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  1. libertine1234 is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/16/2007 11:50am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: JKD

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Follow-up

    Ive been taking BJJ for almost 2 months now.... and its alot of fun! More fun than i remembered it to be when i was grappling in my jeet kune do classes.

    But i found that as time goes by, i get more and more worried about my jaw. I keep hearing stories abt peoples jaws getting dislocated via RNC or gi-chokes. I know i should talk to the doctor but i dont want him telling me to stop.

    The hardest part of all this is watching my fellow white belts compete... and having to just sit in the corner and cheer. Sucks! Considering the level of aggression and adrenaline in these competitions... my instructor told me to sit it out.

    Anyways, do u guys think getting a custom made mouthpiece would reduce the risk of fucking my jaw up? I use a regular one......(For training, im trying not to think abt competitions these days)

    Also, would i progress slower than the rest of the class if i dont compete? (belt promotions... etc?)

    Thanks in advance....
  2. Teh El Macho is offline
    Teh El Macho's Avatar

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    Posted On:
    7/16/2007 2:23pm

    supporting member
     Style: creonte on hiatus

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by libertine1234
    Ive been taking BJJ for almost 2 months now.... and its alot of fun! More fun than i remembered it to be when i was grappling in my jeet kune do classes.

    But i found that as time goes by, i get more and more worried about my jaw. I keep hearing stories abt peoples jaws getting dislocated via RNC or gi-chokes. I know i should talk to the doctor but i dont want him telling me to stop.
    Dude, go see a doctor as you were told at the start. Let's say the doc tells you to stop. Is he going to chain you to the bed or sue you in court of if you don't listen?

    He may tell you so, or he may not. My PCP does not tell me to stop, just to use good judgment. And so should you. You really don't know (and won't know) what you are dealing with until you see your doc. Period.

    Also, I've never heard of jaws being dislocated with a choke? Even if that were true, that's what tapping is for. You could dislocate your jaw in boxing or in a car accident, too. You need to know your true codition (see a doc), and then use good judgement.

    And yeah, a mouth piece provides protection to the jaw... in general. But who knows in your case (since we don't know what your existing condition is... see a doc and let us know.)

    Quote Originally Posted by libertine1234
    The hardest part of all this is watching my fellow white belts compete... and having to just sit in the corner and cheer. Sucks! Considering the level of aggression and adrenaline in these competitions... my instructor told me to sit it out.

    Anyways, do u guys think getting a custom made mouthpiece would reduce the risk of fucking my jaw up? I use a regular one......(For training, im trying not to think abt competitions these days)

    Also, would i progress slower than the rest of the class if i dont compete? (belt promotions... etc?)

    Thanks in advance....
    The content highlighted is more appropriate for the guanatanamo section than for the PT/Health forums. Please keep your posts in this forums specific to health-related questions.

    Thanks.
    Read this for flexibility and injury prevention, this, this and this for supplementation, this on grip conditioning, and this on staph. New: On strenght standards, relationships and structural balance. Shoulder problems? Read this.

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    The street argument is retarded. BJJ is so much overkill for the street that its ridiculous. Unless you're the idiot that picks a fight with the high school wrestling team, barring knife or gun play, the opponent shouldn't make it past double leg + ground and pound - Osiris
  3. Judah Maccabee is offline
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    Posted On:
    7/16/2007 11:26pm

    supporting memberhall of fameBullshido Newbie
     Style: Krav / (Kick)Boxing / BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I've left with a sore jaw from class a couple of times, but mostly because I didn't tap to a jaw crank. For instance, I'm in someone's back mount, they go for the RNC, I dip my head to block with my chin, and they crank on the jaw anyways.

    My honest two cents is that if a triangle choke is fucking with your jaw, then you need to talk to some kind of doc who specializes in jaws or something. Triangles work the neck more than anything else, whether you do it Judo style (no neck crank) or BJJ style (yank the head down), and the jaw isn't really involved at all.
  4. conceited is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/16/2007 11:37pm


     Style: DrunkenWolverine Ninjitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Mouthguard, see doctor, tap early, let the other guy know and eat pain pills.

    Be careful in competition though, I know in wrestling using dirty tactics is quite commonplace during a live match. For instance instead of just a cross face its more of a right hook/crossface with the intention of knocking the other guys teeth out. The ref never caught it, I did it all the time so did my competitors my jaw still pops every time I eat something chewy.

    I'm sure the dirty tactics are not wrestling exclusive.
  5. Teh El Macho is offline
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    Posted On:
    7/17/2007 8:41am

    supporting member
     Style: creonte on hiatus

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by conceited
    Mouthguard, see doctor, tap early, let the other guy know and eat pain pills.

    Be careful in competition though, I know in wrestling using dirty tactics is quite commonplace during a live match. For instance instead of just a cross face its more of a right hook/crossface with the intention of knocking the other guys teeth out. The ref never caught it, I did it all the time so did my competitors my jaw still pops every time I eat something chewy.

    I'm sure the dirty tactics are not wrestling exclusive.
    Yeah, let your sparring partners know. Anytime you have something injured (be it the neck, elbow, whatever), talk to your sparring partners. They'll make sure they won't go for certain submissions that may hurt you, or they'll tone it down. Anyways, sparring partners will work with you if you are injured to assure your safety.

