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  1. WingChun Lawyer is offline
    WingChun Lawyer's Avatar

    Modesty forbids more.

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    Posted On:
    2/26/2007 1:53pm

    supporting member
     Style: Muay Thai, BJJ newbie.

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Homemade martial arts.

    Anyone here ever heard of someone who created a martial art from scratch?

    I am not talking about mixing, altering, re-creating, changing the name or re-interpreting something. I am talking about doing it all from the start, developing your own training routines, moves, techniques, and everything else in between, with no direct influence from other martial arts and artists.

    OF COURSE I do not deny that it is hard to prevent any such influence on brand new martial arts, but I am talking about developing something - maybe even something good, though that´s unlikely - without actually training in anything else. Maybe just movies, videogames, and spontaneous brawling, but no formal training whatsoever under a qualified martial arts instructor.

    Well, I never heard of such a thing until last week.

    Ladies and gentlemen, let me introduce you to...Tarracá. It was used by a Vale Tudo fighter who called himself "Rei Zulu" in the early 80´s here in Brazil; he kicked (better yet, throwed around) quite a few asses before getting tapped out by Rickson in 1984.

    Apparently this art was created by Zulu´s father, and its training methodology consists of running around trees, throwing heavy rocks and truck tires around, and pushing walls for long periods of time. VERY nice throws.

    Rei Zulu vs Batarelli (a kickboxer who later became a kickboxing champion)

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-yK2SDXaa0

    Rei Zulu vs Rickson

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IrqkKJzOoRs

    Here are recent pictures of the guy. He still competes in amateur bouts, and his son is just starting to fight professionally ("Zuluzinho", isn´t it cute?).

    http://fotos.terra.com.br/album.cgi/*822126

    Did you guys ever hear of something like that? A martial art created from scratch whose representative actually showed significant results, well, ANYWHERE?

    I still believe it is rather hard to get anywhere doing such a thing (Rei Zulu never got very far, but he DID have the bad luck to face Rickson...), but hell, it seems there is a precedent!

    PS: I put this thread here because, well, it IS about standards in martial arts. And brand new martial arts are, of course, more likely than not to be full of it.
    That civilisation may not sink,
    Its great battle lost,
    Quiet the dog, tether the pony
    To a distant post;
    Our master Caesar is in the tent
    Where the maps are spread,
    His eyes fixed upon nothing,
    A hand under his head.


    - W.B. Yeats
  2. OnceLost is offline
    OnceLost's Avatar

    Here's looking at you, squid.

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    Posted On:
    2/26/2007 2:06pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Ke?po, MMA ultra-newb

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Did his father create the martial art (ie, combat techniques) or just the training methology?
    "Reason is a choice. Wishes and whims are not facts, nor are they a means to discovering them. Reason is our only way to grasping reality -- it's our basic tool of survival. We are free to evade the effort of thinking, to reject reason, but we are not free to avoid the penalty of the abyss we refuse to see."
    - Terry Goodkind, "Faith of the Fallen"
  3. Wolf is offline
    Wolf's Avatar

    T3h R34l Gangnam Style!

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    Indianapolis, IN
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    3,540

    Posted On:
    2/26/2007 2:22pm

    staff
     Style: MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I've heard of people CLAIMING to have invented styles from scratch, but never seen one that I thought actually was. This really seems no different. It looked like bad kickboxing with a bit of Greco to me and some dancing thrown in for good measure.
  4. kwoww is offline
    kwoww's Avatar

    poser

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    Jan 2007
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    Lower Hudson Valley / Rochester
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    Posted On:
    2/26/2007 2:27pm


     Style: punching bag / crew jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    It looks like a unique form of fighting as well, especially in the hand techniques.

    edit: Y'know, it actually looks like it could be inspired by the same thing that inspired "drunken" kung-fu...
  5. GreenHornet is offline

    Registered Member

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    Montreal, Canada
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    Posted On:
    2/26/2007 2:39pm


     Style: BJJ Gi and noGi,MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    you mean stupidity?

    Iv'e never heard such thing as a MA started from scratch, most people, even if they don't know what they are doing, will tell you that it's inspired from an other style to give themselves credibility.
    The only other way would be to actually fight like that zulu guy, but then again who would really want to do that.
    Last edited by GreenHornet; 2/26/2007 2:42pm at .
  6. Blue Negation is offline

    Woke up in the mortuary

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    Posted On:
    2/26/2007 2:49pm


     Style: Judo, Sub wrestling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Considering Zulu is, well, ginormous, I think he could get away with monkey kung fu.
  7. OnceLost is offline
    OnceLost's Avatar

    Here's looking at you, squid.

