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  1. DuckofDeath is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/16/2007 1:12pm


     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Red Sauce
    Just adding to this: on this page:
    http://www.fpj.com.br/resultados/res...08-04-2004.htm

    The guy is down as ROBSON ALEXANDER PEREIRA not Robson Aguino Pereira as our Robson is down on the Certificate. So I would say a different person.

    And from my googling both Robson and Pereira are very common names in Brazil from what it seems, so I would be betting the Judo guy from the above links is a diff guy.
    Since Robson A. Pereira is a ligeiro or light weight and our Robson has listed his own weight as 170 lbs at a heigt of 5' 10" (people who have actually seen him have confirmed this description), I knew it wasn't the same person. It appeared to be the same name, however, which our Robson might be able to exploit to some degree. The judo resultados listing for a Robson Alexander Pereira now makes clear that the full names are not identical.
  2. DuckofDeath is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/16/2007 1:19pm


     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    duckII,

    Thanks for posting the whole megillah above as revealed to you by Robson Who? Be sure to keep us apprised of any subsequent revelations...
  3. duckII is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/16/2007 1:53pm


     Style: bjj

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    DoD,

    From what I gather, no one has ever seen nor has Robson ever been able to produce even a single photo of Sakata. One would think that if you trained with one person long enough to receive even one belt ranking, let alone a black belt in BJJ, you would have at least a picture or two.

    Also, I got the distinct impression that the whole Renzo re-training idea was set up as "damage control" and as a legitimate way to establish rank but that Robson pulled the plug once he hooked up with Marcos and Rigan.

    I may be reading between the lines on these points, but I think I'm on pretty firm ground on both assumptions.
  4. DuckofDeath is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/17/2007 12:59am


     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by duckII
    From what I gather, no one has ever seen nor has Robson ever been able to produce even a single photo of Sakata. One would think that if you trained with one person long enough to receive even one belt ranking, let alone a black belt in BJJ, you would have at least a picture or two.
    Not only that, but Robson hasn't even produced a single photo of himself training or competing, which he supposedly did for a decade in Sao Paulo. Not one photo from a decade's worth of training and competing...

    Also, I got the distinct impression that the whole Renzo re-training idea was set up as "damage control" and as a legitimate way to establish rank but that Robson pulled the plug once he hooked up with Marcos and Rigan.
    I kind of think that in rat-speak "re-training" was a euphemism for "earn legitimate rank." Of course, that might take a while, so why not shop your Sakata belt around and see if you can get someone to recognize it?
    Last edited by DuckofDeath; 4/17/2007 1:04am at .
  5. jnp is offline
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    Titanium laced beauty

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    Posted On:
    4/17/2007 1:14am

    supporting memberforum leaderstaff
     Style: BJJ, wrestling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    This is a much more respectable approach DoD.

    I sent a query up the chain regarding Rigan's involvement in this matter over six months ago. I have yet to receive an answer. I do not think I ever will.
  6. DuckofDeath is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/17/2007 3:01am


     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Whorian Gracie
    Just curious as to what the motive would be to promote this guy?
    That's the $64,000.00 question.

    At first it seemed a possibility that a little school with a deep war chest might be so desperate to get its own in-house BJJ BB with a second degree who could do in-house promotions for them that they would lay out big bucks to buy rank. But Jesus, getting three--count 'em--BJJ big wheels involved in the mess? Furthermore, after Robson left RPFS, how would he manage to get the 3rd degree from Mansor with access to the hypothetical war chest cut off? Would Robson--purportedly a construction worker--have deep enough pockets to keep on buying rank? I hope duckII gets Robson Who? to open up a little more about why Robson left RPFS, as I think this might shed more light on these goings-on.

    I also have problems with the Robson-as-crown-prince-of-fakes view. Having spoken with him myself by phone, I came away with the impression that he was somewhat of a simpleton. (On another thread I quipped that Robson might be some sort of idiot-savant of fakery, and I just happened to get the idiot on the line instead of the savant.) I have trouble with the idea of his snookering BJJ big wheels who should know better, especially Mansor, who as a former law enforcement officer in Rio should know something about frauds and con men.

    Blackmail? Unlikely. Political/familial favor called in whose roots go back to Brazil? Who knows.
  7. DuckofDeath is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/17/2007 3:51am


     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by jnp
    I sent a query up the chain regarding Rigan's involvement in this matter over six months ago. I have yet to receive an answer. I do not think I ever will.
    So five months before I sent my letter to Rigan, you had already sent a query "up the chain"? You'd think that given the serious nature of your query, it should have moved up the chain pretty fast.
  8. GoldenJonas is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/17/2007 8:14am

    Join us... or die
     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by DuckofDeath
    At first it seemed a possibility that a little school with a deep war chest might be so desperate to get its own in-house BJJ BB with a second degree who could do in-house promotions for them that they would lay out big bucks to buy rank.
    But why? Depending on the school a BJJ Brown can award up to purple or at least a four stripe blue I believe. A Black can award a brown and I think I read that it takes a 3rd degree black to award a black. Given the typically slow and methodical progression of BJJ rank awards and fighter development it would seem to me to be a bad investment unless a school is desperate to get a quick influx of enrollment based on a misrepresentation that they have a BJJ BB. I'm not saying that McDojo's and Bullshido schools are not this short sited but with their investment but they are typically businessmen after all. Further, the schools that "recognized" his rank and awarded the advanced ranks really had no need for another BJJ BB under their umbrella.

    Quote Originally Posted by DuckofDeath
    Blackmail? Unlikely. Political/familial favor called in whose roots go back to Brazil? Who knows.
    Tread lightly here DoD. This type of unsubstantiated speculation could derail what has thus far been a good investigatory breakdown.
  9. duckII is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/17/2007 9:09am


     Style: bjj

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    My source from Rat Pack is adament that the only $$ which ever changed hands between Rat Pack and Santos was a stanard monthly association fee, between Rat Pack and Rigan was a standard seminar fee and between Rat Pack and Mansor was, again, one standard seminar fee.

    Assuming this is true, and I have no reason to believe it is not, it blows the whole "deep war chest" theory out of the water.

    I did ask him if any $$ changed hands directly between Robson and any of those mentioned above and he indicated that none to his knowledge but clarified that he was not privy to the majority of their conversations with Robson which either took place outside of his presence or, if he was there, were conducted in potugese.
    Last edited by duckII; 4/17/2007 9:34am at .
  10. datdamnmachine is offline
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    Jiu Jitsu - Sometimes passing just isn't an option.

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    Posted On:
    4/17/2007 10:51am

    supporting member
     Style: BJJ, Unauthorized Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by DuckofDeath
    Blackmail? Unlikely. Political/familial favor called in whose roots go back to Brazil? Who knows.
    Although there is no proof of this, it is something that I was thinking about even before you posted it. It may be a new direction that can be used to gain information. It might be worth checking into.
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