"Lao Chi Kung Fu" - Disgraceful.

**KhanomTom** · Posted On: 4/09/2007 3:29pm

"Lao Chi Kung Fu", a 5 animals style. Thought I'd check it out, what's the harm. Love Chinese Martial Arts, do wushu myself. This place, oh my god, disgraceful.

I walked through the door "Hi is this Lao Chi Kung Fu"
"Yes"
"Can i try a lesson"
"do you have £5?"replied the short, angry faced "sifu"
"Yeah"
"then okay"

I did my own warm up, because theirs was pathetic. No cardiovascular, nothing that would stretch me in any way. True I do Taekwondo, but still, i need a stretch before i train.

The lesson - He lied for an hour.

"All martial arts come from the shoalin temple"
"Bollocks"

He said "Have you any training in martial arts whatsoever"

"1st Dan TKD, Muay Thai 6 years, 2 year Wushu"

"oh, er, er, forms" he looked annoyed lol.

This is the worst place you could ever go to learn a martial art.

He made it up as he went. I asked him how he learnt this style he replied "oh er, how i learned it, er , er, an old chinese master came over ten years ago, dead now"

"riiiiiight"

Bollocks.

**jtkarate** · Posted On: 4/09/2007 6:03pm

Was there anything else they did or didn't do. Any sparring at all ?

**Hands** · Posted On: 4/09/2007 9:09pm

The first warning sign is when they ask for money on the first lesson, when you simply want to try their school out.

**Hands** · Posted On: 4/09/2007 10:55pm

Originally Posted by Whorian Gracie

Charging for a "trial" lesson for the price that is basically an equivalent of a gym drop in rate isn't a warning sign. It is a sign that they are in business. I don't do stretches or warmups in my classes either so I can't say that is a sign of a bad school. A lack of sparring and such is not so good though.

This place have a website?

I don't see a problem with drop-in rates. I would just be concerned if there was a fee for the first class. I understand that there may also be legitimate reasons to charge for a trial class.

I ran a search and found the following website:
http://www.laochikungfu.co.uk/website/homepage.htm

I saw a definite warning sign in the instructors tab:
http://www.laochikungfu.co.uk/website/instructor.htm
The claim is that you can start your own school after one year of training. I wonder how much it costs.

So what do you think of the videos on that site?

**ScyberMonk** · Posted On: 4/12/2007 10:42pm

Charging for a first lesson/trail lesson isn't always a bad call. I charge for mine, simply because I don't make enough revenue not to. They are getting the same lessons as everyone else, ergo, they pay the same price as everyone else.

However, the History of Martial Arts is amazing. I never knew it had such a lackluster tapestry of bullshit.

**KhanomTom** · Posted On: 4/13/2007 5:16am

Originally Posted by Hands

I don't see a problem with drop-in rates. I would just be concerned if there was a fee for the first class. I understand that there may also be legitimate reasons to charge for a trial class.

I ran a search and found the following website:
http://www.laochikungfu.co.uk/website/homepage.htm

I saw a definite warning sign in the instructors tab:
http://www.laochikungfu.co.uk/website/instructor.htm
The claim is that you can start your own school after one year of training. I wonder how much it costs.

So what do you think of the videos on that site?

Yeah that's the site. It was terrible, honestly.

**Asriel** · Posted On: 4/13/2007 6:47am

This is their Grading Syllabus:

1. Beginner to white sash novice. Minimum 3 months training
2. Yellow sash novice. Minimum 3 months training
3. Green sash student. Minimum 6 months training
4. Blue sash student. Minimum 9 months training
5. Brown sash student. Minimum 9 months training
6. Brown sash, 1st badge senior student. Minimum 9 months training
7. Brown sash, 2nd badge senior student. Minimum 9 months training
8. Black sash disciple. Minimum 12 months training
9. Black sash, 1st badge senior disciple. Minimum 24 months training
10. Black sash, 2nd badge Si Fu (master). Minimum 24 months training

**daman24/7** · Posted On: 5/20/2007 4:58pm

Haha what a ripoff place.

**pab_jkd** · Posted On: 6/03/2007 7:53am

hi all,
i used to train in lao chi and i agree with you all, the alleged ' sifu ' is self proclaimed..
it is not only s#*t but incomplete, by nothing, but a greedy money motivated.. wish he was!!
when i was there i told him i was doing wing chun(this will make you laugh) and he said choose,you can't train with me if you do another style.
Also he doesn't even know the 5 animals at all, and the supposed weapon training and qi gong he doesn't know either..

