Legitimate Criticism of Bullshido (the site/community, not the phenomenon)

**Phrost** · Posted On: 3/03/2007 4:15pm

In an effort to prevent the discussion (mainly in this and other serious sub-sections) from becoming insulated, sheltered, and support group-like, I'd like to see what opinions are out there about how we're doing things (beyond stupid crap in YMAS and the other "entertainment" sub-forums), especially criticism.

Sites like this attract a lot of like-minded people, which is great for getting things done, but sometimes a lack of outside perspectives can cause key people to be oblivious to areas where things need to be improved.

It's just like sparring; if you only spar with one or two people all the time, you're not going to improve as fast and close as many holes in your game as if you spar with people from different schools, compete, and take on all comers.

I'm concerned that because we are pretty much the 800lb gorilla in the room now, that the only people who are trying to point out the "holes in our game" are those who are unproductively antagonistic, have personal grudges, or are just incapable of passionate but coherent criticism.

So this is an invitation to all the lurkers, our detractors, anyone who has a question/issue/concern about things that I, the staff, or the senior members could answer or address.

A few ground rules to keep this on topic and productive for everyone:

1. Keep personal issues out of this. This includes bullshit involving the rep function, etc.
2. Remember that The forums are not the primary function/feature of the site. They're just the medium through which we can interact.
3. Don't try to be funny, nobody cares.

Any concept or ideology that needs to be sheltered from criticism isn't worth being espoused.

**aaaargh** · Posted On: 3/03/2007 4:40pm

OK, here goes- Too much great information is buried in 1000-post threads. We need more articles and/or summaries.

**Matt Stone** · Posted On: 3/03/2007 4:58pm

This is an interesting thread, especially so since I had a discussion today with someone who asked the question "who are they to judge?"

I think the one area that may need toning down occasionally is the self-righteousness that some folks end up displaying. Granted, there are some arts that have a good, strong track record of successful demonstrations, e.g. BJJ, Muay Thai, etc. However, in the hunt for those who lay claim to powers of flight, invisibility, and NTKOs, some folks who may well have valid skill sets are thrown into the fire for good measure...

The one thing I think that sets Bullshido apart from every other website is that when a full blown investigation is conducted, and results displayed, it's almost a clinical event. There is little personal opinion to color the findings. The final article sounds more like the coroner's report than it does a condemnation of wrongdoing.

I think that's how a lot of other things should be. The ongoing battle with Rudy Abel is how things ought not to be... That (and I'm not sure what forum its in) presents this site in one of the worst views possible, and potentially serves (I think) to substantiate the anti-Bullshido ammo that the only people over here are name-calling, immature, ****-slingers.

A clinical, facts-only approach, as devoid of inflammatory, juvenile mud-slinging as possible. If someone claims to do "X" superhuman feat, call them out - don't call them names.

Other than that, I think this place is pretty cool... And that's coming from a dyed in the wool Traditionalist who does forms, qigong, meditation and one-step sparring...

:5thanks:

**CanucKyokushin** · Posted On: 3/03/2007 5:17pm

I think that there's very little if anything that is wrong with the site itself.Except perhaps the success is a major drawback to the site.

I like to see a flamewar a much as the next guy.But not when things get out of control and there's nothing constructive gets met.What I mean is that I just hate it when I see 20 noob members basically asking the same questions that the more knowledgeable members are already asking.

Maybe a limit can be place on how many people can post in MABS threads to prevent this.I don't know if this is possible.But look into it.

Constent shitting of things up with short "LOL's" and small picture captions that add nothing to the discussion overall.I'm probably guilty of this now and then but when most people are doing it....Gehs.

Another thing I become exasperated when when trolls are found out but nothing is done to ban said person.

We new KFOY was Rudy but why we let it drag so long is beyond me.

**Phrost** · Posted On: 3/03/2007 5:20pm

Originally Posted by aaaargh

OK, here goes- Too much great information is buried in 1000-post threads. We need more articles and/or summaries.

We created this in part, to rectify that problem. Just need to get people used to using it.

**Axelton** · Posted On: 3/03/2007 5:20pm

Originally Posted by CanucKyokushin

Another thing I become exasperated when when trolls are found out but nothing is done to ban said person.

Thats my only real complaint.

**Phrost** · Posted On: 3/03/2007 5:24pm

Originally Posted by Matt Stone

The one thing I think that sets Bullshido apart from every other website is that when a full blown investigation is conducted, and results displayed, it's almost a clinical event. There is little personal opinion to color the findings. The final article sounds more like the coroner's report than it does a condemnation of wrongdoing.

I think that's how a lot of other things should be. The ongoing battle with Rudy Abel is how things ought not to be... That (and I'm not sure what forum its in) presents this site in one of the worst views possible, and potentially serves (I think) to substantiate the anti-Bullshido ammo that the only people over here are name-calling, immature, ****-slingers.

A clinical, facts-only approach, as devoid of inflammatory, juvenile mud-slinging as possible. If someone claims to do "X" superhuman feat, call them out - don't call them names.

Other than that, I think this place is pretty cool... And that's coming from a dyed in the wool Traditionalist who does forms, qigong, meditation and one-step sparring...

:5thanks:

Well that's another reason why we've got both Bullshido.com (investigations and consumer protection) and Bullshido.org (bare-bones-info/facts without any significant PoV).

**Phrost** · Posted On: 3/03/2007 5:28pm

Originally Posted by CanucKyokushin

I think that there's very little if anything that is wrong with the site itself.Except perhaps the success is a major drawback to the site.

I like to see a flamewar a much as the next guy.But not when things get out of control and there's nothing constructive gets met.What I mean is that I just hate it when I see 20 noob members basically asking the same questions that the more knowledgeable members are already asking.

Maybe a limit can be place on how many people can post in MABS threads to prevent this.I don't know if this is possible.But look into it.

Constent shitting of things up with short "LOL's" and small picture captions that add nothing to the discussion overall.I'm probably guilty of this now and then but when most people are doing it....Gehs.

Another thing I become exasperated when when trolls are found out but nothing is done to ban said person.

We new KFOY was Rudy but why we let it drag so long is beyond me.

Well we knew it was Rudy too, and I invited him back to participate in the CMA forums. This was a mistake because I should have known he's not one to contribute if anyone so much as disagrees with him in the slightest bit.

I just never got around to merging his new and old accounts.

The LOLs and such are being forcibly removed from MABS and people are getting administrative boots in their asses for trying to derail or **** up threads in this sub forum.

YMAS, however, is a much more casual posting environment, and as long as you're not spamming or some other fuckery, we're generally going to be ok with whatever.

**Phrost** · Posted On: 3/03/2007 5:30pm

Originally Posted by Axelton

Thats my only real complaint.

Well this you have to put in perspective. Previously, we never banned ANYONE, especially when the site first started out. If there's a chance someone can contribute to the discusison in one way or another, we'd rather not ban anyone.

**Cullion** · Posted On: 3/03/2007 5:34pm

Repetition is Bullshido's main enemy. Dunno how to fix it.

Sometimes it's some disgruntled non-sparrer coming in to rehash the why-their-style-shouldn't-be-mocked arguments.

Sometimes it's a recent convert to BJJ (often who's come from some flakey **** like the Bujinkan) going apeshit and preaching the gospel according to Thornton about some style they've never practiced using almost word for word arguments we've heard before.

Dunno what to do about it, but repetition is Bullshido's greatest enemy now it has so many members. It's not necessarily a detraction from the mission, but it is fucking boring to read.