228395 Bullies, 4186 online  
  • Register
Our Sponsors:

Results 1 to 5 of 5
Sponsored Links Spacer Image
  1. AeroChica is offline
    AeroChica's Avatar

    Welterweight

    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Oakville, ON, CANADA
    Posts
    921

    Posted On:
    5/03/2007 12:08pm

    Business Class Supporting Member
     Jiu-Jitsu, Muay Thai, BJJ, Judo, MMA and Kids Jiu-Jitsu Style: Boxing, Mom-Jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Does this science hold water?

    Heya! I am considering a pre-workout suplement, but I am not educated in biology so I can't tell if the claims made about how the supplement work actually make sense. This may be a bit long, but if anyone has more experience in this, perhaps you can advise me if this is a reasonable supplement. If it helps to know, my goal in exercising is primarily to lose weight and secondarily to build muscle, and I am considering taking this before my boxing class which has a significant cardio component, but lots of strength building too. Thanks!

    First of all - this is a Melaleuca product. I know Melaluecua is a total pyramid scheme, and I am not involved in the business practices, but I am a happy customer of theirs. I prefer to use low-toxin cleaners and personal care products especially for my kids, and theirs are pretty good.

    So, here are the deets on the Melaleuca Access Bar:

    This weblink should give you the info the company puts out about the product:

    http://melaleuca.com/ps/index.cfm?f=...e=1&sCatId=129

    When I asked for more information, I was sent a document that explains the science in more detail. This is what I got:

    Converting Fat to Energy

    Whenever you’re exercising and you perform a muscle contraction, fuel must be supplied to that muscle. Your muscles run on two main types of fuel: glucose and free fatty acids. Glucose is created from a sugar called glycogen, which is stored in limited quantities in your liver and in your muscle tissue. Free fatty acids are formed from the fat that is stored in your fat cells.
    Your body is constantly using both kinds of fuel to accomplish daily tasks – though in different amounts. Typically, glucose provides all the energy you need for quick, high-energy activities. For example, if you sprint for a a\departing bus, glucose is giving you most of the energy required to move your legs and pump your arms. If, however, you’re going for a jog – or any other sustained aerobic activity – fatty acids are the preferred fuel. Even then, glucose is used in a joint effort as well.
    When the glycogen stored in your muscles is reduced to about 50% of maximum storage, further depletion directly affects high-intensity exercise and speeds up the onset of fatigue. But if using your fat stores for fuel could be enhanced, the glycogen in your muscles would be spared – and muscle fatigue could be delayed.
    Unfortunately, your body cannot simply put stored fat into immediate use. It must first convert your fat into the more user-friendly fatty acids. This complicate conversion requires a chain reaction involving nerve impulses and enzymes. As long as this process is allowed to proceed unhindered, your muscles have a ready supply of fat fuel and can continue to work. However, during increased physical activity, the body also produces adenosine -- a natural byproduct of energy use.
    Dr. Lawrence C.H. Wang -- the inventor of the Access Bar – discovered that it is adenosine that hinders our ability to continue to use fat efficiently, and it is one of the reasons why we cannot use our stored fat on command.

    Adenosine: Trouble from Our Past
    Adenosine throws a wrench in the process of converting stored fat to fatty acids – essentially shutting down your body’s ability to keep going and exercise effectively. First, it inhibits the nerve impulse involved, and second, it inhibits the activity of the enzyme required for fat deployment. As a result, the conversion of fat to fatty acids is reduces and your muscles are without a sufficient supply of this vital fuel. In addition, adenosine also inhibits the nerve impulses required to stimulate muscle contraction. And finally, adenosine inhibits the full utilization of glucose. Instead, adenosine favors the conversion glucose into lactic acid – the substance left over from exercise that often builds up in your muscles, causing soreness. The combined effects of adenosine are, therefore, totally counterproductive to sustaining ongoing physical activity. You simply can’t continue exercising – you can’t keep going – you “bonk!”
    Why would adenosine work against your fat-burning efforts? Centuries ago, when primitive man continually fought nature’s challenges to find food, adenosine served as a valuable regulator to prevent wasted energy. It promoted fatigue, thereby ensuring energy conservation. Its presence ensured that we would not use all our fat stores so we s\could keep some in reserve for future needs like during periods of food shortages or famines.
    The importance of this protective mechanism is still evident today in societies where food availability remains unpredictable. However, in highly develop societies, where food is as close as the nearest grocery store or corner café, getting enough energy is not a problem. Using it all up is. Yet, adenosine continues on as if nothing has changed. Unfortunately, adenosine is most active when our activity levels are the highest, such as during intense exercise. In other words, just when you’re working your hardest to get rid of excess fat, adenosine is working just as hard to keep it stored away!

