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  1. Warborn is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/04/2007 1:26am

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Arthrosis and BJJ?

    Hi,

    I am new here obviously, and I am interested in starting up BJJ. In my search for schools I came across this forum and decided to sign up. About a year ago, I couldn't sleep because my shoulder hurt so fucking bad. I knew it wasn't the muscle, and feared the worst. Well, the chiro confirmed it. It is arthrosis (and at middle age it was crushing news) in my left shoulder. Will this keep me from doing BJJ? My doctor recommended cycling, MEH. I have since been doing Tai'chi on a regular basis, and really enjoy it, but would like to complement it with BJJ. What do you think? Thanks for your advice.

    Cheers,

    Warborn.
  2. actionfaad is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/04/2007 2:45am

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     Style: BJJ (JJ machado)

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    Well there are tons of shoulder cranks in bjj. What causes your shoulder pain? Being stretched or being neglected?
  3. longman is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/04/2007 3:28am

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     Style: BJJ

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    My guess is probably both, if done to the right degree. Conversely both usually help, again done to the right degree.

    The short answer is you probably shouldn't do BJJ, as people (myself included) are idiots and you will usually end up making it worse. Which, trust me, you really don't wanna do. Carry on with Tai Chi and complement it with yoga taught by an instructor who really understands your condition (stay a million miles away from Gym Yoga classes).

    The long answer is it can actually help, as it is activity that involves both strength and range of mopvement exercises, both of which will be beneficial for the shoulder. The trick is knowing (and sticking to your limitations.

    I do BJJ with fairly bad OA of the knee.

    When I am sensible, I only do what I can, and feel no way about sitting out of the class when the exercise/move they are doing will inflame the knee. I also roll lightly and make it clear to my partner i have problems with the legs.
    With the more experienced and sensible guys, I allow leg locks, but when they go for it, we slow down to super slow motion. Obviously the guy needs to be pretty good for this. If i am sparring a newbie, or a bit of an egohead, I tap as soon as they touch my leg, just in case.

    when I am an idiot (most of the time) I act like i'm 17 again and spar like i have no problems. And wake up with a knee the size of a watermelon for the next 2 weeks.

    I think shoulder problems could be very problematic, as the shoulder is used so much in BJJ (even without the cranks). It can be done, but once the adrenalin is up and you get the bug, the chances are you'll bite through the pain, and exacerbate the problem.

    In conclusion, I would say that doing BJJ is better than doing nothing at all (the worst thing you can do), but not as good as doing one of the gentler disciplines. A LOT more fun though.
  4. Asriel is offline
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    I'd like to leave this world like I came into it: Screaming, naked & covered in someone else's blood

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    Posted On:
    5/04/2007 3:30am

    supporting member
     Style: Muay Thai (BJJ hiatus)

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I had a shoulder injury that was actually sorted out by training in BJJ.
    " The reason elite level MMAists don't fight with aikido is the same reason elite level swimmers don't swim with their lips." - Virus

    " I shocked him with my skills on the ice becuase Wing Chun is great for hockey fighting." - 'Sifu' Milt Wallace

    "Besides, as you might already know (from Virus, for example) - there's only 1 wing chun and it sucks big time" - Tonuzaba

    "Even when I'm promising mayhem and butt-chicanery, I'm generally posting with a smile on my face." - Sochin101

    "That said, if he blocked my hip on a drop nage, I would extend my leg into a drop tai Otoshi and slam him so hard his parents would die." - MTripp

  5. longman is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/04/2007 3:34am

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     Style: BJJ

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    What was the injury? Arthrosis/Arthritis are slightly different. better to think of them as disabilities rather than injuries. They are degenerative (left alone will get worse) and untreatable (you can only slow the progress, not reverse it).
  6. Warborn is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/04/2007 4:48am

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Thanks for the replies!

