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  1. Das Moose is offline
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    Posted On:
    6/11/2007 6:14am


     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    So what you're saying is, people exist who can beat world MMA champions, but there's no evidence for them, and we just have to believe they exist....


  2. Askari is offline

    The Bottom Brick

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    Posted On:
    6/11/2007 6:21am


     Style: BJJ, Ju-Jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Lets postulate the same for another activity shall we?

    Lets suggest that there exists a world class hockey player that has never gone on the rink for a hockey game. Lets give him the benefit of the doubt, and not that he has tried the game at least once in pick up.

    Or a world class football player, or boxer. That there is some guy or gal training with a small group in non-resistive hockey drills and they are just as good as the guys playing pro.

    Nope, sorry, some how this just doesnt make the grade.

    Whereas, if I look at the way that hockey players prepare their bodies for the game. The way that football players prepare. The way that track and field athletes train. And how all of these compete against others in order to improve their ability. We see the same methodology of preparation for MMA athletes. Wonder why that is?

    There is a strong correlation between all athletic endeavors. Now I'd say 90% of people in a BJJ/Judo/Sambo/boxing/Randori based Jiu-Jitsu gym arent there to become the next phenom, which is ok. But the training methodology is the same for all of them.
    "Sifu, I"m niether - I'm a fire dragon so don't **** with me!"
  3. BomberH is offline
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    Posted On:
    6/11/2007 6:39am


     Style: Judo, BJJ & Aikido

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by PaDJW
    If that was a swap-out tournament gi that might explain that, but it doesn't explain what he was doing competing in the first place when bona-fide WJJF students do not compete.
    No competition = bona-fide

    No wonder Kano's Kodokan Judo pissed all over JuJitsu and became the number 1 system in Japan. WJJF is a reverse engineered Judo/Karate/Aikido combination. The most stupid thing is that when compiling WJJF the most effective training tool found within its three ingredients, Judo Randori (sparring) was dropped.
  4. snowman is offline

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    Posted On:
    6/11/2007 10:27pm


     Style: sadness and tears

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Sophist
    Which traditions?
    A guy may naturally be equipped with all the attributes to be a champion racing driver, but if he never gets in a real car and confines his training to sitting on a sofa turning a dinner plate back and forth in his hands, he will not kick ass when he enters a real race.
    Can I sig worthy this?
  5. Sophist is offline
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    Posted On:
    6/12/2007 6:19am


     Style: Judo, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by snowman
    Can I sig worthy this?
    Sure. Use it as you like.
  6. Nate1481 is offline
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    Why did they never try this....

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    Posted On:
    6/13/2007 11:41am

    supporting member
     Style: Jujutsu/Mixed

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Dam, just come across this not been on much lately , I've done 6 years with the WJJF Coming up 4 2nd dan in September, I'll read though whats been said later. Sort version some stuff, especial the majority training methodologies suck, the federation is out for money & it's run as a franchise (don't even mention the website)
    Good is that, a lot of the techniques (or parts of them*) are sound & just need some live sparing practise to be used effectively. Will get back with more when I have more time

    *entances into some of them are just ridicules.
    "This won't hurt me a bit..." - My training partner.:new_astha
  7. Das Moose is offline
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    Posted On:
    6/13/2007 12:36pm


     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Nate1481
    Good is that, a lot of the techniques (or parts of them*) are sound & just need some live sparing practise to be used effectively.
    Well yeah, I'm sure they are, but I could teach someone BJJ and have them perform the most awesome armbar on a compliant opponent, get them really good at moving their hips, but they wouldn't get any better at grappling for real.

    Please go ahead and respond to our points. I think we have logic on our side and the best test of that is reasoned debate.
  8. Hanniballistic is offline
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    By the Hoary Hand of Hoggoth.....

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    Posted On:
    6/13/2007 2:32pm


     Style: JKD & Mok'bara

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    If what you are teaching in a system needs modification then the system is fundamentally flawed.

    I can kill with a butter knife with a modification in approach, but to use it as a weapon of choice would be idiocy
  9. Das Moose is offline
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    Posted On:
    6/14/2007 11:46am


     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Bump to get nate's attention. Want to continue this debate.
  10. TaliaSylvia is offline

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    Posted On:
    6/14/2007 7:02pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Ju Jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I don't think there's anything to continue to debate. MMA etc is staggeringly effective at winning competitions and there is no denying that that experience and training strategy will carry over well to a self-defence scenario against an un-trained opponent. However, a friend pointed me to this site and this thread in particular and it's amazing what I've seen here so far. Trash-talking styles and offering to fight people to prove some silly one-upmanship point is juvenile and stupid. The WJJF has some very good martial artists. Yes, there are a few that aren't up to much and obviously that guy in that video, who no-one has proven to any satisfaction that he was a WJJF student, was one of them. I'll issue an open challenge to anyone that feels they have the cajones to take it up. If you're in the UK, in particular the North Wales/Merseyside area, browse to http://www.ju-jitsu.uk.com/ and pick one of the classes taught by Mr Simon Rimmington. Turn up and introduce yourself to him. You can't miss him, his photograph and videos are all over that site. Tell him exactly what most of you have said in this thread - namely that WJJF is crap and WJJF can't fight and offer to prove yourself right there and then. Make sure your life insurance is up to date and you've said goodbye to any loved ones prior to this visit, because that man will destroy 99% of the wannabes I see frequenting this site, including the so-called experienced players. That's the truth. Considering you place great store in putting up or shutting up, it shouldn't be too much of a stretch. If someone does pony up, I'll look forward to hearing about your injuries in class and we can all have a giggle at www.bullshido.net.
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