin101 is offline
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    Graviora Manent

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    Posted On:
    5/18/2007 5:27am

    Join us... or die
     Style: No gym currently.

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by bornsceptic
    What if you do private lessons with two or three people?
    Then it becomes a Ménage à spar...

    I've always been wary of sparring during privates because, unless your instructor has a very diverse fighting style, you're only training against fighting one guy's techniques. I'm speaking totally from a stand-up perspective, as I have never taken a grappling private lesson. It might be different.

    As Cracky McStudmuff states, privates are for technique refinement.



    Is it me, or is Cracky making more and more sense these days? This could be his most subtle troll yet...

  4. Goju - Joe is offline
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    I am a Ninja bitches!! Deal with it

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    Posted On:
    5/18/2007 8:03am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Improv comedy

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I have never done a private because my fundamentals need so much work and I can get all that in group practice.

    Assuming I get my back in order and can really make a run at BJJ I want to enter some tournaments.

    At that time it would make sense to do a couple privates to refine skills and work on a strategy for me.
  5. Fighting Cephalopod is offline
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    Submitting 1d6 Investigators per round

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    Posted On:
    5/18/2007 9:38am

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     Style: ZHOO ZHITSU

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Cracky McSlugHoot
    When you do a private lesson, you refine your technique, but you don't spar, at least not with anyone worth sparring with. They're either far better than you, or you shouldn't be doing privates with them anyway.

    If you are only doing private lessons, you're going to fucking suck. You might as well be doing Kung Fu, because even if you're rolling around with your instructor, you will not improve or learn how to apply techniques properly.
    Any good coach doing private lessons, if they spar with you, is going to dial down their games, let you work, lead you into setups for the moves you're working on, and demonstrate to you (with their counters) what part of it you're doing wrong.

    Your statement is true about private lessons in which you don't roll, but for the ones in which you do roll, it's only true if your instructor isn't a very good teacher.
    Undisputed KING OF ASSHOLES.
  6. Teh El Macho is offline
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    Senior Member

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    Posted On:
    5/18/2007 9:57am

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     Style: creonte on hiatus

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by fatherdog
    Any good coach doing private lessons, if they spar with you, is going to dial down their games, let you work, lead you into setups for the moves you're working on, and demonstrate to you (with their counters) what part of it you're doing wrong.

    Your statement is true about private lessons in which you don't roll, but for the ones in which you do roll, it's only true if your instructor isn't a very good teacher.
    I'm with fatherdog on that one. I've rarely sparred with my instructors, but when I've had, they have dialed down while forcing me to work - they tell me what I need to do while at the same time attacking/countering what I'm doing (the very same things they are telling me to do.) A good instructor will dial it down specifically to correct a student's problems.

    I haven't taken any privates, but most likely I will have soon, to compensate (if it's even possible) for a lack of regular training.

    I'm not sure if I agree with you Cracky. A private should include some sparring. Otherwise, it makes no sense to pay so much for just doing drills. And a good instructor should be able to spar with a student at the student level with the purpose of improving the student's skills.

    *** EDIT ***

    All of that is based on the premise a instructor is a GOOD instructor.
    Read this for flexibility and injury prevention, this, this and this for supplementation, this on grip conditioning, and this on staph. New: On strenght standards, relationships and structural balance. Shoulder problems? Read this.

    My crapuous vlog and my blog of training, stuff and crap. NEW: Me, Mrs. Macho and our newborn baby.

    New To Weight Training? Get the StrongLifts 5x5 program and Rippetoe's "Starting Strength, 2nd Ed". Wanna build muscle/gain weight? Check this article. My review on Tactical Nutrition here.

    t-nation - Dissecting the deadlift. Anatomy and Muscle Balancing Videos.

    The street argument is retarded. BJJ is so much overkill for the street that its ridiculous. Unless you're the idiot that picks a fight with the high school wrestling team, barring knife or gun play, the opponent shouldn't make it past double leg + ground and pound - Osiris
  7. SifuJason is offline

    Senior Member

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    Posted On:
    5/18/2007 11:46am


     Style: WHKD (Kaju), Sub. Grapple

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Cracky McSlugHoot
    If you are only doing private lessons, you're going to fucking suck. You might as well be doing Kung Fu, because even if you're rolling around with your instructor, you will not improve or learn how to apply techniques properly.
    I don't buy this argument. I good instructor should be able to spar with his/her students and still have the students gain a lot from the experience. They instructor won't be able to go full out, obviously, but the student should be able to explore their skill set a lot more than with other opponents.
  8. Barrett is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/18/2007 3:21pm


     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by fatherdog
    Any good coach doing private lessons, if they spar with you, is going to dial down their games, let you work, lead you into setups for the moves you're working on, and demonstrate to you (with their counters) what part of it you're doing wrong.
    I've never done any *official* private lessons, but I've rolled a lot with my instructor. He teaches just like you describe, and it's amazing how much I learn this way. Every time the action stalls, he's telling me what I should be doing next and already countering it. It's exhausting, but my game becomes a lot more fluid afterwards.

    That being said, someone who only does privates is wasting their money because there's a lot of mechanical stuff in BJJ that just takes repetition to learn. Not to mention that if you only train with one person, you're not going to be prepared for someone that's a much different body type then your partner.
  9. Eldarbong is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/18/2007 3:43pm


     Style: I request to be banned

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I think the occasional private is good, as long as you do them in conjunction with regular group classes, sparring etc. I had a private for MT once, and it helped to get pointers for lots of little mistakes I was making. I can't see myself ever getting a private for BJJ though. I would just mention to the instructor that I was having trouble in a certain area, or ask for some help during class. I have never met or heard of a person who only took private lessons. You need to be around a diverse group of people to progress.
  10. Teh El Macho is offline
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    Senior Member

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    Posted On:
    5/18/2007 6:49pm

    supporting member
     Style: creonte on hiatus

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I never had a private, but I had a mini-mini-seminar with one of my instructors (he arranged a mini-seminar for 4 of us). It was 2 hours long, and it was one of the best things I've ever done... cleared a lot of questions. It was basically a Q&A session where he would pair us to spar. He would roll with each of us to go over the specific questions or problems each of us had. Good stuff.
    Read this for flexibility and injury prevention, this, this and this for supplementation, this on grip conditioning, and this on staph. New: On strenght standards, relationships and structural balance. Shoulder problems? Read this.

    My crapuous vlog and my blog of training, stuff and crap. NEW: Me, Mrs. Macho and our newborn baby.

    New To Weight Training? Get the StrongLifts 5x5 program and Rippetoe's "Starting Strength, 2nd Ed". Wanna build muscle/gain weight? Check this article. My review on Tactical Nutrition here.

    t-nation - Dissecting the deadlift. Anatomy and Muscle Balancing Videos.

    The street argument is retarded. BJJ is so much overkill for the street that its ridiculous. Unless you're the idiot that picks a fight with the high school wrestling team, barring knife or gun play, the opponent shouldn't make it past double leg + ground and pound - Osiris
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