    Access Minimizes the Impact of Adenosine
    The patented food ingredients in the Access Bar contain “adenosine receptor antagonists” which can minimize the impact of adenosine, and thereby reduce its inhibitory effect on fat use. This release of adenosine’s inhibitory properties is compared by Dr. Wang to the release of a hand brake in a fast-moving car.
    To understand how the natural food blend of the Access Bar works, think of your car driving down the highway with the hand brake on. Granted, the car still moves – but the brake forces it to travel more slowly and saps the engine’s full potential. The Access Bar released your body’s hand brake, allowing your fat-burning engine to fully exert its power and achieve full throttle performance!
    When eaten fifteen minutes before engaging in any sustained exercise or activity, the Access Bar
    ·overrides the energy-sapping effects of adenosine so you burn more fat,
    ·boosts your energy levels,
    ·minimizes fatigue,
    ·reduces lactic acid build-up, and
    ·increases muscle fiber recruitment
    for a more efficient workout. After all, with greater “access” to the fuel that makes your muscles work better, you’ll naturally burn more fat and get much more out of your efforts!

    So what do you think - total BS, grain of truth, or solid science?

    Now, I am well aware that there is no quick fix when it comes to fitness, and there is no substitute for hard work. That being said - if there is something that can help me get the most out of my workout, I can use all the help I can get!

    Thanks!
  2. Numpty is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Posts
    11

    Posted On:
    5/03/2007 12:47pm


     Style: Kickboxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    To tell you the truth I didnt read the whole thing so I wont comment on it. TLDR But if your looking for supplements that work here are some.



    Vinegar(yup better believe it ahelps to burn fat)
    ZMA
    Creatine monohydrate
    Whey Protein
    Fish Oil
    Greens+ (or any vegetable supplement like it)
    Accelerade ( or a cheap alternative is gatorade with some whey mixed in)

    If money is a issue I would start with the most important three. Creatine, Whey and fish oil.

    If your looking for fat loss the best supplement out there is Ephedra. Unfortunately they didnt have enough blood money like the big pharmaceutical companys do to keep it on the market so the FDA banned it without any solid evidence that people who did'nt abuse/overdose/mix it things like METH had dangerouse sideeffects.
  3. Teh El Macho is offline
    Teh El Macho's Avatar

    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Porcupine/Hollywood, FL & Parmistan via Elbonia
    Posts
    11,762

    Posted On:
    5/03/2007 2:00pm

    supporting member
     Style: creonte on hiatus

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Well, as for the access bar, some people claim it works, some say it doesn't. I found the following article at the NCBI website, so that should be taking into consideration.
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...&dopt=Abstract
    Kolkhorst FW, MacTaggart JN, Hansen MR.
    School of Health, University of Northern Iowa, Cedar Falls 50614-0241, USA.

    The manufacturer claims that using the Access Fat Conversion Activity Bar increases fat utilisation, which would have a glycogen-sparing effect and delay the onset of fatigue from endurance exercise. This claim was tested using seven trained distance runners who performed two trials of treadmill running at 73% of VO2max to exhaustion. In a counterbalanced design, subjects ingested either one Access Bar with water or water only prior to treadmill running. Times to exhaustion for the control and Access treatment trials were 104.6 +/- 24.9 min and 93.9 +/- 21.4 min, respectively, and were not significantly different (p > .05). Differences between trials were not observed for the respiratory exchange ratio, blood lactate or glucose concentrations, plasma glycerol concentration, or perceived exertion. Based on results from this study, it was concluded that the Access Bar does not affect fat or carbohydrate utilisation and does not improve exercise endurance.

    PMID: 9615869 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
    Aero, to me, if it's not a mainstream product used by athletes, it is likely to be bullpoop. For the price for each bar, I think that's too expensive. A bottle of gatorade or an energy drink with guarana and ginseng will serve you better as as pre-workout supplement IMO.

    Quote Originally Posted by AeroChick
    Heya! I am considering a pre-workout suplement, but I am not educated in biology so I can't tell if the claims made about how the supplement work actually make sense. This may be a bit long, but if anyone has more experience in this, perhaps you can advise me if this is a reasonable supplement. If it helps to know, my goal in exercising is primarily to lose weight and secondarily to build muscle, and I am considering taking this before my boxing class which has a significant cardio component, but lots of strength building too. Thanks!
    When you lose weight, try to keep lean body mass. The first thing you need to consider is your daily caloric intake. For that, you need to determine the ideal bodyweight for somebody your height. Be mindful that active people can weight more than sendentary ones (since muscle is heavier than other forms of tissue).

    This is a little bit long, so please bear with me, and PM/ask me anything at any time.

    First, check the following chart in this URL to see what your weight should be. The weights are distributed by height and and frame type (small, medium or large).

    Then compare your actual weight with the one indicated in the chart. In the event your current weight is greater (not by 2 or 5lbs, but much more), then the next step is to adjust your caloric intake. That is, you need to estimate how much calories per body weight you need to take to lose, maintain or gain weight. The following is one of the many guidelines (which only vary slightly from one to the other):

    -- fat loss : 10 - 13 calories per pound of bodyweight
    -- maintenance : 14 - 17 calories per lb of bw
    -- weight gain : 18 - 20 calories per lb of bw

    Let's take, as an example, a person that weights 170lbs, but should be weighting 150lbs. To begin with, that person is taking at least 2380 calories a day to keep that weight. The goal then is to decrease that number without starving.