    @actionfaad- The pain is caused by the fact that the gel sac between the shoulder socket and arm bone has deteriorated, and as such the bones grind on eachother. It is degenerative, meaning it will get worse, if neglected, and it can't be cured yet AFAIK. I have managed to stop the degeneration luckily. I practice some of my kung fu forms regularly for fitness and rollerblade so I don't get fat. If I practice the forms full speed and power it causes pain. When I do them with relaxed power, it actually feels good the next day. For the most part, the pain comes and goes regardless of what I do to it.

    @longman- Thanks for the tips, I will keep up with the tai'chi chuan and qi gong, which has really made me feel better overall, not just in the shoulder. I will skip BJJ as I would probably go all out and hurt myself. The Arthrosis is probably a result of going all out in karate/kung fu /wrestling over a twenty year period anyway. By the way, if you haven't checked out Dr Weil's info on Arthritis you may want to. I don't subscribe to all his teaching, but the stuff on Arthritis has helped ease the pain quite a bit, especially the diet part.
    Thanks again for the reply,

    Cheers,

    Warborn
  7. Asriel is offline
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    I'd like to leave this world like I came into it: Screaming, naked & covered in someone else's blood

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    Posted On:
    5/04/2007 4:59am

    supporting member
     Style: Muay Thai (BJJ hiatus)

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Hmmm, my injury was more tendon based so it's not really relevant.

    Warborn, if your shoulder hurts when you practice your KF with speed then I think you're being wise in leaving BJJ. If you ever did want to try it though, I'd recommend a 1-1 class with an instructor who knows all about your problem. That way you could try the various drills and techniques at varying speeds to see how they feel.
    " The reason elite level MMAists don't fight with aikido is the same reason elite level swimmers don't swim with their lips." - Virus

    " I shocked him with my skills on the ice becuase Wing Chun is great for hockey fighting." - 'Sifu' Milt Wallace

    "Besides, as you might already know (from Virus, for example) - there's only 1 wing chun and it sucks big time" - Tonuzaba

    "Even when I'm promising mayhem and butt-chicanery, I'm generally posting with a smile on my face." - Sochin101

    "That said, if he blocked my hip on a drop nage, I would extend my leg into a drop tai Otoshi and slam him so hard his parents would die." - MTripp

  8. Warborn is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/04/2007 5:50am

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     Style: Jackofallmasterofnone

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Asriel
    Hmmm, my injury was more tendon based so it's not really relevant.

    Warborn, if your shoulder hurts when you practice your KF with speed then I think you're being wise in leaving BJJ. If you ever did want to try it though, I'd recommend a 1-1 class with an instructor who knows all about your problem. That way you could try the various drills and techniques at varying speeds to see how they feel.
    That is a good idea about the one on one with an instructor. I will try to sort that out. Thanks.

    Warborn
  9. Asriel is offline
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    I'd like to leave this world like I came into it: Screaming, naked & covered in someone else's blood

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    Posted On:
    5/04/2007 6:41am

    supporting member
     Style: Muay Thai (BJJ hiatus)

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    No problemo :) Be sure to let us know how it goes.
    " The reason elite level MMAists don't fight with aikido is the same reason elite level swimmers don't swim with their lips." - Virus

    " I shocked him with my skills on the ice becuase Wing Chun is great for hockey fighting." - 'Sifu' Milt Wallace

    "Besides, as you might already know (from Virus, for example) - there's only 1 wing chun and it sucks big time" - Tonuzaba

    "Even when I'm promising mayhem and butt-chicanery, I'm generally posting with a smile on my face." - Sochin101

    "That said, if he blocked my hip on a drop nage, I would extend my leg into a drop tai Otoshi and slam him so hard his parents would die." - MTripp

  10. Cassius is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/04/2007 6:50am

    supporting memberforum leader
     Style: Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Arthrosis = the medical name for a joint. I think the word you're looking for is arthritis. Moving this to the appropriate forum.
    "No. Listen to me because I know what I'm talking about here." -- Hannibal
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