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    Posted On:
    2/26/2007 2:52pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Ke?po, MMA ultra-newb

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    He could probably get away with polka at his size.
    "Reason is a choice. Wishes and whims are not facts, nor are they a means to discovering them. Reason is our only way to grasping reality -- it's our basic tool of survival. We are free to evade the effort of thinking, to reject reason, but we are not free to avoid the penalty of the abyss we refuse to see."
    - Terry Goodkind, "Faith of the Fallen"
  8. datdamnmachine is offline
    datdamnmachine's Avatar

    Jiu Jitsu - Sometimes passing just isn't an option.

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    Location
    Washington State
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    Posted On:
    2/26/2007 5:25pm

    supporting member
     Style: BJJ, Unauthorized Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by OnceLost
    He could probably get away with polka at his size.
    As long as his dancing partner isn't named Fedor...!

    Seriously, interesting read. I do remember an article that talked about his first fight with Rickson. He said that the reason Rickson won was because Rickson had the help and support of his family behind him and Zulu only had himself with regards to training and preperation for those fights. It would make sense.

    Also WCL, I take it from the way you wrote that article that many are not familiar with Zulu in Brazil and you probably figured the rest of us were not. While, as part of the great Gracie Jiu-Jitsu marketing and marketer that is Rorion Gracie, there are probably more people here in the states who know of Zulu then probably in Brazil. Of course all of that information is from their viewpoint so it's interesting to hear some information about the man that wasn't from their point of view. Great stuff. Do you have anymore?
  9. Fantasy Warrior is offline
    Fantasy Warrior's Avatar

    Misguided style basher

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    Posted On:
    2/26/2007 7:06pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Kata

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Interesting read. I don't think he can logically claim it's totally self-created but it seemed faily different from most of what's out there, like old bare knuckle western boxing might have looked in the 1780s maybe - even at the turn of last century many credible western boxers fought with long swinging punches, presumably relying on timing more than covering for defence (?arse sumption on my part). I'm not suggesting that he's copied boxing, but we can see that in the right environment that style of brawling can develop even if it breaks so many 'rules' of what's the right way to move nowadays. Oh ****, I've just given the Wing Chunners and excuse.....

    His kicks lacked form but my god I wouldn't want to stand in their path.
    You are a total Douchbag. Train more, post nevermore.
    FickleFingerOfFate -08-21-2007 08:59 AM

    just die already.
    Plasma - 08-20-2007 11:45 PM


    Aikidokkkkakkakakakaaaaa
    Best MA website ever!!!!!: http://www.dogjudo.co.uk/
  10. DdlR is offline
    DdlR's Avatar

    Light Heavyweight

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    Apr 2005
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    4,771

    Posted On:
    2/26/2007 7:59pm

    supporting member
     Style: Bartitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by kickcatcher
    Interesting read. I don't think he can logically claim it's totally self-created but it seemed faily different from most of what's out there, like old bare knuckle western boxing might have looked in the 1780s maybe - even at the turn of last century many credible western boxers fought with long swinging punches, presumably relying on timing more than covering for defence (?arse sumption on my part). I'm not suggesting that he's copied boxing, but we can see that in the right environment that style of brawling can develop even if it breaks so many 'rules' of what's the right way to move nowadays. Oh ****, I've just given the Wing Chunners and excuse.....

    His kicks lacked form but my god I wouldn't want to stand in their path.
    BKB of the 1780s, possibly ... but most boxing manuals produced during the 1800s and early 1900s specifically caution would-be pugilists against long swinging punches in favor of linear punches from a high, extended guard. IMO a classical BKB fight (say 1880s) would actually look closer to modern _ing _un sparring - fairly upright posture with a slight backward lean, more deflections and blocks than evasions, mostly vertical fists, some low kicks and standing/grappling>takedowns. Differences would be that the BKB fighter would use more body shots than you typically see in _ing _un sparring, more rotation/extension through the hips and shoulder when punching, and longer "measure" or fighting distance (therefore more lunging left hand leads).
    Last edited by DdlR; 2/26/2007 8:02pm at .
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