    That person should first compute the calories needed to lose weight at 150lbs on a daily basis (never less than 1500 and no more than 1950 calories, probably somewhere between 1700 and 1800 calories). Let's call that number A.

    Then, compute how much calories a day a 150lbs needs to take to keep 150lbs (between 2100 and 2550 calories). Let's call that number B.

    Then, that person should gradually cut calories down to somewhere in A (between 1500 and 1950) until he/she gets to the desired weight, and then stay between that number and B (between 2100 and 2550).

    Every person is different, and there are factors to be considered, such as exercise and lifestyle. This means we all need to play back and forth, decreasing and increasing your food intake according to your current needs and exercise routines.

    So that's how you compute how much you need to eat. It's imperative to have an idea about what your daily caloric needs are. You don't want to overeat, and you certainly don't want to undereat (and get sick.)

    Second, check the following sticky thread (7 Habits of Highly Effective Nutritional Programs.) In a nutshell, it involves eating 5-7 times a day, in small portions, with higher protein content as the day goes by. This works absolutely well for people that exercise.

    Some people take 2 gatorades as 2 meals, and a low fat, high protein shake (300 cals, 50g protein) as a 3rd meal, out of a total number of 7. It works extremelly well for lots of people, but not all. So be mindfull of that.

    Third, I'm assuming you are not doing any weights, just the boxing conditioning and bodyweights. And that's great. But if you ever get a chance, consider doing some free weight exercises as well. Lunges and squats are great for burning calories and building muscle tone.

    Hope it helps :)
    Read this for flexibility and injury prevention, this, this and this for supplementation, this on grip conditioning, and this on staph. New: On strenght standards, relationships and structural balance. Shoulder problems? Read this.

    My crapuous vlog and my blog of training, stuff and crap. NEW: Me, Mrs. Macho and our newborn baby.

    New To Weight Training? Get the StrongLifts 5x5 program and Rippetoe's "Starting Strength, 2nd Ed". Wanna build muscle/gain weight? Check this article. My review on Tactical Nutrition here.

    t-nation - Dissecting the deadlift. Anatomy and Muscle Balancing Videos.

    The street argument is retarded. BJJ is so much overkill for the street that its ridiculous. Unless you're the idiot that picks a fight with the high school wrestling team, barring knife or gun play, the opponent shouldn't make it past double leg + ground and pound - Osiris
  4. AeroChica is offline
    AeroChica's Avatar

    Welterweight

    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Oakville, ON, CANADA
    Posts
    921

    Posted On:
    5/04/2007 12:22pm

    Business Class Supporting Member
     Jiu-Jitsu, Muay Thai, BJJ, Judo, MMA and Kids Jiu-Jitsu Style: Boxing, Mom-Jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Aero, to me, if it's not a mainstream product used by athletes, it is likely to be bullpoop. For the price for each bar, I think that's too expensive. A bottle of gatorade or an energy drink with guarana and ginseng will serve you better as as pre-workout supplement IMO.

    Agreed. I generally figure if something is obscure, there is probably a reason for it.




    -- fat loss : 10 - 13 calories per pound of bodyweight
    -- maintenance : 14 - 17 calories per lb of bw
    -- weight gain : 18 - 20 calories per lb of bw

    Yep, I am definately in the 'fat loss' catagory. I've done a RMR calculation and have a good idea of my caloric needs - the problem is sticking to them ;-) I started journalling my diet recently and discovered I was seriously under-protien. I have been eating more protien in the last few weeks and it has decreased my appetite, so something is working!


    Second, check the following sticky thread (7 Habits of Highly Effective Nutritional Programs.) In a nutshell, it involves eating 5-7 times a day, in small portions, with higher protein content as the day goes by. This works absolutely well for people that exercise.

    Some people take 2 gatorades as 2 meals, and a low fat, high protein shake (300 cals, 50g protein) as a 3rd meal, out of a total number of 7. It works extremelly well for lots of people, but not all. So be mindfull of that.

    Does this apply to everyone, or only people who are seriously training? My liefstyle is basically sedentary (desk job, formal exercise only 2-3 hours per week).

    Third, I'm assuming you are not doing any weights, just the boxing conditioning and bodyweights. And that's great. But if you ever get a chance, consider doing some free weight exercises as well. Lunges and squats are great for burning calories and building muscle tone.

    Yeah, right now my only strength training consists of deadlifting a 30 pound toddler. I should definately do some extra work on that.

    Thanks for the feedback!
  5. andrewa is online now

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    557

    Posted On:
    5/09/2007 7:06am


     Style: Grappling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Hi Aero. Just some quick thoughts. John Berardi who wrote the article linked in your last post is a great coach. Go the T-Nation website here for more of his stuff http://www.t-nation.com

    Always remember that any type of body transformation (dieting, gaining muscle) is always a work in progress and any plan you use today will likely change in the future. Don't be afraid to experiment with new programs.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Powered by vBulletin™© contact@vbulletin.com vBulletin Solutions, Inc. 2011 All rights reserved.