**Flowing Spirit** · Posted On: 6/05/2007 10:35am

Firstly, I need to say that I am a recently qualified instructor in Lao Chi Kung Fu. Whether you think that makes me biased or not is up to you. I have respect for all other martial arts as I believe that it takes strength of personality, commitment and discipline to achieve any standard in all styles that I know of. Knowing this, I’ll try and be as unbiased as I can. I hope you all will do the same.

I am not the Sifu who teaches the class that is being referred to, however I have been taught by this Sifu for about 6 years. I’m not going to type an analysis of his teaching ability as different people have different ways of teaching and, quite frankly, it’s just disrespectful. Some like to teach on a one-to-one basis, others prefer to teach classes as a whole or pair students up of a similar level. Either way, it’s a mute point. Not one way is right - every way has it’s positives and negatives. I think most instructors would agree, a lot of it is down to personal teaching methods and opinion, and each instructor is entitled to that.

What I am going to talk about is what has been mentioned in previous posts. It is true that I have studied the style for a long time, and therefore I have grown attached to it, as all martial artists do. I do however have a brain, and can see the style for what it is: a very good self-defensive martial art.

Most of the people who train with us are not hardened martial artists. We are not competition based, but teach to help people to defend themselves in real life situations. We don’t jump around needlessly, doing pointless back-flips when these will not help you in real life. Lao Chi is a practical martial art. And we (the everyday person who goes to our classes) practice it as such.

I am curious as to the actual class that was visited, as some of the details seem wrong. I thought I would clarify some of the facts about our classes:

Classes are 90 minutes long
Approximately 20 minutes of this is taken up by a good array of stretches.
Then, about 10 minutes of line work and further warm ups takes place
We then have a class session where various techniques are practiced (e.g. combination work, blocks to kicks/weapons etc). The only time this doesn’t happen is when we have student exams approaching, in which case we forgo the group exercise and dedicate more time to student practice.
The class is then partnered off to allow for techniques included in our syllabus to be practiced and sparring to take place. About every ten minutes partners are changed to allow practicing of these techniques to be done on people of differing size/shape etc.
In about the last 20 minutes of the lesson those at the required level are taken to one half of the Kwoon and practice multiple attack scenarios and free-fighting. The last part of the lesson involves practicing animal forms and a warm down.

As with traditional Shaolin kung fu practitioners, the senior students, myself included, help the junior students. This was the same when I was a junior, so it is only fair that I do the same now for our beginners. It helps the beginners to learn, and it also helps the seniors realise any mistakes that they are making themselves, and to become more respectable to their training colleagues. I think the seniors who I practice with do a very good job of taking juniors under their wing and accepting them into the club. I think any of our junior students would agree with me.

We have proper etiquette and all show respect to our Sifu and fellow students, and we take what we do seriously. We do have a bit of a laugh here and there, it is a hobby for most people afterall. The class is a nice bunch of guys and girls, and the atmosphere is generally a happy one.

Our grading system listed on the website is the minimum that anyone needs to do in order to attain the highest levels in our martial art. We think that in order to attain the best desirable level of Lao Chi this timetable is spot on. I personally would not hand a black sash to someone who has been training for only six months.

One main point that I would like to make is that we are not in it for the money as some seem to have implied above. I, myself teach for free, I see it as a part of my training. Both myself and my Sifu both have full time day jobs. I teach as a hobby, not for extra income.

I was dismayed when a friend told me about this page and how it belittles the martial art that I have grown to love over the last 6 years. Personally, I think that if you want a true taster of a martial art you have to give it more than one lesson. You need in fact, to join in for a lesson or two rather than just watch. We have more senior classes where the higher level techniques and parts of our training take place. All I can think is that KhanomTom went to one of our junior classes? Either that or to a class when hardly any senior students turned up!

If any instructor new exactly who was going to turn up to his class before hand things would be great, but I know from experience that that rarely happens. Lesson plans therefore need to be changed on the spot, if anything this is a sign of a good instructor.

If there was some way to invite KhanomTom to a class when I knew that all of the seniors would turn up, so we could ‘put on a good show’, I would. Then I could try and disprove the disrespectful title this thread has been given. We have between 15 -20 junior students at any one time at our Wallasey club, and we dedicate ourselves to them when we need to, as I hope that any student who visits the club will see.

If you are curious as to the truth in what I say, visit us, see for yourself. If it is not for you, fair enough. I myself turned down about four other clubs before I picked Lao Chi.

Bullshido was set up to rip apart the terrible martial arts and presumably acknowledge the decent ones. I hope this has gone some way to convincing the readers of this thread that first impressions are not always right. If you are still not convinced, ask the 60 odd students who train with us what they think.

Thanks.

SA