    As for the doc, yeah, go see him. Even if he tells you to stop training, at least you know what's really causing your symptoms. Hell, you may even talk to your doctor to see if there are rehab procedures (or referrals to an orthopedist or sports doc) for you while you train cuz "you can't stop training" (make a lie, that you are part-time MA instructor or something.)

    Once a doctor realizes (or comes to believe) you have not much of a choice when it comes to stop doing certain activities, they'll try to work with you. Remember, a doctor's prime directive is to stop whatever is fucking you up first, or to manage it if it can't be stopped. So of course, it is a natural reaction for a doctor to tell you to stop training.

    Again, use your good judgement once you get a prognosis from your doctor. And talk to your sparring partners and your MA instructor about your health concerns. They'll work with you if you work with them.

    Good luck.
    Read this for flexibility and injury prevention, this, this and this for supplementation, this on grip conditioning, and this on staph. New: On strenght standards, relationships and structural balance. Shoulder problems? Read this.

    My crapuous vlog and my blog of training, stuff and crap. NEW: Me, Mrs. Macho and our newborn baby.

    New To Weight Training? Get the StrongLifts 5x5 program and Rippetoe's "Starting Strength, 2nd Ed". Wanna build muscle/gain weight? Check this article. My review on Tactical Nutrition here.

    t-nation - Dissecting the deadlift. Anatomy and Muscle Balancing Videos.

    The street argument is retarded. BJJ is so much overkill for the street that its ridiculous. Unless you're the idiot that picks a fight with the high school wrestling team, barring knife or gun play, the opponent shouldn't make it past double leg + ground and pound - Osiris
  6. spirez is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/17/2007 1:28pm


     Style: BJJ/no-gi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I'd be more worried about a failed RNC attempt that actually crushes the jaw rather than the triangle.

    Ask a doc though. May be that it's not going to be made any worse.
  7. libertine1234 is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/28/2007 5:13pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: JKD

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Thanks for all the replies,
    I have actually gone to the orthos for my condition numerous times during my early teen years. It is indeed a "crossbite". I will try to describe it a lil bit. Basically, my teeth do not align. My lower jaw potrudes slightly forward and sideways. It is fairly major from a doctor's point of view. But people dont really notice my so called "deformity" unless I tell them about it. Sometimes, in photos, I can see that my lower jaw slants sideways.

    There is really no other option to fix it other than surgery. It is a major one too - involves cutting the jaw off and fitting it properly. Unfortunately, the surgery itself is a long process. Braces pre-op for a few months and braces post ops for a period of time. The entire process may be an entire year. Currently, I am just unprepared financially and mentally for such a major procedure.

    What really worries me is .. let me try to explain this the best way i can. Since me lower jaw is slanted to the left..... lets say i get kneed from the left. Hell, i dont want it to slide even more the left. Also, its pretty obvious that my jaw joints are more vulnerable than the avg person. A straight downward pressure to the lower jaw during a failed RNC attempt could theoritica
    lly end me.

    Just last night, we were drilling side mount pins - the one where u try to force the guys face to the side by pushing your shoulder into the jaw. **** that was scary. But it didnt hurt or anything....

    Currently, i train at a pretty small school. So its cool.... everyone i train with knows abt my condition and try their best not to hurt me. But ill be moving soon....

    I am still contemplating whether to continue or to stop completely. One solution i was thinking abt was to buy a REALLY good mouthguard. Costum made.... the ones that keep your jaws shut most of the time.

    I am really interested in what IzzyDAhedgehog have to say about this. I reckon, you might have the same condition as me. How did you keep training with that condition? Doesnt it freak you out a lil bit when sparring.... I mean... not only do u worry abt cranks and failed submissions.... there is always a risk of an acidental elbow or knee. How bt those nasty sidemount pins? Do you compete man?

    I really am quite passionate about martial arts. Ive tries a few over the years... and liked this one the most. I was really into boxing at one point... but gave up the possibility of ever training due to my jaw problems. Heh, pretty funny now that i think about it. Soft art my ass! hehe..... never thought grappling could **** you up in the jaw department.
  8. pauli is offline

    i keep tryin to spar, but nothin happens!

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    Posted On:
    7/29/2007 11:41am

    supporting member
     Style: karate / bjj

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    yes. go to the dentist and have a custom mouthguard made. it's not that expensive.
  9. money is offline
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    Flyweight

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    Posted On:
    7/29/2007 12:06pm

    supporting member
     Style: BJJ, MT, MMA, CQB

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I have TMJ but have never had any problems with Jiu-jitsu aggravating it. At most I've had a sore chin from fighting the RNC but as long as I keep my mouth shut it doesn't seem to bother my jaw at all.

    I think a good mouthguard should protect you pretty well. To be safe, just be ready to tap if you ever feel your jaw could be in trouble.
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  10. v1y is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/29/2007 12:22pm


     Style: Internet Warrior, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I have the exact same problem as you... except much less severe. Underbite and crossbite.

    I saw an oral surgeon about getting my wisdom teeth out and asked him about my jaw during the appointment, and he was pretty upfront that the cosmetic and health benefits would be virtually nil for me.

    Personally the only time during bjj that i've had any discomfort was when i was getting guillotined ONCE (and i've tapped to many a guillotine), but i've never had any problems with gi-chokes and triangles.
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