Kung Fu, Grappling and Cliches'

**Omar** · Posted On: 2/20/2007 8:55am

dude. I have SOOOO many complaints with Bullshido but it totally has the best collection of smileys.

lol.

**SifuJason** · Posted On: 2/20/2007 9:17am

Ignoring the issue of multi-man, as was asked (and I agree it can be a cluster-flop of a situation to discuss, let alone deal with), I definitely think grappling has a place on the street. Not BJJ point grappling, with nice armbars and kimuras, but throws (complete with follow through "slams"), standing arm locks, chokes, etc are all quite effective.

Hell, police officers have to rely ton these techniques to avoid excessive force. The obviously work.

However, I still think few thinks are as time efficient as a punch to the face/kick to the knee. But sometimes you don't want or don't have the angle for that.

**It is Fake** · Posted On: 2/20/2007 9:22am

Hey guys, I moved this out of the training thread because, you guys were getting technique specific (hip throws and multiple attackers).

**ojgsxr6** · Posted On: 2/20/2007 9:45am

Can you CMA guys get a Guojia Anquan Bu section? I would like to see some of the Lock -> Throw techniques of SC. I'm looking at you Omar.

**Mut Sao** · Posted On: 2/20/2007 5:29pm

actually i would say that some stand up grapples and throws are more effiecient than the old punch to the face/ kick to the knee. depends on the situation and the outcome that you require.... certainly in the case of pre-emption strike to face kick to knee is good, but how often is that the course of a fight (pre-emption) If you are grabbed at the outset (read clinch not wrist grab please) control and lock of a joint coupled with throw can be a good option.

It is far better to be versed in multiple ranges than to rely on one. Personally my ground game is not crash hot though it is sufficient for the str33t (whatever that is). i prefer striking and locking/tripping.... and even more so i prefer avoiding...

**It is Fake** · Posted On: 2/20/2007 5:45pm

Originally Posted by ojgsxr6

Can you CMA guys get a Guojia Anquan Bu section? I would like to see some of the Lock -> Throw techniques of SC. I'm looking at you Omar.

Why not start the thread yourself. I may clean up the Piquan thread a little more and make it a sticky. I'll discuss it with RM.

This place is a work in progress.

**bob** · Posted On: 2/20/2007 5:50pm

Originally Posted by SifuJason

However, I still think few thinks are as time efficient as a punch to the face/kick to the knee. But sometimes you don't want or don't have the angle for that.

When you say a kick to the knee, what exactly are you referring to? Thai style round kicks? Front kick to kneecap? Either?

**Antifa** · Posted On: 2/20/2007 7:00pm

I'm going to spend a little time on this and then go back to work. There may be follow up later.

I used to agree with many of the things said on this thread, in theory. Then I learned some and more importantly, I applied my actual real life experience to theory. Hence Praxis.

If you are going to be a street fighter, and I mean a street fighter not a one dimensional bar fighter, grappling training is essenstial

If you are going to deal with multiple attackers, grappling training is essential.

If you are going to be ONE of the Multiple Attackers, grappling training is essential.

Reasons:

1) If you dont want to go to the ground, you need to train to throw people and train to not be thrown on the fucking ground

2) If you do go to the ground you want to break the hold and get up.

3) If you are forced to go to the ground you want to win there.

4) If you get thrown on the hard ass pavement mayhaps you better be up on your breakfalls and not blowing that part of your training off because you know that "stuff" already.

5) If you deal with multiple attackers, one is going to grab you so his friends can beat on you. How do avoid this? Learn to fucking grapple.

6) At the end of every streetfight the authorities arrive. If you are still there guess what? The cops are going to grapple you and take you to jail. Wish to avoid this? Learn to grapple.

7) When you get to jail and you dont want to give up your fruitcup and your sugar packets guess what? Your fighting in a small place. Learn to grapple.

8) When you got to get with a bunch of your friends and deal with some shitbag that has it comming he's gonna run. Learn to grapple. then he wont get away.

9) They brought a stick. Close the gap. Learn to grapple. Stick is useless. See Dog Brothers for more reference.

10) Do I really need a reason number 10?

Streetfighting needs grappling. Period

Grappling is part of a complete balanced breakfest. I dont care what kind. To be a good fighter, sport or street, you must train all ranges.

**SifuJason** · Posted On: 2/20/2007 7:38pm

Originally Posted by bornsceptic

When you say a kick to the knee, what exactly are you referring to? Thai style round kicks? Front kick to kneecap? Either?

Depends on the angle. Ideally, if I want to completely disable/cripple someone, it would be a side kick at a 45-degree angle assuming the target is open. Front kicks aren't as effective, but a Thai round kick can also work, although it's easier to counter.

**SifuJason** · Posted On: 2/20/2007 7:40pm

Originally Posted by Antifa

I'm going to spend a little time on this and then go back to work. There may be follow up later.

I used to agree with many of the things said on this thread, in theory. Then I learned some and more importantly, I applied my actual real life experience to theory. Hence Praxis.

If you are going to be a street fighter, and I mean a street fighter not a one dimensional bar fighter, grappling training is essenstial

If you are going to deal with multiple attackers, grappling training is essential.

If you are going to be ONE of the Multiple Attackers, grappling training is essential.

Reasons:

1) If you dont want to go to the ground, you need to train to throw people and train to not be thrown on the fucking ground

2) If you do go to the ground you want to break the hold and get up.

3) If you are forced to go to the ground you want to win there.

4) If you get thrown on the hard ass pavement mayhaps you better be up on your breakfalls and not blowing that part of your training off because you know that "stuff" already.

5) If you deal with multiple attackers, one is going to grab you so his friends can beat on you. How do avoid this? Learn to fucking grapple.

6) At the end of every streetfight the authorities arrive. If you are still there guess what? The cops are going to grapple you and take you to jail. Wish to avoid this? Learn to grapple.

7) When you get to jail and you dont want to give up your fruitcup and your sugar packets guess what? Your fighting in a small place. Learn to grapple.

8) When you got to get with a bunch of your friends and deal with some shitbag that has it comming he's gonna run. Learn to grapple. then he wont get away.

9) They brought a stick. Close the gap. Learn to grapple. Stick is useless. See Dog Brothers for more reference.

10) Do I really need a reason number 10?

Streetfighting needs grappling. Period

Grappling is part of a complete balanced breakfest. I dont care what kind. To be a good fighter, sport or street, you must train all ranges.

I, and most others, never said grappling training wasn't neccesary. My position is quite the opposite really. Rather I said using my grappling as my primary method of streetfighting is not a smart move, and that as a general policy I would rather punch someone than armbar them.